Girl I'm Newly Dating Was In A Orgy With Her Male Best Friend Before We Met

[Waylen Jones]

I'm a new member here and I really need advice with this one because I don't know how to feel.

Backstory:

I'll try my best to keep this story short but back in early June of this year I, (31) met this girl, (25) while on a vacation with my friends in Mexico. She was with her friends doing the same thing. We met while out at the same place and hit it off very quickly. The small problem for me is we live in not only different cities, but in different countries. I live in California while she lives in London. Since the Mexico trip we have not missed a day of speaking to each other and I feel very happy and lucky to have found this woman. We share a lot of the same qualities, values, blah blah, etc. I also have been considering relocating to be in the same city with her one day if things continue to go as good as they have been because there is nothing binding me to my current city. I went to visit her in Paris last week and we had a very romantic weekend. We then went from Paris to London and she showed me around her city, this was also another amazing weekend and she did more for me thus far than all of my 3 exes combined in a much shorter time. Our next trip will be her first ever trip to America. We are meeting in NYC with a couple friends Labor Day weekend. So for us to be doing all of this, yes we do see a lot of potential in each other.

The Problem:

The BIG problem for me came recently. She has a male best friend who's been her #1 friend for at least a decade. One night about a month ago we were telling each other our darkest secrets. And what she told me didn't really bother me at first but the more I grew feelings for her, the more I can't stop thinking about it. She told me that last summer she went with a group of her 4 closest female friends, her male BF and his longtime girlfriend to Jamaica. And on the trip one night they had an orgy at their villa between the 7 of them. The girl I am talking to is bi-sexual and has told me she always had a crush on her BF's girlfriend. Not everyone messed with everyone in this romance but on her part she told me that she had sex with him and his GF when it happened. She then told me that a few hours later she had sex with him, his gf and another female friend a second time at the villa. I asked her why she did it in the first place and she said it was because she was mainly attracted to his GF and does not feel any attraction towards him. She also said that she did not do any oral with him or feel any sense of pleasure after it was over, or during, (which did make me feel a little better). Lastly, she said to me that after the trip was over she told her male best friend and his GF that she never wants to do anything again with them because she wants to keep their old friendship the way it was, and she also doesn't want to make it difficult to be with future partners (like myself) knowing they did that and are still friends. In her words, he has apparently respected her wishes and has not made any moves on her since they've been back and now they pretty much act as if it never happened.

Final Thoughts:

I know this is a very wild story but I do really like her and I wish I could easily see past this. She has not been with many men sexually in her life so this trip was one of those crazy vacation moments. Idc about the orgy itself because I have also done a lot of promiscuous things around that age, but what really bothers me is that it was with a male figure who is active in her life still. They still go out together to parties, talk in group chats/on the phone etc. How am I supposed to ignore this now? We have spoken many times about this topic afterwards and she constantly reassured me that she has no feelings for him whatsoever and if I met him then I would be okay with their friendship because I would be able to see that nothing is there. She tried to reassure me by also saying it was not a 1v1 scenario between her and him and that it was a group thing, this does not make me feel better because it still happened. And while she may not have feelings for him, I do not know him personally and he may still try her again one day in the future. I also don't know if I ever want to meet him. And given that we are currently in a long distance dating situation doesn't make anything easier.

Can someone please give me some constructive advice on how to proceed, or if I even should at all? Of course I can make my own decisions at my age but I wouldn't be here writing this novel if I didn't need the help of others. Thank you for any contributions.

 

[Coily]

For me this would have killed the attraction. This isn't about me, so let me give you some thoughts as impartial as I can be.

On the keeping things going side, she has expressed she has no intention of seeking out a repeat with this guy. You know her better than we do, so if she is being straight with you on not experimenting again, take it at face value, for now.

On the Complicated side, is she will be around him and that group far more regularly than she is physically around you. This begs the question of trust and her personal resolve to withstand a repeat or peer pressure to have another romp.

