Beta-rejection. (intellectual vent)

[Luke Skywalker]

If there is a term 'Anti-Player', than that's probably me. I tend to portray myself in a more negative light or say things where I'd likely turn-off a woman, or not portray myself as a man with relationship material.

 

If I am genuine, I''ll portray myself as insincere.

If I am serious, I'll portray myself as casual.

 

Am I framing my own rejections or am I nuts? Maybe both.

[HealingHandsWarmHeart]

Luke...

 

you seem like a such a nice guy and it's shame this girl isn't taking your advances...but from what you've told me on the post...i just think she isn't interested..she may not feel a spark. It doesn't mean you said something wrong or it's you ... it just means for her...she wants to remain platonic.

 

As far as anti-player ..i think you should be honest..that's the best policy. i think you are afraid to put it out there (that you want a relationship) ...there is nothing wrong with wanting a relationship..and if that person isn't interested..then so be it...it's not a reflection on you- it just means they aren't interested. So you move on..and you give it to someone who WILL want it....

[CarnelianButterfly]

See that's the thing, a good player knows how to appeal to women and portray themselves in such a way that they are genuine and use a woman. Someone who doesn't have a clue, or may even be sincere, has to put up with the damage control from prior players and have a negative frame like this one to put up with - either that or are never taken seriously as a man in the first place while the player get's the girl. That's why it's a losing battle all the time.

I think it maybe that you aren't getting girls because you idolize people who use women. You frame of mind is rather unsettling that you talk about doing damage control when it seems like your just jealous you're not the one causing the damage.

 

Do you have any respect for women? Or are you just trying to psych yourself up to go out and dupe women into sleeping with you?

[Luke Skywalker]

Luke...

 

you seem like a such a nice guy and it's shame this girl isn't taking your advances...but from what you've told me on the post...i just think she isn't interested..she may not feel a spark. It doesn't mean you said something wrong or it's you ... it just means for her...she wants to remain platonic.

 

Yeah, nice guys always lose out to players and get fed bullcrap by girls. Perhaps part of the friendzone contingent. I do not want to remain platonic with her at this time and am going to move on in life - because it represents rejection. I think it's unhealthy for me to remain in a pleutonic relationship with someone I like, especially given the fact I've never been in a relationship before in my life - it's toxic and should be avoided, especially with her new anti-men attitudes. If I had a gilfriend in the past or some experience, or really didn't like the girl, then it wouldn't be so bad. It's like salt water when you are thirsty.

 

As far as anti-player ..i think you should be honest..that's the best policy. i think you are afraid to put it out there (that you want a relationship) ...there is nothing wrong with wanting a relationship..and if that person isn't interested..then so be it...it's not a reflection on you- it just means they aren't interested. So you move on..and you give it to someone who WILL want it....

 

Yup.

[Luke Skywalker]

I think it maybe that you aren't getting girls because you idolize people who use women. You frame of mind is rather unsettling that you talk about doing damage control when it seems like your just jealous you're not the one causing the damage.

 

Do you have any respect for women? Or are you just trying to psych yourself up to go out and dupe women into sleeping with you?

 

I've written 400 posts about this subject and wanting a relationship with this girl. How could you say I am not sincere? That is like totally unfair.

 

Am I jealous. Yup. I'm jealous she didn't choose me, and upset she was never honest with me about having other guys 'of interest' or relationships. Hey, did I feel 'duped' when she told me she was interested in me, sincere, and that she had no other relationships or interest in any other guy? Sure I felt duped.

[Luke Skywalker]

I'm drawing conclusion to this thread by bring up what is known as the 'Soap Opera' contingent. That is beta-rejections are actually formulated 'soap opera' dramas. Due to the lure of good Soap Opera TV shows, or movies, getting a natural entertainment high by watching a real life soap opera first hand is entertainment. All beta-rejections have this feature. High intensitiy dramatic effect causing a 'soap opera effect'.

 

Hence, the beta-rejections may be more subtle subconscious motivations leading up to the appetite or lure of dramatic soap opera - and are a set-up of characters. Often me being the losing one. They are not to be taken seriously. Life is a big Hollywood Soap Opera. Director says 'Next". Director says lookign for new 'actress' for me, she will star in a later production. Ok, everyone back to work.

 

 

Did I like the drama of everything, and the high intensitiy feelings it produced in me, or saw around, sure - that's all part of the Soap Opera. Good entertainment.

[CarnelianButterfly]

You never answered my question though, do you actually respect women or are you just trying to sleep with them?

[Luke Skywalker]

You never answered my question though, do you actually respect women or are you just trying to sleep with them?

