Have the conversation?

[MCsquared]

It's been about four months. We live in different states so definitely more than an hour or two drive. He asked me out after exchanging like 2 messages but I hadn't felt comfortable at that time. And he was just passing through my town at that time. Since he's been home he hasn't mentioned it again and had been on the road again. I feel like I should be having this convo with him instead of posting on a site..but I'm scared of the coming on too strong/pressuring him vibes and what his answer would be. 

I think I'll just hang back at this point and see what unfolds. 

[rainbowsandroses]

12 minutes ago, SophiaG said:

That's a fair question to ask at at point in any situation IMO. People need to know what they need to know in order to properly proceed. Wanting an answer is not the same as wanting to force someone into a relationship - "I dunno" is an answer too and even that can give OP more information than she has now.

I would not worry about the other person feeling "pressured" and wanting to back out if a relationship was previously on the table. If a simple question like that makes them want to bail, then they are no good for you either way!

 

Totally cool SophiaG, I do things differently which I won't get into since it's not my thread.

And as I said it's always led to LTR, I was also engaged twice and married once.  Long stories, but again not my thread.

JMO but I don't think there's "one right way" to do things, we all follow our own path leading to the same thing - LTR and commitment if that's what they both want. 

Using common sense, good judgment and keeping eyes and ears wide open and observing.

That said I did just ask OP how long they've been chatting with no meet because it does make a difference imo.

 

 

 

[MCsquared]

My last question I'll ask for advice on....last night when I joked with him about suffering through the call...and then he told me how much he values the friendship etc...I said ok I'll think about sharing my dinner with you then (we talked about dinner while on the phone)..and then said I think he'd be fine handling the job, that he's very capable but thank you for saying that...do you think that was too flippant a response or I should have thanked him for opening up and sharing that? It isn't easy for him to say things like that and that he needs people. He's very independent. Feel like saying it now is too weird and after the fact. Just wondering...

[MissCanuck]

You're over-thinking this. 

I would cut it back to basics: if you two don't even live in the same state, how feasible is it that you'd be able to see each very often? Are you able to travel? Have the time and monetary resources to do so? Does he? 

[rainbowsandroses]

1 hour ago, MCsquared said:

I didn't think I was coming off as desperate...just interacting with someone I want a relationship with and wanted to keep guiding it forward to the next steps. I guess I want clarity on what exactly this is or isn't. 

^^Lots of *I*'s in there.  

I didn't think I was coming off as desperate.

I want a relationship.

I guess I want clarity.

Whatever your intentions and what you think about your words/behavior and how HE interprets your words/behavior can often be two entirely different things. 

For example, you seeking clarity about "where this is going" before you have ever even met, in HIS eyes may be viewed as desperate and pushing. 

It's important to be cognizant of how our words and behavior are being interpreted by the other person. 

Again, it's often quite different from how we ourselves see it and view our own behavior.

I agree with @MissCanuckyou are so overthinking this, and hate to say but it almost sounds like you're obsessed or close to. 

Lean back.  Relax. 

Or better yet after 4 months, think about this realistically and consider if a relationship, the type you want, is even doable with this guy. 

You don't sound compatible with respect to your wants or needs. 

I'm sorry. 

 

 

[MCsquared]

I'm gonna lean back and just cool it for a bit.

But, just so I know, do you think I should text him about the convo last night? 

[MissCanuck]

1 hour ago, MCsquared said:

he told me how much he values the friendship etc...I said ok I'll think about sharing my dinner with you then (we talked about dinner while on the phone)..and then said I think he'd be fine handling the job

I don't understand this - handling what job? 

[SophiaG]

8 minutes ago, MCsquared said:

I'm gonna lean back and just cool it for a bit.

But, just so I know, do you think I should text him about the convo last night? 

I don't see anything that needs to be addressed further if you meant the convo about "suffer through your phone call." But as rainbowsandroses said everyone has their own style and clearly you talk/joke/flirt in a different way from what I would do. I would just encourage you to value your time and attention more and look elsewhere if what you want is a relationship.

[yogacat]

Agree with others.

Asking where is this going and having not met yet IRL are 2 things which do not go well together.

He mentioned meeting because he was "passing through." Sometimes people on dating apps will have travel plans and they will reach out or match with people in the places they travel to. 