On the end it front, well it's just something that you aren't wild about. You are allowed to want someone who doesn't keep in orbit someone they had sex with. You don't have to accept every flaw and put on a brave face. No need to rush into a decision just yet; but you need to weigh what she brings to the table for a long term investment in your life.

Honestly the distance problem would be one of the biggest drivers of concern for me.

[Waylen Jones]

9 minutes ago, Coily said:

For me this would have killed the attraction. This isn't about me, so let me give you some thoughts as impartial as I can be.

On the keeping things going side, she has expressed she has no intention of seeking out a repeat with this guy. You know her better than we do, so if she is being straight with you on not experimenting again, take it at face value, for now.

On the Complicated side, is she will be around him and that group far more regularly than she is physically around you. This begs the question of trust and her personal resolve to withstand a repeat or peer pressure to have another romp.

On the end it front, well it's just something that you aren't wild about. You are allowed to want someone who doesn't keep in orbit someone they had sex with. You don't have to accept every flaw and put on a brave face. No need to rush into a decision just yet; but you need to weigh what she brings to the table for a long term investment in your life.

Honestly the distance problem would be one of the biggest drivers of concern for me.

Thank you for your response. And if she would have led with this when we met it would have probably killed it for me too, but we were already in awe of each other before she told me about it so it was hard to disconnect. She also seems like she very much regrets doing what she did in the first place, this does not make me feel better but it does give me some hope she won't do it again.

As far as your last statement I did make a list of all the qualities she brings and she has 9/10 things that I value in someone I want to take date. I just don't know if I should let my pride or ego get in the way of what I do see in her.

And I agree I should not rush into any decision given the distance being a priority. But I can't sweep this under the rug for too long because if we ever do overcome the distance then I may have two years worth of feelings for this person by the time I have to face this problem head on. And could end in a him or I type of situation if I take it there.

[rainbowsandroses]

I'm trying to determine what the issue is for you; @Coilysaid it would kill all attraction for him but it doesn't sound like that's the issue for you.

You mentioned your pride and ego, how so?  Is it jealousy?  Or some sort of territorial thing involving sex and who, how many and the type of sexual experiences she had prior to meeting you?

Do you think less of her for engaging in this, or value her less than before you found out? 

You said she has 9/10 of the qualities you value, that's significant!

I agree the distance is a big issue but it sounds like you can make that work so I suppose you'll have to decide what you value most in a woman and if her past sexual experiences bother you to the point you're creating threads about it, then perhaps it's best you break it off.

It's very difficult sometimes to shake off an initial impression once our partner shares something like this. 

Try as we (you) might, you can't force yourself to not be bothered by it or talk yourself out of feeling a certain way about it.

People try but it always circles back to that in some form or fashion imo.

As a side, I don't know why some couples feel the need to have these types of talks, it's such a hot button and elicits all sorts of unpleasant emotions like what is happening now which imo is a real shame.

Because from the little you've shared it sounds like you've made a great connection, she seems like a good caring and honest woman who went a bit wild one night on vacay with her friends before you met and that's all it was..

Up to you and all the best whatever you decide. 

 

 

[Waylen Jones]

12 minutes ago, rainbowsandroses said:

I'm trying to determine what the issue is for you; @Coilysaid it would kill all attraction for him but it doesn't sound like that's the issue for you.

You mentioned your pride and ego, how so?  Is it jealousy?  Or some sort of territorial thing involving sex and who, how many and the type of sexual experiences she had prior to meeting you?

Do you think less of her for engaging in this, or value her less than before you found out? 

You said she has 9/10 of the qualities you value, that's significant!

I agree the distance is a big issue but it sounds like you can make that work so I suppose you'll have to decide what you value most in a woman and if her past sexual experiences bother you to the point you're creating threads about it, then perhaps it's best you break it off.

It's very difficult sometimes to shake off an initial impression once our partner shares something like this. 

Try as we (you) might, you can't force yourself to not be bothered by it or talk yourself out of your feelings. 