 

But I have answered your question, I wrote 400 posts about wanting to have a relationship with the subject girl and got upset because I was ignored while she went for a player and has not gotten over him, making webpages and writing songs. When girls act in a way like that, it causes me to lose respect because it sort of cheapens things. When I read books, like "The Game by Neil Strauss, and see respectable woman fall for players, while the good/nice guy is ignored" that too lowers my respect.

 

For the record, I do not believe in pre-maritial sex and have a moderate conviction about it - 50/50 chance I'll follow through given an opportunity, and believe in the maritial institution. So, in a sense, I would like to marry and start a family in a proper way if I were to ever sleep with a woman. Do, I want to experience sex, and/or have a sex drive, of course I do. I still dont think you understand who you are talking to. I'm like a 14 year old inexperienced virgin boy in a 30 y/o body.

 

Remember, you are talking to a 30 y/o inexperienced virgin - I am not a player. I cant shoot straight, heck, I cant even shoot, if that's what you mean - I'm totally harmless. I do concede that my idealisation of players may not be healthy, but unfortunately, real-life reinforcements do not help either.

[Luke Skywalker]

Yes, that would be the trajedy. A webpage written by a girl who got burned by a player ironically seduces Luke Skywalker to the dark-side of the force.

 

The Beta-rejection is nothing other than a cleaver design by the Sith to lure yonge Skywalker into the dark-side and become a player. The books were also planted, as were websites, such as sosuave, and mASF.

 

Yes, I'm indeed seduced. Let's hope I stay on the right side of the fence and not be a Player's apprentice.

[HealingHandsWarmHeart]

I can't help you with that...i'm not a big star wars fan. lol..but if we are talking about the girl....not princess leah...then i would say that you are doing the right thing by establishing no contact.

 

You are really an interesting fella... i think you are going to be fine! lol

[AntiLove_SuperStar]

To be simplistic, I think you get too hung up on specific girls too easy...you are over analysing it too much...and ..well, that's pretty much it!

 

I'm not being intentionally cruel, but I didn't get an undesirably long backlist of ex's by dwelling on it so much. I was just . . . I just lived. Not lived well, but I just lived, vividly, and people love it. Don't think. If you must think, think of Philosophy, or Global Warming.

[Luke Skywalker]

For those of you who are not familiar with the Star Wars saga, the Sith is a term for the Emperior Palpitine with his apprentice Darth Vadar, formally Anakin Skywalker. Both the Jedi and the Sith had an order of rank where lower ranks were known as apprentices.

 

Due to the powerful acting seen in the Star Wars saga, music, and adventure in this science fiction movie, analogies are often made. In particularly Star Wars III, Revenge of the Sith, which chronicals Anakin Skywalker's seduction by Palpitine into the dark side to become the notorious Darth Vadar - that ultimately turns back to Anakin Skywalker and destroys the Emperor. Luke Skywalker is conveniantly chosen - just as a random character. He doesn't actually change to the dark side of the force in the movies, but he is seduced.

 

Although I see these movies infrequently, or once in a blue moon, the characters are very powerful and are sometimes used as emotional buffers or coping strategies to understand myself and situations around to put a sort of 'entertaining spin' on things.

 

Does it look like I am being recruited into something, like there was some hidden plot in my life to destroy all my faith in women and turn me into some sort of heartless player, yes, it looks like there is a hidden agenda to do just that.

[Luke Skywalker]

To be simplistic, I think you get too hung up on specific girls too easy...you are over analysing it too much...and ..well, that's pretty much it!

 

 

Specific girl-type: Indian or of Indian descent. Any woman of that racial sub-type must be constantly on guard. No problem with woman of any other races, and such has NEVER happened when dealing with women of other races.

 

My parents tell me to stay away from Indian women. My dad thinks their culture is closed, my mom says that back in Trinidad (Black/Indian majority groups) INdians - you never know where you stand with an Indian. People say they are the most racist - but I find myself attracted to Indian women or of Indian descent - even if they are fat.

 

Specific characteristic: Spirit-connection - sort of activates a 'drama chip'.

 

This is as much information so far on subject.

[HealingHandsWarmHeart]

Luke,

 

Are you sure you only watch star wars every blue moon? lol

 

ok, so what i've gathered is that you are suggesting that this girl was sent by the dark force to convert you into a player?

 

Luke... I am your fathe....wait no.... that's what i'm trying to say...what i'm trying to say is that its very dangerous to put things, situations and people into categories...because you will already have a preconceived notion regarding the events and the situation..every situation, person and event is unique in its own way.