You have not met. Be mindful of how much you invest emotionally with someone you’ve never met. 

I think if he's local or you're able to meet it would help. 

[MCsquared]

16 minutes ago, MissCanuck said:

I don't understand this - handling what job? 

The job requires him to travel a lot...I don't really do anything except have phone calls and texts with him. Maybe just the keeping him company aspect he means? I said that I'm sure he'd have been fine with the job and he's capable but appreciate him saying what he said. 

I guess it was a stupid comment to make. I'm overanalyzing it too much I know and I said what I said but feel bad if it was taken wrong. 

[SophiaG]

58 minutes ago, yogacat said:

Sometimes people on dating apps will have travel plans and they will reach out or match with people in the places they travel to. 

Ugh, I hate when a match is like "in [your city] for the weekend - wanna hang out?" 🙄

[rainbowsandroses]

56 minutes ago, MCsquared said:

I'm overanalyzing it too much I know and I said what I said but feel bad if it was taken wrong. 

@MCsquared you're walking on eggshells, fearful of saying/doing the "wrong" thing which goes back to what I said earlier, I don't think your natures are compatible although I do understand the attraction.

He seems like a spontaneous type of guy with a jokey, teasing sense of humor. 

On the other hand, you're a planner and don't really get his jokey, teasing style but try to go along with it anyway to appear "cool" or whatever, when in truth, it hurts your feelings!

This will never work @MCsquared; never try to be someone you're not to please a man or anyone, it's disingenuous and will only lead to disappointment and hurt later. 

Honestly I hate to say and I understand why you won't but I think you should let this guy go.

IF you truly were cool with him being jokey and teasing, and tossed him one (or three) back and your banter was genuine and fun with YOU not feeling hurt by it, I would say carry on and play it out!

But that's not what's happening, you're pretending to be cool with it when in truth you're hurt by it!  You admitted as much. 

You're also over-analyzing and dissecting every conversation to the point it's unhealthy and obsessive. 

I know you won't end it, not sure what it will take, you seem so scared of his reaction.

But if you really do need clarity right now on whether or not he even wants to meet, don't ask, simply mention that you will be in his area and when and gauge his reaction.

Are you able to do that, visit his area and meet him?  

There is no rule that states he has to visit you or be the one to suggest meeting. 

Stop diddling around, this could go on for years if you allow it and I thought his comment about waiting 13 years was quite telling!  That may NOT have been a joke! 

Frankly he sounds like a bit of an avoidant and prefers online interactions to real life dating experiences, it's not uncommon.

They also love long distance interactions as it gives them a built in excuse to avoid meeting. 

Jmo and good luck whatever you decide. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Tinydance]

I think you've posted about this situation before? And I think you got a fair bit of advice last time. I mean, that's not to say you can't ask again. The thing is people are sometimes open to different things on dating apps. For example on the dating app OK Cupid there is a list of things you can tick as to what you are looking for. I did actually use to tick both friendship and relationship because I was technically open to friendship. And I did become acquaintances with a few people from dating apps but not close friends. 

As I'm pretty sure I said to you on your previous post, I think largely this guy is lonely. If he travels a lot for work then he obviously spends a lot of time by himself. Because he very likely doesn't know anyone in the places he travels to. So he's enjoying talking to you because he needs company and to pass the time. I think you said in your previous post that you had never video called each other? Have you video called now or still no? 

My guess why he said he just wants to be friends is for a few reasons. It's either because he unfortunately doesn't find you attractive in your online dating profile photos or didn't find you attractive on a video call (if you had one). That's actually not to say that you are not attractive but attraction is subjective. You need what you call chemistry or spark. And when people friend zone someone it's because they like them as a person but they just don't feel that spark. 

Another reason might be that because he travels so much and he doesn't live in your area, he doesn't want to commit to anything romantic. I mean in all fairness you've never actually met or maybe hadn't even video called. So he can't exactly know if he's truly into you. He likes talking to you and gets along with you but he can't be in love with you or something. For that I think he'd need to spend time with you in real life. And I think it's understandable that he's not saying you're together because how can he say that about someone he's never met? Also when people use dating apps, often they'll date a few people until they get serious with someone. So although you might not want to hear this but he could be talking to other women too or seeing other women. And unfortunately he can do that because he said to you that you are just friends. And you've never even kissed or anything like that.

