Navigating a relationship with someone still healing

[Faithxxx]

5 minutes ago, Batya33 said:

He is an involved father. I'd question whether it was good for the kids growing up in that sort of environment/why they had kids if they weren't compatible etc.  Also are they common law married?

In my country we don't have this official term. They lived together for 23 years and have children. In the eyes of the law in my country that gives you the same rights as though you are married.

Yes, of course that type of relationship is less than ideal. Interestingly, from what he has told me of his own parents relationship, it sounds about the same- so I can understand why he thought it was normal.

[Faithxxx]

13 hours ago, rainbowsandroses said:

 

I have been through this so have many other women I know and it never ended well!

 

I think the general consensus is waiting around for ANY man to decide who and what he wants is well, just not very smart and very VERY rarely works out well for the woman waiting.

Your love, kindness and patience will never move him closer to you and make him value you @Faithxxx.  Valuing yourself and as such distancing yourself at a time like this MIGHT!!

Just like his ex (or is she even really his "ex"?) is doing by going NC and look what happened?  According to your own words, he realized how "too enmeshed" he is with her!  

With all due respect, I think you are adding legs to the story that just don't belong there. 

Is she his ex? Well they live in different houses

Showing love, kindness and patience does not mean that I am NOT valuing myself. I know he values me. I feel that from him everyday. 

I question his readyness, as does he. Its difficult when you meet a great person but they are going through an upheaval. I think he was treating the break up as he did the relationship- passively.

Thank you for your input nevertheless, it helps to make my head clearer

 

 

 

[Faithxxx]

12 hours ago, ShySoul said:

Just my take, but based off of this I don't think he's looking for anything more with her or isn't over her. I think it's a relationship that ended long ago but neither side faced that reality until a couple of years ago. They just got used to it and continued on with the same unfullfilling routine. Maybe the stayed together for the children. Maybe it was just easier then the truth, having to deal with all the complications that come from a divorce. But there wasn't love there before, and I doubt there is love there now.

My parents went through something similar. The love was fading long before they could come to terms with it and my mom finally did something about it.

The unfortunate reality is that there will always be a lot of entanglement in the form of their sons. They can't really go no contact. What if there is an emergency involving the children? 

They can limit contact. They can set time for him with the children outside the home. They can come up with all kinds of alternate plans. But they will always be a part of each other's life. That is something all three adults need to come to terms accepting and figuring out how they feel about it.

As for the legal discussions, that can take time. Are there other factors that complicate matters? Is one person holding it up? 

It is natural for him to have questions on if he is ready. Of course it would have been easier if this was a year out and things weren't still in process. But look at his answer. He's not quitting on you. He said he's falling in love. You gave him the chance to walk away. He didn't cry about what he's lost. He didn't go running back to the ex. He didn't treat you as the other woman. He treated you as THE woman, the one he wants to be with.

Yes, he probably wishes you came along a year later. It would have been easier. But you came along now. And he isn't regretting that. He's grabbing onto it and doesn't want to let go.

It's not going to be easy. There will be things to work through, boundaries for each person to set. Both of you will have your doubts and times you question what to do. But both of you seem committed to each other. Both of you seem to love each other. So see where that can take you. 

Thank you. This is certainly how I feel about it when I let myself relax into it. I know that our love is growing. We are not rushing but what we have is very good. I know that he appreciates me and I appreciate him. In our late forties, I can recognize a GOOD thing when I see it. 

Nevertheless its difficult because I am so ready and he ...rightly so...is so cautious

[Faithxxx]

9 hours ago, ShySoul said:

This is a person who stayed in a love less marriage without seeing there were healthier alternatives. She had to leave him. He seems content with the status quo unless something pushes him to change it. There's not necessarily anything wrong with that. But it might be helpful to know his tendency and that you may need to give a little push now and then.

Exactly this! I think he has been treating the break up in the same way as he did the relationship. He is anti confrontation and will do everything to avoid conflict. He is working on this but I think you're right- a little push now and then will be needed. 

And keep in mind, he felt strongly enough about you to tell the ex. He did it because he thinks this is serious. Telling her was a way of respecting what they had and her feelings, while taking steps to move on himself. In a way its saying to her that it is really over because I have someone else. 

It was also his way of showing respect to me. He wanted to be fair to me and get our relationship out in the open.

 

[Faithxxx]

9 hours ago, yogacat said:

What are you afraid of exactly? That he still holds residual feelings for his ex?

Yes, this is my fear.

It doesn't sound like it. It sounds like 1. He was complacent in his previous relationship and wasn't aware of how bad his situation was. To be honest that's really common, people lose themselves and their intuition and fall into the motions of routine. 