 

I think this girl simply was not interested. I think you misread her signals and now you are overthinking and trying to find a way that it's not you....when you just have to simply tell yourself...she wasn't interested...move on.... on to the next. That's all...nothing else.

[Luke Skywalker]

Luke,

 

Are you sure you only watch star wars every blue moon? lol

 

ok, so what i've gathered is that you are suggesting that this girl was sent by the dark force to convert you into a player?

 

Not directly - in a symbolic sense. I'm typcasting myself into a role in that social dynamic as an inferior party on a three party dynamic. This is typically people (i.e. in Neil Strauss' the Game) choose to become players.

 

It may be a woman a guy was going out with, university girl, not a casual woman at all with substance, and the guy is taking her on dates, giving her flowers, he thinks she is interested in him - at least she says she is and is going out with him in a relationship, and then falls for a player who comes out of the blue, and forgets his name when aroused by the alpha male - xyz, oh him, he's just a friend.

 

That record was written in the book by Neil Strauss. The guy that was the 'friend' converted and became a player that same night that girl did that to him and broke up with her. When a guy gets tired of always being typcasted into an inferior role of a social dynamic, it serves as a recruitment force to being a player.

 

Luke... I am your fathe....wait no.... that's what i'm trying to say...what i'm trying to say is that its very dangerous to put things, situations and people into categories...because you will already have a preconceived notion regarding the events and the situation..every situation, person and event is unique in its own way.

 

I like your alias and I like your spirit and can see that you are really trying. You are 'healing hands' and you have a 'warm heart' indeed. But your hands on my head and get rid of the bad thoughts I have. lol

 

Seriously, the social dynamic - the beta-rejection

 

I think this girl simply was not interested. I think you misread her signals and now you are overthinking and trying to find a way that it's not you....when you just have to simply tell yourself...she wasn't interested...move on.... on to the next. That's all...nothing else.

 

I understand what you are saying and know you mean well. I have 'officially' moved on. There is 'emotional fallout' arising from the 'Player's Premise' being reinforcec in this specific dynamic.

[Luke Skywalker]

The Beta-Rejection has a new name called 'Player's Premise', and I will no longer refer to it as a Beta-rejection any further since they seem to be seductive scenerios of recruitment to be a player - because those instances undermine faith in women and portray players as being rewarded while 'friends' being punished in dynamics, and encourages every guy to be a player.

 

There is also the Player's Trajedy - which I have read about - where a player goes with so many woman, and is just interested in booty, that they miss out on some good relationships where the woman may have really cared about them. Some good players claim that althought hey have bagged many woman, they still have not married and started a family, and they have lost the women that they really cared about.

 

Both concepts are at the opposite end of a coin.

[Luke Skywalker]

I did a further analysis and would like to say that this girl was prepared to stay with me for a full day on July 1st, while I only had an 'hour' available as I had some other engagement with my parents. If I skipped that engagement and stook with her instead, I'd likely have had a full day with her.

It probably didn't jive well with her that I cut a free day with her short and sort of messed up in hindsite.

 

But, due to social anxiety issues I was uncomfortable staying with her for too long because I'm not used to being around woman. In my mind, I like to be around woman, but in actuality, I'm nervous around them. A point that I perhaps should tell everyone that goes out with me so they'll understand if I'm a bit too nervous or have a tendency to cut a date short.

[Luke Skywalker]

I'm no longer upset with this girl or think I got beta-rejected if she was virtually thowing herself at me on July 1st. She was in a funny state of mind, and was probably put her guards down a little to low. The fact is, it appears she gave me a chance and I no longer resent her and am feeling better and no longer hate her for 'never giving me a chance and feeding me bullcrap' or have a resentment general for women for failing to give me a chance while choosing players.

 

Cleared. Horray - I feel good, I had a chance on July 1st - it's not ABSOLUTE rejection - I'm just not fast enough for these girls and like to go slow.

[Luke Skywalker]

Viva Italia. I'm going after Italian girls now, I'm losing interest with Indian girls. After all, I'm not Indian myself, I'm Italian, my dad is from Italy.

The women usually cook good food, and have a great family and are typically stable character wise. But I'm also half Black - and may not be accepted in some Italian families due to my other race. Oh well.

[Luke Skywalker]

Ok, this girl virtually THREW herself on me on July 1st, she was too fast for me, I wasn't ready, she went with a guy who was and I'm being a loser about it, devised a beta-rejection concept and went hay-wire when I found out.

 

I'm in such a good mood that I'm going to give out recommendations to most people who contributed positively to this thread.

