Why do many employers want their employees to have degrees?

[SC2005]

What does a degree actually show an employer about a prospective employee that makes that the prospect a likely good worker? I’m not taking about degrees that actually teach you a skill matched to a job — like computer science, medicine, etc.

Rather, jobs that don’t require a specific skill learned at university, like product management, for example. 
 

Why would someone looking for a product manager, marketing person, or whatever,  care if the worker had a degree in maths, history, or whatever it may be? Why is it relevant? 

[Kwothe28]

“Weed out” selection. Same with various other qualifications they put in job adds. X years of experience for example. Some are even “trick questions”. Saw internet add for a job that sought 8 years experience in a computer program. That computer program was 2 years old. But you have to know your stuff to know that. 

[DarkCh0c0]

1 hour ago, SC2005 said:

Why would someone looking for a product manager, marketing person, or whatever,  care if the worker had a degree in maths, history, or whatever it may be? Why is it relevant? 

It's relevant because your education frames how you think about and problem solve on the field. 

For example, if someone studied biology and they want to work in business development, they will most likely struggle because of their more tasks oriented and scientific approach towards projects and people relations. They also wouldn't have a technical background that would to equip them to succeed (vs say a business student).

[Batya33]

11 hours ago, SC2005 said:

What does a degree actually show an employer about a prospective employee that makes that the prospect a likely good worker? I’m not taking about degrees that actually teach you a skill matched to a job — like computer science, medicine, etc.

Rather, jobs that don’t require a specific skill learned at university, like product management, for example. 
 

Why would someone looking for a product manager, marketing person, or whatever,  care if the worker had a degree in maths, history, or whatever it may be? Why is it relevant? 

What it showed about me - not commenting on others- I was intelligent and had worked hard towards the accomplishment of a college degree and later a graduate degree.  I had good communication and writing skills which I'd honed and improved on in college.  I was able to stick to a long term goal and do it successfully.  I had top grades and honors and I worked incredibly hard to achieve all of that. Also that I was a well rounded person academically.  My jobs all required good writing skills and communication skills.  I also was involved in certain college activities that showed that too.

Also if it's a service industry/get clients often being part of a college network helps that.

[Seraphim]

It demonstrates persistence and skills . 

[ShySoul]

Education isn't just about the knowledge or skill learned. It's about the intangibles that mean just as much on a job site. 

Do you have the determination and persistance to set a goal and keep working to it? Do you have a strong work ethic and will be committed to the tasks assigned? Do you have common sense and general knowledge of how the world works? Do you have problem solving skills or time mangement? Can you get along well with people and work in teams?

I've found the most important thing you get from educations is not what to think, it's how to think. As long as you have a foundation, a lot of things can be taught or picked up on the job. But the ability to approach things in a logical manner, learn from each task, and push to better yourself can't be taught. Those are things you pick up their your schooling or have to come from within you.

[catfeeder]

13 hours ago, SC2005 said:

What does a degree actually show an employer about a prospective employee that makes that the prospect a likely good worker?

According to CNBC, 1 in 3 employers are ditching that requirement. Traditionally, companies believed that a degree demonstrates one's abilities to commit to a program, manage four years of deadlines and requirements, and pass, at very least, reasonable literacy and communication requirements, if not develop an expertise in given subject matter. Employers want the same in their employees--will they commit to learning about their business, meet deadlines, manage projects, etc?

Try researching lists of companies that no longer require a degree.

[Coily]

Once upon a time a University degree was an exemplar of a educational focus on a relevant or related field that would bring skills and understanding of the general process and they would only need to train a prospect on the particulars of that business.

That degree, time in field, and certifications used to be a method to pick a motivated candidate who would be able to jump in feet first and help the company/organization prosper; also would determine proper compensation for a candidate.

But now? It's basically showing that someone is willing to play the game of the educational industrial complex. It hinders people with years of practical experience in a field to be hired, deferring to someone with a shiny new diploma, and thus much cheaper.

Then again, I'm jaded with education. 15+ years in engineering and no degree in that field; and I am still teaching doctorate level engineers about the most basic principles; it is stupefying. They won't hire me directly for not having the right degree, so I stick them for more than double for consulting fees.

 

[catfeeder]

One work-around may be to use temp agencies that service the company you want. Go in as a temp and build relationships. Then you can apply for jobs from within, and your reputation with their managers and employees may have them waive the degree requirement for you.

I did this to check out company cultures to learn if they'd be a fit. I'd either go in as a consultant, a contractor or a general temp, depending on the openings available with given placement firms.