That's exactly what he says

Anyway, his living situation will not last forever. Once they sort out their legal matters, he will be able to cut contact more easily. 

Like you said, you can't go backwards...

His ex would be hurt when he told her about you he said, and in turn, I suppose that is why she said it's best they limit contact (which sounds like a good idea). All you can do now is sit back and watch how he handles the relationship with her. 

Thank you for offering your opinion. It is reassuring.

 

[Faithxxx]

1 hour ago, Openreach said:

It could be just as possible that he's told her of his new relationship just to manipulate her with a power play to make her jealous. Because after telling the "ex" she gets to thinking of them having happy times, of having sex, and that she risks losing him forever plus forcing her emotions to ask herself if she can get now get him back from this other woman. It's important to remember that he is the dumpee and not the dumper.

By saying he's in a relationship he's regaining his power by stating he's now unavailable - and people want want they can't have.

If this is the case, then better it happens now rather than later. If she was to suggest that they try again then his reaction to this will be everything that I need to know.

 

[DarkCh0c0]

1 hour ago, Faithxxx said:

I am in my late 40's. Marriage was not something that I dreamed about but I now that I've met him, I can see it happening. 

Well if he dragged on and chose not to marry last time he was with his ex fiance, for 20 years!, then consider he might do the same to you.

And, are you okay being with someone who has so much baggage and mental health issues?

[Faithxxx]

2 minutes ago, DarkCh0c0 said:

Well if he dragged on and chose not to marry last time he was with his ex fiance, for 20 years!, then consider he might do the same to you.

And, are you okay being with someone who has so much baggage and mental health issues?

Marriage is not a priority for me. It would be nice but its not a necessity. A good healthy relationship is a priority,

There are no mental health issues. 

Baggage is inevitable at my age. I have it too. If the relationship is worth it, then yes. As long as he is dealing with the baggage appropriately.

[Coily]

It really comes across as you are only worried if there are residual romantic feelings. Which he seems pretty clear don't exist.  You are right to be concerned, but don't let it cloud what you are experiencing.  Until he acts in a way that undermines that trust, you're just going through natural doubts in getting to know someone.

A lot of men will stay in a bad situation for the sake of the kids, custody/visitation/child support or some rotten soul telling him he's not a "real man" if he looks after his needs in a relationship. He finally pulled the blinders off, probably as his kids were getting old enough he saw how they were growing as men. (Not the first time that's happened.)

In my opinion, if there is nothing glaringly wrong in the relationship, don't go digging for something.

[rainbowsandroses]

Thank you for responding to all the questions Faith.

Final thoughts, I don't think anything is clear at this point including his feelings for her, in truth the only person who truly knows is HIM!

We can only speculate based on what you've written and to ME and some others he's displaying some rather significant red flags, two that stand out to me (1) he told you he's not sure he's "ready" for a relationship with you and (2) he told you he's "too enmeshed" with his ex (present tense).

I can't speak for other women (or you) but if me and a man I was dating for 5 months said those things to me, I'd be taking a big step back.

Plus other things you've posted, my own perceptions about it, what I have observed in the world among couples in a similar situation and TONS of reading re interpersonal/romantic relationships, male/female attraction, human behavior and the like.

You don't know me but I'm pretty intuitive and most of my perceptions have been spot on BUT they've also been wrong. I'm certainly not psychic!  Lol

I have also learned and think most would agree that despite creating threads and seeking opinions, at the end of the day, you (or any poster) are going to do what your heart tells you to do and that's OKAY!

If you get hurt, so be, you learn and take what you've learned into your next relationship.

So just play this out Faith, that's my final advice. 

Pay attention to his words/actions (and reactions), be cautiously optimistic and see where it takes you!   Enjoy! 

If you feel inclined I'd love to hear updates on your journey, and truly do hope it works out the way you hope. 💛

 

[DarkCh0c0]

5 hours ago, Faithxxx said:

Marriage is not a priority for me. It would be nice but its not a necessity. A good healthy relationship is a priority,

There are no mental health issues. 

Baggage is inevitable at my age. I have it too. If the relationship is worth it, then yes. As long as he is dealing with the baggage appropriately.

Alright. Then tread carefully and check-in with yourself every now and then as you carry on in this relationship. If you notice any other flag coming up, feel free to let us now or take a pause to assess the situation. Time will probably give you the answer. You got this.