People try but it always circles back to that in some form or fashion imo.

As a side, I don't know why some couples feel the need to have these types of talks, it's such a hot button and elicits all sorts of unpleasant emotions like what is happening now which imo is a real shame.

Because from the little you've shared it sounds like you've made a great connection, she seems like a good caring and honest woman who went a bit wild one night on vacay with her friends before you met and that's all it was..

Up to you and all the best whatever you decide. 

 

 

I guess the issue is jealousy. The fact that another male knows what she is like in bed and will be sharing the same space as me since he isn't going anywhere. So you can say it's a territorial thing as well. I don't care about any previous men she was with or what she did with them, because they aren't around today. This 1 person is the only anomaly.

I don't think less of her for what happened and I still value her. I needed to create a thread about it because not everyone has people they can talk to. This isn't really something I could share with my mom and sometimes close friends can be biased for me, or judgmental towards her. I wanted the opinion of people that owe me nothing so I thank you for your contribution.

And the way the topic came out was from playing a drinking card game.

You say I won't ever be able to force myself or not talk my way out of this feeling, but what if I want to? How do I overcome being territorial? I do think she is an amazing woman, the best I've met in years. What specific steps or conversations do I need to have? For example, do you recommend I really meet this person with her around or would that make things worse?

[rainbowsandroses]

32 minutes ago, Waylen Jones said:

You say I won't ever be able to force myself or not talk my way out of this feeling, but what if I want to?

^I didn't say you'd never be able to, only that it can be difficult to do sometimes.. 

For me, I'm pretty resilient and don't have the type of territorial issues you mentioned so I can't really advise on how to shake the feeling.  Sorry.

I mean it's not even about acceptance as it sounds like you accept her, don't judge her and value her just as much as before she shared this with you.

It's strictly about this male friend in her life that she had a meaningless ONS with as a group while on vacay before you met.  

Perhaps meeting him, getting to know him, becoming friends with him yourself might change how you feel about it?  I don't know. 

It's a slow time right now, you'll get more responses tomorrow.

Again good luck!  I hope you're able to work it out. 

 

 

 

[rainbowsandroses]

52 minutes ago, Waylen Jones said:

The fact that another male knows what she is like in bed....

Re this^^, what makes you believe that the way she is with you sexually was the way she was with him?

With you, the sex means something!

With him it meant nothing.  He had (well still has lol) a penis, period.  It was a 'one-off' while on vacay..

Jmo, but given she admitted to having no romantic or even sexual feelings for him, that they've been just friends for years, she is encouraging you to meet him and become friends yourself, I find it hard to believe that he experienced her true sexual self and knows what she's like in bed..

The way she is with YOU.

So maybe if you can somehow get that crazy thought out of your head, you might feel better about it?

Just a thought.  

[ShySoul]

39 minutes ago, Waylen Jones said:

I guess the issue is jealousy. The fact that another male knows what she is like in bed and will be sharing the same space as me since he isn't going anywhere. So you can say it's a territorial thing as well. I don't care about any previous men she was with or what she did with them, because they aren't around today. This 1 person is the only anomaly.

Your jealousy is understandable. You don't want to think of your partner with someone else. To look at another guy and know he was that person with her, its not something pleasant. Even when you don't want to think of it, the thoughts can enter your head. So don't feel you are wrong for thinking like this.

I actually think you are being very understanding and accepting of her, which is the most important thing. Keep in mind that you are the one in the relationship with her, not him. That was one night. You get every night. That was just physical. You get to connect on emotional levels as well.Its not about him, it's about what is happening between the two of you.

Time helps. It will be odd at first. But when you see there is nothing between them beyond friendship, it can help put your mind at ease. If you get to know him, you might even begin to like him. 

[ShySoul]

5 minutes ago, rainbowsandroses said:

With you, the sex means something!

With him it meant nothing.  He had (well still has lol) a penis, period.  It was a 'one-off' while on vacay..