I didn't get my degree until my early 40's. I listed my college experience as 'attended' XYZ University rather than 'graduated'. I made good relationships on temp jobs and used those as references to apply from within to jobs not open to the general public. My last employer allowed me to create my own job in order to work there after his team got to know me through temping.

[SC2005]

10 hours ago, Coily said:

Once upon a time a University degree was an exemplar of a educational focus on a relevant or related field that would bring skills and understanding of the general process and they would only need to train a prospect on the particulars of that business.

That degree, time in field, and certifications used to be a method to pick a motivated candidate who would be able to jump in feet first and help the company/organization prosper; also would determine proper compensation for a candidate.

But now? It's basically showing that someone is willing to play the game of the educational industrial complex. It hinders people with years of practical experience in a field to be hired, deferring to someone with a shiny new diploma, and thus much cheaper.

Then again, I'm jaded with education. 15+ years in engineering and no degree in that field; and I am still teaching doctorate level engineers about the most basic principles; it is stupefying. They won't hire me directly for not having the right degree, so I stick them for more than double for consulting fees.

 

You’re saying a degree shows someone is a “play the game” type of person who doesn’t try to think too much out of the box, so will show employers that whoever they’re hiring will shut up and listen, whilst still having the required amount of creativity?

[Cherylyn]

It also demonstrates self discipline,  tenacity,  perseverance,  self reliance,  autonomy,  team work,  goal setting,  studying,  book / classroom learning,  teaches you how to think and figure it out.  It's a lot easier to attain high income employment with a degree than without. 

[SC2005]

1 hour ago, Cherylyn said:

It also demonstrates self discipline,  tenacity,  perseverance,  self reliance,  autonomy,  team work,  goal setting,  studying,  book / classroom learning,  teaches you how to think and figure it out.  It's a lot easier to attain high income employment with a degree than without. 

I really don’t want to sound boastful but: 

I’m currently voluntarily in the army which requires way more of any of the qualities you mentioned (other than studying) than all of my friends are developing at university. And, I started a software company with two friends which we ran for 2 years, but it didn’t work out.

I sometimes feel like I have the qualities a degree demonstrates you have; and there are other ways to demonstrate I have them. Curious to hear everyone’s views. 

[Coily]

7 hours ago, SC2005 said:

You’re saying a degree shows someone is a “play the game” type of person who doesn’t try to think too much out of the box, so will show employers that whoever they’re hiring will shut up and listen, whilst still having the required amount of creativity?

Pretty much. Many degrees have a massively inflated value now vs 30 or 40 years ago.  There are of course certain fields that do need the specialized training, but if companies invested in employees (and gave them incentive to remain loyal) you could train a lot of people up to low level managers.

[SC2005]

2 hours ago, Coily said:

Pretty much. Many degrees have a massively inflated value now vs 30 or 40 years ago.  There are of course certain fields that do need the specialized training, but if companies invested in employees (and gave them incentive to remain loyal) you could train a lot of people up to low level managers.

I see 

[TeeDee]

I think sometimes the employer doesn't know what they want.  

My friend's husband is an amazing salesman.  He's won tons of awards.  The guy could sell air conditioners to Eskimos during a blizzard but he doesn't have a degree.   He can't get a new job because company's want a degree.  At this point, 30 years into his career it's stupid. 

That said, a university degree isn't supposed to be trade school.   You are supposed to be exposed to many things:  art, history, philosophy, etc.  You are supposed to be taught how to think & reason so you can solve problems, not simply how to regurgitate info.  They want to know you (allegedly) have some critical thinking skills.  I say allegedly because IMO colleges & universities no longer teach those things.  

You are correct that the hands on practical things you are learning in the military will better prepare you than certain degrees but certain employers will still want the piece of paper.  Using your GI bill or whatever else is available to you on active duty, consider some distance learning or other inexpensive options to get that sheepskin.  It's about checking a box.  There may no longer a valid reason for the degree but as the seller of your own services you have to give the customer (the employer) what it wants -- a degree.   

[Cherylyn]

8 hours ago, SC2005 said:

I really don’t want to sound boastful but: 

I’m currently voluntarily in the army which requires way more of any of the qualities you mentioned (other than studying) than all of my friends are developing at university. And, I started a software company with two friends which we ran for 2 years, but it didn’t work out.

I sometimes feel like I have the qualities a degree demonstrates you have; and there are other ways to demonstrate I have them. Curious to hear everyone’s views. 

According to a lot of employment requisitions posted throughout my career,  most high paying jobs require college degrees. 

It's great that you have the qualities a degree demonstrates.  However,  often times an employer wants everything such as degree or degrees plus experience. 