[catfeeder]

8 hours ago, Faithxxx said:

Considering that she was the one who ended things, I don't think she wants him back at all. However she did get upset when he told her about me. I think that both of them had been together for so long that its almost unthinkable for them to imagine either of them being with someone else. He has admitted to me that he wants her to be happy, he wants her to move on but that he will struggle when she does. This hurts to hear. No girlfriend wants to hear that. But I do understand. I still get a little jealous when my ex gets a girlfriend and we've been over for a looong time. I think its an ego/ownership thing that comes when you've made a family with someone. 

I get that she's the one who broke up. That's why she felt in control when he visited. Now that he's told her he's involved with you, as you've stated, her reaction is understandable, she now wants distance. And so, I'm pointing out that this is the natural time of destabilization with BF's visitation that naturally would have occurred at the outset of their breakup had they not settled into this comfy sharing of 'the family home' with her present for his visits.

This is the destabilizing time in a breakup where people warn about 'rebounding'. A rebound is when a destabilized person leans into a new relationship rather than working through their grief alone and learning how to stabilize solo. BF has never had that. He was able to move his belongings somewhere else and continue his 'family time' with his children AND his ex.

Consider doing a bit of research on rebounding, as it's a real thing. The most predictable outcome is that the new relationship is fabulous--the perfect bandage for the wound. However, in time, the rebounder heals to a certain degree and then ends up making a rather typical speech, which sincerely sings the praises of the new partner, even while the breakup needs to happen, because "I wish I could have met you a year from now, because I really should have taken the time to be alone and single for a while to find myself..."

Is this the outcome any of us would want for you? No, and none of us have a crystal ball for predicting it, so there is that. But rebounders rarely recognize that they are rebounding--it hits them later, after they've healed to a degree that they recognize that they've leapfrogged.

In most cases destabilization is instant because the breakup is instant--and clean. But in BF's case, he continued a pseudo-relationship with his ex in the comfort of his family home, and only now that that's disrupted will he need to deal with real separation. 

So the question for you becomes, do I want to risk being the casualty of this destabilizing time in this man's life? This doesn't mean, "Quick! Ditch him!" but rather, it can mean explaining why you'll want to pull back a bit and allow him time to stabilize solo while he figures out his new visitation patterns with his children.

I can tell you're all in with this man, and I don't suggest that there's anything 'wrong' with that. But if your goal is to help this man even while looking out for your own best interests, you may want to avoid 'leaning in' at a pivotal time for this man when some solo work could help him gain the solo footing you'll both be able to trust going forward.

Head high, and congrAts on finding a wonderful man.

[Faithxxx]

2 hours ago, rainbowsandroses said:

Thank you for responding to all the questions Faith.

Final thoughts, I don't think anything is clear at this point including his feelings for her, in truth the only person who truly knows is HIM!

We can only speculate based on what you've written and to ME and some others he's displaying some rather significant red flags, two that stand out to me (1) he told you he's not sure he's "ready" for a relationship with you and (2) he told you he's "too enmeshed" with his ex (present tense).

I can't speak for other women (or you) but if me and a man I was dating for 5 months said those things to me, I'd be taking a big step back.

Plus other things you've posted, my own perceptions about it, what I have observed in the world among couples in a similar situation and TONS of reading re interpersonal/romantic relationships, male/female attraction, human behavior and the like.

You don't know me but I'm pretty intuitive and most of my perceptions have been spot on BUT they've also been wrong. I'm certainly not psychic!  Lol

I have also learned and think most would agree that despite creating threads and seeking opinions, at the end of the day, you (or any poster) are going to do what your heart tells you to do and that's OKAY!

If you get hurt, so be, you learn and take what you've learned into your next relationship.

So just play this out Faith, that's my final advice. 

Pay attention to his words/actions (and reactions), be cautiously optimistic and see where it takes you!   Enjoy! 

If you feel inclined I'd love to hear updates on your journey, and truly do hope it works out the way you hope. 💛

 

Thank you so much for your input!

[ShySoul]

9 hours ago, Openreach said:

That's a big assumption to make tbh. It could be just as possible that he's told her of his new relationship just to manipulate her with a power play to make her jealous. Because after telling the "ex" she gets to thinking of them having happy times, of having sex, and that she risks losing him forever plus forcing her emotions to ask herself if she can get now get him back from this other woman. It's important to remember that he is the dumpee and not the dumper.

By saying he's in a relationship he's regaining his power by stating he's now unavailable - and people want want they can't have.

That's also a big assumption. And it seems to be the assumption most people have made. I just gave the alternative. 

Why is it so hard to believe that a person could be straightforward and honest about things without it having to be some game and quest for power? Not everyone is out to use others and play with there emotions. I think most people are honest and say what they mean. You don't have to make leaps of logic and assumptions to get to most people's intent. They will say it and show it. And what he has said and shown shows he is falling in love with the poster.

