I have a career related question.

[Kwothe28]

21 minutes ago, DarkCh0c0 said:

My argument is that it's not so questionable. People leave jobs for better ones all the time.

How my late mom used to say: If everybody else jumped off the bridge, would you?

Its funny to me that you argue how its not questionable. But you admit it would hurt her chances if she said anything about it to different company. Which proves that its not really something that reflects good on her. In any case. In case of her current company nore in case of her maybe future one. Again, if she hasnt accepted anything I would have different opinion. But she was literally hired by company and accepted that. Even passed fingerprints and everything. Sure, she can leave. Just dont think it reflects good on her as a worker. From ethics side of things.

[DarkCh0c0]

7 minutes ago, Kwothe28 said:

Its funny to me that you argue how its not questionable. But you admit it would hurt her chances if she said anything about it to different company. Which proves that its not really something that reflects good on her

That is true. Yes.

[Batya33]

2 hours ago, DarkCh0c0 said:

My argument is that it's not so questionable. People leave jobs for better ones all the time. Whether that happens early or later in their hiring, it doesn't natter. If anything, by leaving them early, she'd reduced her involvement, training and cost for the company. Better leave one month in, than six or seven later.

Now morally, I suppose this is up to personal preference for sure. I understand your stance.

And also to your point as Yogacat explained she really is not an official employee yet of the first company. I worked with someone who left a month in because I think his former employer wooed him back? Ironically we had mutual friends at the time and years later turned out my husband knew him too lol.  Truthfully it's not easy on the other employees -that person is there to take on some of the workload, we're also helping him adjust but.... I understood!

 

[DarkCh0c0]

6 minutes ago, Batya33 said:

And also to your point as Yogacat explained she really is not an official employee yet of the first company. I worked with someone who left a month in because I think his former employer wooed him back? Ironically we had mutual friends at the time and years later turned out my husband knew him too lol.  Truthfully it's not easy on the other employees -that person is there to take on some of the workload, we're also helping him adjust but.... I understood!

 

Yea. Is it ideal? No. But it happens. We gotta look out for our best interests.

My old team once hired an executive chief compliance officer at a big corp. He came in 3 weeks, then resigned because he received an offer from a flagship international airline. Is it ideal? No. But we were happy for him and thought who wouldn't want to work there?! We also made it a point to keep a door open for him in case he'd changed his mind. Recruitment is tough, but no hard feelings.

Now if you tell the other company that you already got an offer, this is where there could be or not an issue. It could land positively or negatively. I've seen both cases and it's controversial. If yogacat interviews while not even on her first day, then there is no big deal. She doesn't even need to mention it. Before the first day, anything can happen.

[Batya33]

12 minutes ago, DarkCh0c0 said:

Yea. Is it ideal? No. But it happens. We gotta look out for our best interests.

My old team once hired an executive chief compliance officer at a big corp. He came in 3 weeks, then resigned because he received an offer from a flagship international airline. Is it ideal? No. But we were happy for him and thought who wouldn't want to work there?! We also made it a point to keep a door open for him in case he'd changed his mind. Recruitment is tough, but no hard feelings.

Now if you tell the other company that you already got an offer, this is where there could be or not an issue. It could land positively or negatively. I've seen both cases and it's controversial. If yogacat interviews while not even on her first day, then there is no big deal. She doesn't even need to mention it. Before the first day, anything can happen.

Yes and in her specific situation she is not employed there and I find their behavior a bit lame as far as really she's supposed to be in limbo -this long?

[rainbowsandroses]

3 hours ago, Kwothe28 said:

Again, if she hasnt accepted anything I would have different opinion. But she was literally hired by company and accepted that. Even passed fingerprints and everything.

@Kwothe28yoga has not passed fingerprints/background check yet. They have given her an offer pending the results of that. 

They told her should she not pass, the offer could be withdrawn, which is standard in the U.S.

She accepted this "tentative" offer pending results of fingerprints/background check but has not technically been hired yet. 

It might be different in U.K. but again this is standard here.

That is the issue yoga is struggling with.

Since she has not been given the "final" offer by first company yet, and may NOT, should she forfeit other opportunities?