You don't sound boastful.  Several of my relatives and in-laws don't have degrees yet out earned those with college degrees but it's difficult to do what they did.  Often times the "short cut" is a college degree or degrees,  experience along the way and then ascension.  Everything in life is a sacrifice. 

[Batya33]

9 hours ago, SC2005 said:

I really don’t want to sound boastful but: 

I’m currently voluntarily in the army which requires way more of any of the qualities you mentioned (other than studying) than all of my friends are developing at university. And, I started a software company with two friends which we ran for 2 years, but it didn’t work out.

I sometimes feel like I have the qualities a degree demonstrates you have; and there are other ways to demonstrate I have them. Curious to hear everyone’s views. 

I agree with Cheryln.  Similarly when I went back to work after being a SAHM for 7 years I could have -as some do - list all the experience I acquired as a SAHM in this huge 7 year gap to show a potential employer -see! - I wasn't paid but it was like a real job in these specific ways (list of bullet points).  Because -actually it was.  And actually -IMO to fill in the gap as if SAHM was like a job would to me look foolish on a resume.  No offense to those who do it.  It's not fair because in reality the skills I learned and implemented are highly valuable to many employers and-life isn't fair because the impression it would give most likely would be -oh another SAHM trying to play up being with her cute baby/toddler/young kid as "real work" -ugh.

Similar with trying to convince an employer who requires a college degree that your experience is the same as -or better than- someone with the degree.  Might be very true.  And true doesn't equal impressing a potential employer who requires one.

I highly recommend an essay written by Ann Patchett in "These Precious Days" about the value of her MFA in writing at University of Iowa - she speaks to this very topic in a very direct, blunt and honest way.  

 

[catfeeder]

9 hours ago, SC2005 said:

I really don’t want to sound boastful but: 

I’m currently voluntarily in the army which requires way more of any of the qualities you mentioned (other than studying) than all of my friends are developing at university. And, I started a software company with two friends which we ran for 2 years, but it didn’t work out.

I sometimes feel like I have the qualities a degree demonstrates you have; and there are other ways to demonstrate I have them. Curious to hear everyone’s views. 

Thank you for your service, and I think you're right. It's people like you who have inspired many companies to start bucking the trend--and more firms will likely join the change.

Not only is a degree requirement a lazy way of screening job applicants, many schools, even among the most 'elite,' have exposed themselves as dirty by their practices of gouging and pay-to-play placements.

But systemic change is glacial in speed. I think @Coily is a great example of someone who has worked 'around' the system, even while working within it. I was somehow able to pull that off, but unlike Coily, I felt insecure working with (and teaching) the degreed. I'd abandoned school half done to parlay one 'cheap' temp assignment into a resume builder with in-demand experience that paid top dollar for independent consulting for many years. While I eventually completed school and grad school in my 40's, my motivation for that was private rather than professional.

You can certainly choose a work-around, and I've no doubt you'll be successful.

Head high.

[ShySoul]

12 hours ago, SC2005 said:

I really don’t want to sound boastful but: 

I’m currently voluntarily in the army which requires way more of any of the qualities you mentioned (other than studying) than all of my friends are developing at university. And, I started a software company with two friends which we ran for 2 years, but it didn’t work out.

I sometimes feel like I have the qualities a degree demonstrates you have; and there are other ways to demonstrate I have them. Curious to hear everyone’s views. 

There can be more then one way to pick up skills or demonstrate you have them.

My nephew tried going to college. He didn't have the skills necessary to succeed there as he was too into the parties and games. He wasn't likely to succeed in a job either because he wasn't in the right mindset. So he joined the Air Force. It pretty much taught him most of the qualities he would have learned at school. And was he had learned discipline, persistance and everything else, he was able to find work and became stable enough to eventually help support a wife and child.

There are many ways to move forward in life. It's more about finding the right way for you. You and my nephew were more suited to that army training and life. I excelled in more academic setting. Neither is right or wrong, it's all what suits an individual best.

More companies are also willing to take chances on those with less education levels. I've seen a lot of jobs where the degree is a plus, but not required. If they do require it, then the job isn't the right fit for you. Move onto the next job, one that would appreciate all the skills you can demonstrate to them.

Which is really the key. If you don't have the degree, demonstrate how you are the right candidate regardless of that. Find alternative ways to show your skills. You started your own business. Highlight all the work that went into that. 

As long as you can demonstrate all the same skills and really sell yourself, there will be places that are willing to take a chance on you.

[Cherylyn]

Thank you for your service.  I've known so many colleagues who've also served the military and transitioned to civilian employment without college degrees.  They've done well for themselves but the most plum,  top tiered jobs tend to favor college grads or so I've noticed in my experience. 