[Faithxxx]

1 hour ago, catfeeder said:

... because "I wish I could have met you a year from now, because I really should have taken the time to be alone and single for a while to find myself..."

But rebounders rarely recognize that they are rebounding--it hits them later, after they've healed to a degree that they recognize that they've leapfrogged.

In most cases destabilization is instant because the breakup is instant--and clean. But in BF's case, he continued a pseudo-relationship with his ex in the comfort of his family home, and only now that that's disrupted will he need to deal with real separation.

Those are all very good and sobering points. I will consider them carefully. I think I need to be very clear about my own concerns here and I need to observe his actions in response to my concerns. And yes, I need to be careful to keep things at a slow pace.

[Coily]

6 minutes ago, ShySoul said:

That's also a big assumption. And it seems to be the assumption most people have made. I just gave the alternative. 

Why is it so hard to believe that a person could be straightforward and honest about things without it having to be some game and quest for power? Not everyone is out to use others and play with there emotions. I think most people are honest and say what they mean. You don't have to make leaps of logic and assumptions to get to most people's intent. They will say it and show it. And what he has said and shown shows he is falling in love with the poster.

Remember Penis Creature bad. Hahaha

probably more of a reflection of this weird post-modern philosophy that everything is a power struggle; everything is politics. Rather than human nature, while complex, is more about finding a level of satisfaction.

[rainbowsandroses]

41 minutes ago, ShySoul said:

Not everyone is out to use others and play with there emotions.

^Of course they're not SS.  But fact is, there are some people who would and DO and it's foolish to think otherwise.

That said, in Faith's situation, I do NOT think her boyfriend is playing with her emotions or acting in any sort of devious or nefarious way.

He sounds conflicted to me, admittedly he is still very much attached to his ex (enmeshed is the word he used); up until his ex put on the breaks, they've been spending time together (with their kids) at their family home, texting, etc.

I give him credit for being open and honest and letting Faith "in" on what's happening with him and that he questions whether or not he is ready, now it's up to HER if she wants to stick around while he works through his conflicted emotions and fully heals.

I have never seen these situations end well for the woman so I personally would not.  Not just because of what I have observed, I simply have no interest in getting involved with a man who is NOT fully healed from a past long term relationship and emotionally "enmeshed" with his ex.

On the other hand, I am sure there are situations that DO work out, it's Faith's choice whether or not she wants to take that risk.

 

[ShySoul]

7 hours ago, Faithxxx said:

It was also his way of showing respect to me. He wanted to be fair to me and get our relationship out in the open.

Exactly. He's trying to navigate a complex situations while respecting everyone's feelings. It takes time, and there will be doubts and anxiety on all sides. 

7 hours ago, Faithxxx said:

Nevertheless its difficult because I am so ready and he ...rightly so...is so cautious

Good things come to those who wait. The best things in life are worth waiting for. Slow and steady wins the race. (Yes, that's a lot of cliches to throw at you.)

I know how it feels to want someone so bad. You just want to jump into it. The wait is torture. But you will be better off for it. He's not showing signs of leaving, even if he's not going as fast as you would like. So enjoy what is there. Don't be so anxious to get to the next step that you can't fully enjoy the step you are in. Each moment is building the foundation. And the longer you take to build a foundation, more solid and well tested it will be when you do move onto even more. So savor each moment the best you can, because those moments create the memories that last a lifetime.

[ShySoul]

2 minutes ago, Coily said:

Remember Penis Creature bad. Hahaha

probably more of a reflection of this weird post-modern philosophy that everything is a power struggle; everything is politics. Rather than human nature, while complex, is more about finding a level of satisfaction.

I've been told by multiple people (all males interestingly) that I'm biased to women. So I will avoid calling penis creatures bad. Though if I'm so bias, why am a trying so hard to defend said penis creature. 🤨

As someone who doesn't want power, making everything about power really seems crazy to me. People are already complex without throwing on extra layers like that. Maybe seeing everything as a power struggle is a self fulfilling prophecy that then creates the power struggle? 

Personally, I've always seen life as a quest for understanding, not power. It's in understanding someone and what they are feeling internally, that we can make the most progress and get through the inevitable problems. And that is more powerful then any of these games and tricks people try to play.

[rainbowsandroses]

27 minutes ago, ShySoul said:

Good things come to those who wait. The best things in life are worth waiting for. Slow and steady wins the race.