Jmo, but given she admitted to having no romantic or even sexual feelings for him, that they've been just friends for years, she is encouraging you to meet him and become friends yourself, I find it hard to believe that he experienced her true sexual self and knows what she's like in bed..

The way she is with YOU.

Exactly

[Waylen Jones]

15 minutes ago, rainbowsandroses said:

Re this^^, what makes you believe that the way she is with you sexually was the way she was with him?

With you, the sex means something!

With him it meant nothing.  He had (well still has lol) a penis, period.  It was a 'one-off' while on vacay..

Jmo, but given she admitted to having no romantic or even sexual feelings for him, that they've been just friends for years, she is encouraging you to meet him and become friends yourself, I find it hard to believe that he experienced her true sexual self and knows what she's like in bed..

The way she is with YOU.

So maybe if you can somehow get that crazy thought out of your head, you might feel better about it?

Just a thought.  

You are right. And it's still hard for me to accept right now but my logical side of my brain knows all the facts point to it being a 1 night mistake.

Thank you, I will try to keep this in mind.

[MissCanuck]

I don't think this is only about jealousy. 

You have just learned she has completely different sexual boundaries than you do.  She also has different boundaries in friendship than you do. Most people don't have sex with their friends. Sure, it can happen - but now they're still very close. They can all pretend like it didn't happen, but it did. No putting that toothpaste back in the tube. 

How will you feel when you someday meet this guy? I highly doubt you are going to be comfortable sitting across from him over a beer whrn you know he's also been inside your girlfriend. Are you? Same goes for his girlfriend. 

I am not sure I would be interested in continuing with someone who has such different boundaries than I do. It points to an incompatibility. Up to you. 

[DarkCh0c0]

1 hour ago, MissCanuck said:

I don't think this is only about jealousy. 

You have just learned she has completely different sexual boundaries than you do.  She also has different boundaries in friendship than you do. Most people don't have sex with their friends. Sure, it can happen - but now they're still very close. They can all pretend like it didn't happen, but it did. No putting that toothpaste back in the tube. 

How will you feel when you someday meet this guy? I highly doubt you are going to be comfortable sitting across from him over a beer whrn you know he's also been inside your girlfriend. Are you? Same goes for his girlfriend. 

I am not sure I would be interested in continuing with someone who has such different boundaries than I do. It points to an incompatibility. Up to you. 

100%.

I share the same opinion on this matter.

The lack of friendship and sexual boundaries is a deal breaker for me. Such a turn off.

OP, it's up to you to figure out if you can get past this. Your feelings are absolutely valid and you need to be in tune with them to figure out the next best step for you.

[smackie9]

If it happened years ago I wouldn't really care. People have their one time experiences. Not always a reason to condemn them. This is pretty fresh tho and would be a deal breaker for me. 

[yogacat]

8 hours ago, MissCanuck said:

I don't think this is only about jealousy. 

You have just learned she has completely different sexual boundaries than you do.  She also has different boundaries in friendship than you do. Most people don't have sex with their friends. Sure, it can happen - but now they're still very close. They can all pretend like it didn't happen, but it did. No putting that toothpaste back in the tube. 

How will you feel when you someday meet this guy? I highly doubt you are going to be comfortable sitting across from him over a beer whrn you know he's also been inside your girlfriend. Are you? Same goes for his girlfriend. 

I am not sure I would be interested in continuing with someone who has such different boundaries than I do. It points to an incompatibility. Up to you. 

This 💯 percent.

Your girlfriend was involved in a group sex situation with her best friend and his girlfriend. She doesn’t seem too concerned about it either.

That being said, if you can’t get over this then end things and move on. You can not be in love with someone that you can never fully trust. She has different boundaries and sexual tendencies than you. That’s totally fine but this is very recent so you may want to consider taking it slow and really getting to know her. If I knew this information about someone I hadn’t even invested a few months into I’d be turned off.