[Jaunty]

When I owned  a small sales business I ideally wanted college graduates.  I didn't care what degree they had.   My feeling was that their ability to commit and get the degree said things about them that were important to me.  

That said - I happily hired several people who did not have a college degree but had showed a lot of "skin in the game" in other aspects of their lives, for example, being in the service, other job experience or involvement in arts or an avocation that required and demonstrated a high level of comittment.

[SC2005]

16 hours ago, Batya33 said:

I agree with Cheryln.  Similarly when I went back to work after being a SAHM for 7 years I could have -as some do - list all the experience I acquired as a SAHM in this huge 7 year gap to show a potential employer -see! - I wasn't paid but it was like a real job in these specific ways (list of bullet points).  Because -actually it was.  And actually -IMO to fill in the gap as if SAHM was like a job would to me look foolish on a resume.  No offense to those who do it.  It's not fair because in reality the skills I learned and implemented are highly valuable to many employers and-life isn't fair because the impression it would give most likely would be -oh another SAHM trying to play up being with her cute baby/toddler/young kid as "real work" -ugh.

Similar with trying to convince an employer who requires a college degree that your experience is the same as -or better than- someone with the degree.  Might be very true.  And true doesn't equal impressing a potential employer who requires one.

I highly recommend an essay written by Ann Patchett in "These Precious Days" about the value of her MFA in writing at University of Iowa - she speaks to this very topic in a very direct, blunt and honest way.  

 

Wow; that’s such an interesting answer. Thank you. 

[SC2005]

12 hours ago, ShySoul said:

There can be more then one way to pick up skills or demonstrate you have them.

My nephew tried going to college. He didn't have the skills necessary to succeed there as he was too into the parties and games. He wasn't likely to succeed in a job either because he wasn't in the right mindset. So he joined the Air Force. It pretty much taught him most of the qualities he would have learned at school. And was he had learned discipline, persistance and everything else, he was able to find work and became stable enough to eventually help support a wife and child.

There are many ways to move forward in life. It's more about finding the right way for you. You and my nephew were more suited to that army training and life. I excelled in more academic setting. Neither is right or wrong, it's all what suits an individual best.

More companies are also willing to take chances on those with less education levels. I've seen a lot of jobs where the degree is a plus, but not required. If they do require it, then the job isn't the right fit for you. Move onto the next job, one that would appreciate all the skills you can demonstrate to them.

Which is really the key. If you don't have the degree, demonstrate how you are the right candidate regardless of that. Find alternative ways to show your skills. You started your own business. Highlight all the work that went into that. 

As long as you can demonstrate all the same skills and really sell yourself, there will be places that are willing to take a chance on you.

Thank you! I’ll probably still attend university and it’s not that I’m not suited - I did pretty well at school and am a person who loves to read, think and learn. It’s just I was thinking if it’s the best and fastest way to financially progress in life. 

[SC2005]

16 hours ago, Batya33 said:

I agree with Cheryln.  Similarly when I went back to work after being a SAHM for 7 years I could have -as some do - list all the experience I acquired as a SAHM in this huge 7 year gap to show a potential employer -see! - I wasn't paid but it was like a real job in these specific ways (list of bullet points).  Because -actually it was.  And actually -IMO to fill in the gap as if SAHM was like a job would to me look foolish on a resume.  No offense to those who do it.  It's not fair because in reality the skills I learned and implemented are highly valuable to many employers and-life isn't fair because the impression it would give most likely would be -oh another SAHM trying to play up being with her cute baby/toddler/young kid as "real work" -ugh.

Similar with trying to convince an employer who requires a college degree that your experience is the same as -or better than- someone with the degree.  Might be very true.  And true doesn't equal impressing a potential employer who requires one.

I highly recommend an essay written by Ann Patchett in "These Precious Days" about the value of her MFA in writing at University of Iowa - she speaks to this very topic in a very direct, blunt and honest way.  

 

Do you recall which essay? 

[Batya33]

54 minutes ago, SC2005 said:

Do you recall which essay? 

I'm not sure which one but it involves her MFA in Iowa.  She attended a different college for undergrad.  I love the whole book -almost done. I'm sure you can google it or look at the chapter headings.  

Accomplishing a college and grad degree was one of the best things I've done for myself- including because I met my husband because of grad school.  I do know of people who ended up not needing a degree and/or didn't attain one and took a path that didn't require one -or did a certification/license/trade that didn't require a 4 year degree.  And people who say they got nothing out of attaining a degree. Obviously very individual.