I think it's OK to ask him if it could ever be anything romantic but to be honest I don't think you can get a real answer until you meet. For example I knew someone who had a 1.5 year online relationship with someone in another country. They talked constantly and did video call. So she went to the other country for a few weeks. But when they met in person it just wasn't the same and the other person said they weren't feeling it in real life. So in all honesty I don't think this guy can 100% say if it will or won't be a relationship. Unless he doesn't even find you attractive at all.

If I can be honest, I do think you sabotaged it in the sense that he asked to meet but you didn't meet. And to be honest I don't get that? Like, you're on dating apps to meet people and date. So he asked you out/on a date but you declined? You said you weren't ready but I don't understand why you'd rather keep talking on the phone for four months rather than know him in real life? When I used dating apps, it was actually me who quickly suggested to meet for coffee. I basically asked every guy to meet even though I'm a woman. Because I didn't want to just talk online because why do that? You don't really completely know someone just online and I wanted to know the real them.

[Tinydance]

Also I just wanted to add. I think it's up to us to decide what kind of situations or "situationships" we are OK with. When I was dating I did really want to meet someone for something serious and to start a family and so on. At times I struggled to meet people who wanted something serious in my area so I did also match people in other states and occasionally even in another country. I was open to meeting if there was an actual opportunity to meet. But I was OK with chatting to those people and not being upset if they're talking to someone else or we're not dating. I felt fine about it and I talked to other people as well. 

I think if you're not talking to or dating other guys and you got fixated on THIS guy, then this situation might not be healthy for you. Like, if he was just one guy you speak to and you didn't have feelings for him then you could probably keep it going. But to me it seems this could be a waste of time for you. Like, you're spending hours on the phone with him constantly and you're not talking to anyone else. And for whatever reason he said you're just a friend. If you want more then what are you really getting out of the situation?

Personally I think you just need to go and meet him. That's what I would do. I would want my answer and I'd want it ASAP. If there was an option to meet, I wouldn't continue talking just on the phone. Even if it's a two hour drive, well that's not even that long? Can't you just drive the two hours? 

[SophiaG]

29 minutes ago, Tinydance said:

For example I knew someone who had a 1.5 year online relationship with someone in another country. They talked constantly and did video call. So she went to the other country for a few weeks. But when they met in person it just wasn't the same and the other person said they weren't feeling it in real life.

This is why I never wanted to get in an "online relationship". What a waste of time and energy!

In OP's case I don't think the guy can definitively say there will be romance or relationship but if he's put her solidly in the friendzone he can at least say that (in a more gentle way) and OP can move on in that regard.

16 minutes ago, Tinydance said:

I think if you're not talking to or dating other guys and you got fixated on THIS guy, then this situation might not be healthy for you.

Agree. Sometimes I continue talking with someone I don't meet or don't even want to meet because we have good conversations, but that's just what it is, a pen pal, not a love interest

[yogacat]

1 hour ago, SophiaG said:

Ugh, I hate when a match is like "in [your city] for the weekend - wanna hang out?" 🙄

Yes.

In this case, after exchanging TWO messages, is kind of like saying, hey, I'm hungry, first person that messages me in the area I'm in... (excuse me, maybe I should word that "wanna hang out" woo woo). 🤪

But, then again, there is dating advice floating around out there that tells people to meet up ASAP and even without dating advice per se, some people just prefer meeting up ASAP.

He initially asked you out after exchanging like 2 messages because he was in your area at the time.   

Then again, you did initially say "no" to meeting up...  So, I can see why he may not want to re-extend the invitation. 

The self-deprecatory stuff you're saying to him in jest - about him holding you back for being busy, etc., does come across as passive aggressive... although I suspect it's your anxiety speaking.

My best guess is he is content with the online friendship as is and you don't seem to feel entirely content with the level of where things are at.

You're not dating, there is an online friendship, so I wouldn't ask him to upgrade to a romantic relationship. But, I don't think sitting back on your end shall prove... most efficient either.  Not in the sense where you're going to be happy with the statu quo.

Don't lend your invaluable time if it will only bring some unsatisfactory gratification that you are the capricious catalyst in his life.