She has a fourth interview scheduled with another company, should she decline because of a tentative offer she was given pending results of a background check?

Yes she accepted the tentative offer but it's still all up in the air, the final offer may never come. 

And what's the delay?  Results of a background check take a couple of days, typically.  They have scheduled orientation next week which is extremely odd since they haven't even made the final offer yet!

I don't know it's a tough call but I see nothing wrong with yoga exploring other opportunities while awaiting be given the "final" offer by the first company.

Until that "final" offer comes in and yoga accepts that, anything can happen and if she declines the fourth interview with other company, she may end up with NO job.

Here in the US, it's not uncommon to let a prospective employer or current employer know you have received another job offer.  But you have not accepted it yet.

I have done this, I created a thread about it and it resulted in being given a 25% salary increase by my current employer at the time. Because they really wanted me to say. 

It's best to tell them you have NOT actually accepted it yet, even a tentative offer pending results of background check, because that does not look good.

Just say you received the offer but haven't decided yet and that you're very interested in working for them.

It motivates a company to make a decision assuming they really want you. 

[rainbowsandroses]

1 hour ago, Batya33 said:

Yes and in her specific situation she is not employed there and I find their behavior a bit lame as far as really she's supposed to be in limbo -this long?

^^Exactly Bat.  Like what's the hold up?

Do they want her or not?  Like I said results of a background check typically take a couple of days. 

 

 

[Kwothe28]

7 minutes ago, rainbowsandroses said:

Kwothe28yoga has not passed fingerprints/background check yet. They have given her an offer pending the results of that. 

They told her should she not pass, the offer could be withdrawn, which is standard in the U.S.

She accepted this "tentative" offer pending results of fingerprints/background check but has not technically been hired yet. 

Correct me if I am wrong, but that just means they have the right not to hire her if she doesnt pass it. Not that she is not hired. 

 

17 minutes ago, rainbowsandroses said:

Here in the US, it's not uncommon to let a prospective employer or current employer know you have received another job offer.  But you have not accepted it yet.

I have done this, I created a thread about it and it resulted in being given a 25% salary increase by my current employer at the time. Because they really wanted me to say. 

You were already with the employee for a longer time. You didnt accepted the offer and then in the middle of hiring hope on and said “Yeah, you know, I have an interview for something different”. Dont really think your employees would appreciate that. They offered you a raise because you were already working there and wanted to keep you as a good worker.

Again, I am not saying she cant explore her options. But that if we look at the ethics of things, it isnt really most ethical thing around. Dark already admitted that. Again, if you all think this is something that will go in her favor, why do you all advise her to not tell her current and maybe future employees the truth?

Yes it’s something that happens. No, its not really something that will go in her favor from the ethics standpoint. Her currently employee(well if she passes all) would think she will jump the board as soon as little better offer gets there. Her maybe future one would think its unprofessional that she accepted one offer and still does interviews. Again this isnt the situation where she isnt happy with one employee and wants to change job and sends CVs and does interviews. This is a situation where she gave her word, accepted an offer, but still does the interview process for different company. Yes, she can do that. No, it really isnt something she should brag about. And you all know that. You yourself said that before you changed your tune.

[rainbowsandroses]

54 minutes ago, Kwothe28 said:

Correct me if I am wrong, but that just means they have the right not to hire her if she doesnt pass it. Not that she is not hired. 

From reading yoga's posts, the offer they made was contingent upon yoga passing the background check.  If she doesn't pass, the offer could be withdrawn.

So technically they have not hired her yet.  

That is my understanding of it.

54 minutes ago, Kwothe28 said:

its not really something that will go in her favor from the ethics standpoint. Her currently employee(well if she passes all) would think she will jump the board as soon as little better offer gets there. Her maybe future one would think its unprofessional that she accepted one offer and still does interviews.

I 100% agree with you here^^.  I stated that. Especially bolded. 

It's OK to tell a prospective employer that you have received another offer but that you have NOT accepted it yet. 

That's the difference.

For just the reasons you stated. An employer might think you'll do the same to them, accept an offer but jump ship when you receive a better or more lucrative opportunity.