[Luke Skywalker]

A poster carnelianbutterfly had asked me earlier if I had 'respected' women as based on the content of this thread, it appeared otherwise. It had me thinking. Respect for women is a function of how women are portrayed by the media, movies, and in real life in terms of conduct. If someone portrays themselves poorly, then they will be perceived poor.

 

Now, I've done some reconstructions of carnelianbutterfly's suggestions, and thought about some movie, and can see her point, through these movies or shows. I like the personality of the leading actress in Pirates of the Caribbean I and II - I have to research her name - think she also acted in V-for Vandetta. Also in Bend it like Beckham. I like the actress' character portrayal in the movies.

 

I thought of her personality and another character similar to hers to try and comprehend or appreciate this suggestion. The characters on such are strong, confident and not ashamed of being upfront, and this helps construct a positive portrayal of women.

 

The characters I have been hung over in real life have been weak and have been a disappointment, which is why I need to think about strong character portrayals in movies to buffer.

 

However, I will say, that when a woman writes a website complaining that she was lied to and used by a player, while leading me on, that is a weak character portrayal. For a woman to earn respect, despite the fact she may be with other guys, past or present, she has exhibit a strong character.

 

When women get turned off because I touch a nerve, rather than stand up for themselves and try to earn respect, then that is there problem.

 

Let me reconstruct on the examples of a few girl's I meet this year and how I felt disappointed by their character portrayals:

 

- subject girl in question of thread: lead me on, was opaque about her 'real-self' or real-life, and then makes a website that portrays herself in a very negative light. Respect on this portrayl. None.

---> But she tried to be my friend despite this problem on August 1st, and still saw me without shutting the door. And tried hard not to hurt my feelings when we did meet face to face. Respect on this portrayal:

Ok, didn't see that angle. BUT NOBODY HERE BROUGHT THAT UP. But then again, I didn't give enough information for people to bring it up.

 

Can I reconcile both ideas - I'm unsure.

 

- another girl I meet before from Bradford, rode an hour and a half to see me. Claimed she got offended when I asked her how many men she slept with. She shut me out afterwards. Respect on this portrayl: None.

Why: She could not stand up to me - she just reteated and sent that email.

If she rebuffed the question and joked with me and said, 'does that really matter', then get offended - respect would have gone up.

 

In other words, I respect women with strong and confident characters that aren't trigger happy to dismiss. Characters, like that actress.

 

That's what I think. If anyone is offended by this - then you have a weak character as far as I'm concerned and I dont care, but if you stand up to me without resorting to insults, I'll listen.

[Dako]

That's what I think. If anyone is offended by this - then you have a weak character as far as I'm concerned and I dont care, but if you stand up to me without resorting to insults, I'll listen.

 

Seems like you just insulted anyone you've offended with a pre-emptive strike, yet you prefer not to be insulted yourself.

[CarnelianButterfly]

That's what I think. If anyone is offended by this - then you have a weak character as far as I'm concerned and I dont care, but if you stand up to me without resorting to insults, I'll listen.

I happen to think its weak and insulting to say that people that believe in their convictions enough to take offense are weak.

 

You're bashing women in general based on the observations you've made of a handful of women and women in fictitious representations of the media. Half of the population of this planet is female, that means over 3 billion people would have to fall into those caricatures of women. It doesn't work that way. You misinterpreted signals and obvious interest of women and by your own admission are unskilled in these matters, but you blame the woman. Take responsibility for your actions.

 

The woman you have railed so much about in this thread was probably keeping her options open because of the lack of interest you showed. She suggested a long date and you rebuffed it with a severely truncated version, how do you not see that as a sign of disinterest on your part. You had 3 dates in a 3 month period, 2 of which were coffee, coffee is not a serious date, that's a date that you go on to break the ice. You can't expect exclusivity when you yourself have not put much effort into the relationship. You can't blame women for your dating mishaps, there are two parties involved, you and her. Whenever you point your finger at someone there are always 3 pointing right back at you.

[Aurian]

I know I am feeling rather offended after reading this thread. Carnelian Butteryfly brings up the things that I was offended by in her posts - that you expect a lot out of your dates while not having exclusivity or showing a lot of interest in them. That a girl is damaged goods and not good enough for you anymore if she is not a virgin or dated before.

 

And you asked a girl who went out of her way to see you how many men she slept with? Was this a first date? If so, she was right to be offended, because it seemed like you were not interested in knowing her - just some number so you could make a value judgement on her based on it. You came out seeming like a creep. I think most women would shut you out after that.

[melrich]

This thread is starting to get personal and off track.