[Batya33]

5 hours ago, SophiaG said:

I'm not as strict as Batya33 but typically I won't give a guy more than a week to ask me out after we match

No one ever asked me out and I didn't ask them out -we were strangers planning to meet to see if we should date in the future (and yes I expected him to ask me out after the first meet) so I didn't wait ever. If at the end of the first phone call he didn't suggest meeting I did.  If he wanted to talk again for a specific reason (like he had to cut the call short) that's fine.  

I don't think the OP is friendzoned,  This is a dating app.  He told her early on he doesn't want to meet her for dating purposes but is happy to stay in contact as "friends" but he is advertising himself as single and availalbe to date on a dating app.  So I would take it as a euphemism -he's saying he's happy to be your penpal (and likely gets an ego boost since he knows you want to meet him) and maybe he'll meet you as a plan b, c or d for a one and done hookup.

To me friendzoned is when you date someone and they say let's be friends.  They are not dating.

[Batya33]

1 minute ago, yogacat said:

Ugh, I hate when a match is like "in [your city] for the weekend - wanna hang out?" 

I didn't do that either. I didn't do long distance and I didn't hang out.  I or he arranged to meet in person at a place convenient to us to see if we should go on a date in the future.  I hung out with people I knew who were friends not potential dates.

[Tinydance]

1 minute ago, yogacat said:

Yes.

In this case, after exchanging TWO messages, is kind of like saying, hey, I'm hungry, first person that messages me in the area I'm in... (excuse me, maybe I should word that "wanna hang out" woo woo). 🤪

But, then again, there is dating advice floating around out there that tells people to meet up ASAP and even without dating advice per se, some people just prefer meeting up ASAP.

He initially asked you out after exchanging like 2 messages because he was in your area at the time.   

Then again, you did initially say "no" to meeting up...  So, I can see why he may not want to re-extend the invitation. 

The self-deprecatory stuff you're saying to him in jest - about him holding you back for being busy, etc., does come across as passive aggressive... although I suspect it's your anxiety speaking.

My best guess is he is content with the online friendship as is and you don't seem to feel entirely content with the level of where things are at.

You're not dating, there is an online friendship, so I wouldn't ask him to upgrade to a romantic relationship. But, I don't think sitting back on your end shall prove... most efficient either.  Not in the sense where you're going to be happy with the statu quo.

Don't lend your invaluable time if it will only bring some unsatisfactory gratification that you are the capricious catalyst in his life.

What I don't get though is when people say: "It's too soon to meet, I want to talk more first to get to know you." Meeting someone in person IS talking to them and getting to know them. And whatever you're typing on your phone or computer can be said to them over a meal or drink directly to their face.

[Batya33]

Just now, Tinydance said:

What I don't get though is when people say: "It's too soon to meet, I want to talk more first to get to know you." Meeting someone in person IS talking to them and getting to know them. And whatever you're typing on your phone or computer can be said to them over a meal or drink directly to their face.

Same exact and if I got even a whiff of that or the silly -to me- "friends first" I moved on. 

[yogacat]

35 minutes ago, Tinydance said:

What I don't get though is when people say: "It's too soon to meet, I want to talk more first to get to know you." Meeting someone in person IS talking to them and getting to know them. And whatever you're typing on your phone or computer can be said to them over a meal or drink directly to their face.

That's true.

Albeit for some people they may prefer to establish some kind of rapport or comfort level with someone before putting themselves in a position where they are physically alone with that person. People's initial comfort levels vary.

But you're right that dating is about getting to know someone through shared experiences and interactions, so meeting earlier rather than later makes sense in that regard.

She could have in turn volunteered when she's comfortable with meeting him IRL after he initially asked her.

Two messages felt too soon for her.

Perhaps because he was trying to respect your comfort levels that's why he didn't ask you again and then nature took it's course where he would just continue to text and talk on the phone and it turned into basically a friendship.

You've mentioned it started out flirtatious and romantic on the dating site, but at some point, something caused everything to change to a friendship on his end. It's a bit of a mystery because neither of you talk about dating in general.

I can tell by your remarks towards him that you're annoyed. You're telegraphing it when you say that he suffered through talking to you on the phone when he could have been back in his hotel room having fun.

Although things started romantically, at some point, it became more so platonic and now you're giving him the "what gives with this friendship" vibe.

[Batya33]

3 minutes ago, yogacat said:

That's true.

Albeit for some people they may prefer to establish some kind of rapport or comfort level with someone before putting themselves in a position where they are physically alone with that person. People's initial comfort levels vary.