I don't disagree however in certain situations (like this) where one person is still in the process of healing and admits he is still attached/too enmeshed with his ex (again present tense) it's sometimes wise to take a step back too, and allow the person time to work through their emotions and heal without the pressure of a new relationship and new person to think/worry about.

I mean he admitted to Faith he's not sure he's "ready" and wish he'd met her a year from now.  IOW, when he IS ready and healed.

I think it's a big mistake to ignore his own words in that regard, jmo.

Perhaps later when he's had time to process and heal, he and Faith can reconnect, but now? 

I dunno, I don't think that's smart or fair to either one of them.

 

 

 

[Cherylyn]

8 hours ago, Faithxxx said:

Hmmm not sure about this. He certainly does not make me feel like I'm last on his last. He does prioritize me. Obviously his children come first. I could not respect him if that wasn't the case. I'm only in his life 5 months. Its early days for us. Its not everyday you meet someone who is such a good match-that's not something to throw away. However, Yes I wish he was further along in the healing process, yes I wish he felt as READY as I am. 

Even though he prioritizes you as you say,  his time,  energy and attention for you is obviously limited due to his dealing with his ex and children.  He may be a good match but it's not an easy relationship to navigate.  Consider him a package deal.  🤨

[ShySoul]

19 minutes ago, rainbowsandroses said:

Of course they're not SS.  But fact is, there are some people who would and it's foolish to dismiss that.

That said, in Faith's situation, I do NOT think her boyfriend is playing with her emotions or acting in any sort of devious or nefarious way.

He sounds conflicted to me, admittedly he is still very much attached to his ex (enmeshed is the word he used); up until his ex put on the breaks, they've been spending time at their family home.

Agreed, it's always wise to keep all perspectives in mind. And I think Faith is trying to do that. I actually think they are handling a difficult situation very well. I don't think there are games or manipulation, rather both sides are trying to be understanding and honest with each other. Which gives me hope this can work out.

I think Faith used the right word, one I thought about using myself: passive. I don't see him so much as conflicted. He made clear he was failing in love with Faith. He told the ex he had another relationship. He dismissed ideas of not being with Faith. I think he wants to be with her. But he's not the kind of person to take the initiative and do the extra steps to completely break away from the old life. He needs to be pushed to separate more in order for the new relationship to really take off. I think once he can get over that hurdle, things will be better. It seems like he's slowly getting there. 

It's up to Faith to decide how much she can handle and if she believes this is worth it. I think they are doing a good job so far. Hope they can keep it up.

Best of luck Faith. We're here for you.

[Coily]

18 minutes ago, ShySoul said:

I've been told by multiple people (all males interestingly) that I'm biased to women. So I will avoid calling penis creatures bad. Though if I'm so bias, why am a trying so hard to defend said penis creature. 🤨

Guess i need to revive "/sarcasm"

[rainbowsandroses]

10 minutes ago, ShySoul said:

I don't think there are games or manipulation, rather both sides are trying to be understanding and honest with each other. Which gives me hope this can work out.

Agree, I posted that!

And yes as I said, I give him credit for being open and honest and letting her in on what's happening with him -- that he's not sure he's ready for a new relationship as he realizes he is not fully healed and still "too enmeshed" with this ex.  This is not just an opinion or my perception, these are his own words!!

Faith stepping back a bit to allow him time to process his emotions and heal without the pressure of a new relationship to think or worry about does not mean things won't ever "work out."  

In fact, imo I think Faith stepping back and taking the pressure off for awhile would render a better chance of things "working out," long term or perhaps even forever!

Versus now when it appears Faith may possibly be a rebound while he works through his emotions about his ex and the end of his 23 year RL, and healing.

 

 

 

[Openreach]

53 minutes ago, ShySoul said:

That's also a big assumption. And it seems to be the assumption most people have made. I just gave the alternative. 

Why is it so hard to believe that a person could be straightforward and honest about things without it having to be some game and quest for power? Not everyone is out to use others and play with there emotions. I think most people are honest and say what they mean. You don't have to make leaps of logic and assumptions to get to most people's intent. They will say it and show it. And what he has said and shown shows he is falling in love with the poster.

I know its also an assumption which is why i said as much in my opening line..

I've gone back to an ex after being in a relationship and i've had a girlfriend go back to an ex too so i have first hand experience of the rebound relationship dynamic (there's also a whole lot of stuff about Rebounds on YouTube)

The fact is it was he who was dumped and that has a massive bearing on the situation imo. Plus as myself and others have pointed out he has admitted to "not being ready"... and that's before the 20 years of history, the kids, the visits.

I'm not saying I know what the future holds for these people but there are components to their situation that ring bells to me from personal experience.