A red flag in my opinion is she’s still keeping in contact with the person she had the orgy with, even if not directly. If I were her I wouldn’t do that.  Not saying she’s untrustworthy, but knowing your partner had group sex with their best friend and his gf is not something that vanishes from your thoughts or feelings. That’s a big mental leap and a hard one to take. 

It’s not about ignoring it, but accepting it as a part of her past. It’s hard, and I can only imagine how you feel after her sharing this with you.

Also, she admitted that she was more attracted to the girlfriend in the situation, which could also potentially be something to consider. Is she open to polyamory or other forms of non-monogamy? And, most importantly, are you? If not, it may be a fundamental incompatibility that could cause issues in the future.

[Kwothe28]

You are perfectly within the reason to not like that she slept with her best friend. Or that she was in an orgy. It’s called boundaries. Dont think those are hard to not be done since I reckon many people weren't in orgies or slept with people who are close to them. There is no shame in not liking the person actions even if they are in the past. As they are sometimes indicator what will happen in future. For example, what if she desires to sleep with her buddy and his girlfriend again? Would you in her life stop her? 

[rainbowsandroses]

I suppose some people are more forgiving of one-offs than others, especially when on vacay to an exotic island when single. 

It was a year ago not recently and imo does not reflect what her boundaries are when in an exclusive relationship with someone she cares about.  In this case, you.

Or even with him after returning to their home turf. 

When traveling through Europe with my BFF years ago, we did some "things" together that we would never have done otherwise and we both have very strong boundaries when in a relationships and with each orher. 

This is all ego for you and feeling "territorial" you've admitted it!

I dunno, to dump a woman you're extremely attracted to and she to you, who's the most giving woman you've ever been with and who has 9/10 of the qualities you seek over a 'one off' that happened a year ago when single seems ludicrous to me..

It sounds like you feel you are in competition with this man and you shouldn't be imo, they have been friends for a decade, the sex that night meant nothing, she's open and desires the two of you to become friends in your own right.

What are you afraid of?   

 

[yogacat]

C'mon, people have their limits. It's not about forgiving a one-time orgy at all. It's about different comfort levels, different values, and different communication styles.

If he isn't ok with that type of sexuality, he isn't. Period. No one has to be ok or wrong or forgiven. It's isn't black and white, it's different comfort levels, to wildly generalize. She shared something she found pleasurable the 1st time since she was young and drunk on a holiday. He's finding the sharing of details difficult to process which would be a trigger for some people.

She's shared and surprised to see a lack of shared interest in it along with a interest in moving along a relationship while respecting his disclosed past.

I'm not sure he owes her anything but also not sure he should dismiss a possible lifetime partner because of a past experience most people wouldn't dream of have happening per se.

I get that she wants to keep the past in the past, but he may to want to know much more than she's been willing to share thus far.
 

[Waylen Jones]

7 hours ago, DarkCh0c0 said:

The lack of friendship and sexual boundaries is a deal breaker for me. Such a turn off.

It is a turn off. Something I of course wish never happened. In every relationship I've been in there was something that I wish never happened. It seems impossible to find the perfect person who doesn't have a sketchy past. Especially the older I get.

[rainbowsandroses]

5 minutes ago, yogacat said:

It's not about forgiving a one-time orgy at all. It's about different comfort levels, different values, and different communication styles.

^^Exactly and he said she meets 9/10 of what he seeks in that regard.

He's admitted it's ego, jealousy and pride and I'm sorry if you don't agree but imo these are idiotic reasons to end a relationship with someone you care about, who cares about you, is giving and caring and who possesses 9/10 of the qualities you seek and desire in a partner.

There are no perfect people, we all or many of us have things in our closet we may have done and regretted that are part of our past that have zero to do with who we are today especially when meeting someone special.

Judge not lest ye be judged - Matthew 5-7.

Whatever.

 

 

[Waylen Jones]

52 minutes ago, smackie9 said:

If it happened years ago I wouldn't really care. People have their one time experiences. Not always a reason to condemn them. This is pretty fresh tho and would be a deal breaker for me. 