For sure.  I would not have wanted to meet that person because it would have told me we weren't compatible enough.  And I was never physically alone -always met in a public place. I only wanted to meet people who were on the site to date in person and meet ASAP because they were looking for marriage and had busy, reasonably successful lives- professional and social. 

If they were so scared to meet for coffee for an hour and thought typing and talking was a good way to get over that fear I'd know we weren't simpatico. On a practical level I didn't have that amount of time plus I was in a city teeming with single professionals so I didn't need to wait around for someone to figure out I might bite into a biscotti but not them.  I was also very extroverted and while I really enjoyed being with and around shy people I knew many shy people who were eager to meet one on one instead of going to a crowded singles event. 

Totally fine for people who want to type and talk online at length before meeting if that works for them.

I met many men where we had  great rapport over the phone and the messages and not inperson.  I spoke with many men who were wonderful writers online and the phone call was a dud so I did not meet them. Also I knew I wouldn't know if there was chemistry before meeting in person -looks being a very minor reason why - so I didn't want to spend time developing rapport with a stranger (for online penpals -sure)

[Tinydance]

12 minutes ago, yogacat said:

That's true.

Albeit for some people they may prefer to establish some kind of rapport or comfort level with someone before putting themselves in a position where they are physically alone with that person. People's initial comfort levels vary.

But you're right that dating is about getting to know someone through shared experiences and interactions, so meeting earlier rather than later makes sense in that regard.

She could have in turn volunteered when she's comfortable with meeting him IRL after he initially asked her.

Two messages felt too soon for her.

Perhaps because he was trying to respect your comfort levels that's why he didn't ask you again and then nature took it's course where he would just continue to text and talk on the phone and it turned into basically a friendship.

You've mentioned it started out flirtatious and romantic on the dating site, but at some point, something caused everything to change to a friendship on his end. It's a bit of a mystery because neither of you talk about dating in general.

I can tell by your remarks towards him that you're annoyed. You're telegraphing it when you say that he suffered through talking to you on the phone when he could have been back in his hotel room having fun.

Although things started romantically, at some point, it became more so platonic and now you're giving him the "what gives with this friendship" vibe.

I don't actually think that you can know you can trust that person or feel comfortable with them just from talking online. I knew someone who talked to a guy online and then found out later he was a serial killer! I'm not even joking.

[rainbowsandroses]

10 minutes ago, Tinydance said:

I don't actually think that you can know you can trust that person or feel comfortable with them just from talking online. I knew someone who talked to a guy online and then found out later he was a serial killer! I'm not even joking.

I'm sorry for laughing that is NOT funny!

Even though it kinda is?   

Hope she's okay! 

Made me think of the movie on Netflix about Ted Bundy - Extremely Wicked, Shockingly Evil. 

I just watched this last week!  Wasn't even online but lord, it's scary out there! 

He had a long term girlfriend whom he claimed to love A LOT the entire time he was viciously murdering those women!  

 

[rainbowsandroses]

43 minutes ago, Batya33 said:

I met many men where we had  great rapport over the phone and the messages and not inperson.  I spoke with many men who were wonderful writers online and the phone call was a dud so I did not meet them. Also I knew I wouldn't know if there was chemistry before meeting in person -looks being a very minor reason why - so I didn't want to spend time developing rapport with a stranger (for online penpals -sure)

I think this^ is very smart Bat.  No nonsense and a very straightforward and direct approach.

I used to be one of those "scared" individuals (not being snarky when saying that) I had a lot of anxiety and fears.  And would prefer to chat a bit before meeting.

In retrospect, it was basically avoidance, I own it!

NOW, I'm the complete opposite and prefer to meet sooner rather than later even the same night!  Assuming we're clicking on line.  

Why?  One reason is (1) strike while the iron is hot and (2) so I don't overthink my way out of going!  Which I had a tendency to do when prolonging it. 

JMO but I really do think this explains much of the flaking that goes on.

For many people (my observation) there is so much anxiety, overthinking, overanalyzing before the meet - she/he waited too long to text, I see them online but they haven't responded to MY text, does she like me, do I like him, etc etc - NEXT! 

So now we just arrange to meet in a public place, 15-30 and if we click in person we can extend it. 

Easy peasy!  For me anyway.