They won't trust you!  And loyalty is a huge deal to most employers!

So simply say you received another offer but haven't accepted it yet and are very interested in working for them. That's fair 

Often times during an interview a prospective employer has asked ME if I've received other offers.  When it happens and I have received other offers (but obviously not accepted yet), I am truthful.

Looking back, whenever I have received a tentative offer contingent upon passing a background check, there is nothing yet to accept!

I only accept when the final offer is made in writing which has not occurred yet in yoga's case.

Typically it's by letter for my signature.  THAT is my acceptance. 

In yoga's case, she has not received a final offer, so anything can happen.  Until she receives a final offer in writing with start date, salary etc she's still in limbo.

I think yoga's original post was a bit misleading because she stated she had been hired (and she accepted) so I assumed they had made her a final offer after background check cleared etc. 

That is why I originally responded as I did.

In subsequent posts she stated it was an offer contingent upon passing fingerprint/background check and that the offer could be rescinded.

Which isn't really an offer at all. It's a tentative offer.

Again that is my understanding of it.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[yogacat]

I appreciate all the comments.

Just to clarify, I was given an offer letter of employment which is an invitation to enter into a contract after orientation. It was not an official letter (or contract) of employment. The first company pushed back my orientation date because my fingerprints had not cleared yet. My fingerprints/background check did finally clear, before the 4th interview was scheduled but I was still worried since my orientation was delayed. 

I had accepted the first job offer before hearing back from the second company because I thought they would take a little longer to make a decision and I did not want to risk losing the opportunity. I didn't expect to hear back from them so soon after. I was also in the middle of interviewing with different companies during my job search. 

The job offer letter allows candidates to evaluate the terms of employment before accepting the position.

At this point, I feel I just need to turn down the 4th interview. It's not ideal, but I don't not want to go through with a 4th interview knowing I have already accepted a job offer for potential employment. I still am required to attend orientation and once that's complete they will give me an official contract of employment.

[rainbowsandroses]

2 hours ago, yogacat said:

My fingerprints/background check did finally clear before the 4th interview was scheduled but I was still worried since my orientation was delayed. 

Bolded, thanks for clarifying.

The way I had read your posts it sounded like they had not cleared yet and you were still waiting to hear back about it and in the meantime they scheduled the orientation.

And if they did NOT clear, the offer could be withdrawn. 

This is what concerned you, rightfully so.

2 hours ago, yogacat said:

At this point, I feel I just need to turn down the 4th interview. It's not ideal, but I don't not want to go through with a 4th interview knowing I have already accepted a job offer for potential employment. I still am required to attend orientation and once that's complete they will give me an official contract of employment.

^^Given the background check did actually clear and you were presented with what appears to be a final offer which you accepted, I 100% agree.

Good luck.

 

 

[DarkCh0c0]

2 hours ago, yogacat said:

I appreciate all the comments.

Just to clarify, I was given an offer letter of employment which is an invitation to enter into a contract after orientation. It was not an official letter (or contract) of employment. The first company pushed back my orientation date because my fingerprints had not cleared yet. My fingerprints/background check did finally clear, before the 4th interview was scheduled but I was still worried since my orientation was delayed. 

I had accepted the first job offer before hearing back from the second company because I thought they would take a little longer to make a decision and I did not want to risk losing the opportunity. I didn't expect to hear back from them so soon after. I was also in the middle of interviewing with different companies during my job search. 

The job offer letter allows candidates to evaluate the terms of employment before accepting the position.

At this point, I feel I just need to turn down the 4th interview. It's not ideal, but I don't not want to go through with a 4th interview knowing I have already accepted a job offer for potential employment. I still am required to attend orientation and once that's complete they will give me an official contract of employment.

Alright!

Have a great first week and congrats on your new role!! 😊 🩷

[yogacat]

3 hours ago, DarkCh0c0 said:

Alright!

Have a great first week and congrats on your new role!! 😊 🩷

Thanks.🙂

I talked to some mentors through school and elsewhere and they said I should do the 4th interview because it really should be about securing what is right for me in terms of what would suit me best. I have had a habit in the past of putting employers in front of myself. Maybe that's why I struggled with this process.