I said that to her as well. I'd feel better if it happened maybe 5/6 years ago. But it happened 13 months ago and to me that seems super fresh. To her she feels like she has grown a lot in the last year and feels like it was very long time ago. So I guess it's all about perspective.

[yogacat]

5 minutes ago, rainbowsandroses said:

^^Exactly and he said she meets 9/10 of what he seeks in that regard.

He's admitted it's ego, jealousy and pride and I'm sorry if you don't agree but imo these are idiotic reasons to end a relationship with someone you care about, who cares about you, is giving and caring and who possesses 9/10 of the qualities you seek and desire in a partner.

There are no perfect people, we all or many of us have things in our closet we may have done and regretted that are part of our past that have zero to do with who we are today especially when meeting someone special.

Judge not lest ye be judged - Matthew 5-7.

Whatever.

 

 

But this is too much for him? Why does he have to be castorized for it? 

He is entitled to his own feelings, to be free of worry, to have her very recent sexcapades not affect him as she is keeping ongoing contact with the main sexual partner in this group sex romp. This behavior by her is a deal breaker for him whether or not you believe that to be justified.

It would be better for her too to find someone that doesn't have a problem with it.

[rainbowsandroses]

1 minute ago, Waylen Jones said:

It is a turn off. 

Earlier you said it wasn't a turn off, that you are still highly attracted to her.  That it was about ego, pride and jealousy.

When did that change?

[Waylen Jones]

50 minutes ago, yogacat said:

This 💯 percent.

Your girlfriend was involved in a group sex situation with her best friend and his girlfriend. She doesn’t seem too concerned about it either.

That being said, if you can’t get over this then end things and move on. You can not be in love with someone that you can never fully trust. She has different boundaries and sexual tendencies than you. That’s totally fine but this is very recent so you may want to consider taking it slow and really getting to know her. If I knew this information about someone I hadn’t even invested a few months into I’d be turned off.

A red flag in my opinion is she’s still keeping in contact with the person she had the orgy with, even if not directly. If I were her I wouldn’t do that.  Not saying she’s untrustworthy, but knowing your partner had group sex with their best friend and his gf is not something that vanishes from your thoughts or feelings. That’s a big mental leap and a hard one to take. 

It’s not about ignoring it, but accepting it as a part of her past. It’s hard, and I can only imagine how you feel after her sharing this with you.

Also, she admitted that she was more attracted to the girlfriend in the situation, which could also potentially be something to consider. Is she open to polyamory or other forms of non-monogamy? And, most importantly, are you? If not, it may be a fundamental incompatibility that could cause issues in the future.

I agree taking it slower than I originally wanted might be best. I don't feel like this is a cause for me to never trust her at all.

And she's still keeping in touch with him because they have been lifelong friends, this isn't some random guy she just met on the trip. And as far as the girl, we talked about that and she said she could never see herself with a woman seriously. She likes the sexual aspect of woman but strongly doesn't want anything more.

It is a hugee mental leap and I feel so many things about it so thank you for being empathetic and trying to understand. On one hand I see her as the innocent person she always was in my eyes who checked almost all of my boxes and on the other hand I see a person I've never met before and it's hard to rationalize that these two people are the exact same person.

[rainbowsandroses]

7 minutes ago, yogacat said:

But this is too much for him? Why does he have to be castorized for it? 

I'm not castorizing him, I'm stating an opinion.

He did say he was seeking ways to get past this, past his jealousy and allowing his ego to drive his ship so thought I'd offer a different perspective from the standard "dump her" that's all.

Of course he should do what he wants and what's best for him without being judged for it.

 

[Waylen Jones]

9 minutes ago, rainbowsandroses said:

Earlier you said it wasn't a turn off, that you are still highly attracted to her.  That it was about ego, pride and jealousy.

When did that change?

The act of participating in an orgy itself was not, and still isn't a turn off to me. I should have been more specific by saying the fact she is best-friends with someone she had sex with is a red flag to me.