Relationship Drama

[gryffindor28]

I am a female in my early twenties and my bf is the same age as me. We have been arguing about an incident and each of us takes our own side and our friends support our own side as well, so I figured we'd get some impartial opinions. 

Basically at the start of our relationship, over the summer, I really wanted to swim like I usually did before dating him. I asked him every weekend if we could go and always brought my swimsuit, but he always turned me down by making excuses, dodging the question, or just ignoring me. Eventually, I stopped asking him. 

 

But, I still did want to swim and where I lived it wasn't possible for me to swim, so one day I texted my male friend if we could go swimming. This male friend is the same age as me and to be clear, we DID NOT have a history. He was NOT an ex, although he did like me and asked me out in the past, but I declined. We never did anything romantic or sexual together, and I swam with him before I got in a relationship. He said we could swim when I wanted to but I never planned a date or got back to him, it was just a thought. 

 

A few days later, it was the 4th of July. I was excited to see my bf because we had planned to go to a party and see fireworks. The day of, he cancelled and said he was too tired because he had just gotten back from a vacation abroad (we live 1 hour apart from each other and he would have to pick me up). He was going to go to the party without me. I understood and I decided to go to a local park with my brother to see fireworks. This same male friend lives right next to the park so I figured we would all go together. Before I left, I told my boyfriend where I was going and who my friend was and he was OK with it. So, my brother and I went over to his place and we watched Youtube and each had a screwdriver (5% alc). No one was drunk, nothing happened, in fact the whole night I talked about my boyfriend. We hung out at his place for about an hour, saw the fireworks at the park, then left. Of note, my friend did offer to go swimming while we were there, but I did not bring a swimsuit. He asked if I'd like to borrow one so we could go, and I declined again, realizing it was the wrong thing to do/inappropriate. The very next day, he texted me again that we should swim sometime but then I ghosted. 

 

A week later, my boyfriend found out after going through my texts, since I didn't delete them or try to cover it up, as I did not think I had done something wrong. I came clean and explained that I really wanted to swim and he constantly turned me down, so I reached out to this friend instead, but ultimately decided against it. I did not think I was in the wrong because I had no unfaithful/impure intentions and I didn't even follow through with the swimming. I apologized and I recognized that what I did was wrong, but I also reminded him that he wasn't there for me when I asked him to swim or hang out on the 4th. 

 

He said he wished I had asked him to swim more urgently and made it clear that I HAD to go. He also admitted that he doesn't like swimming/going to the beach like me. At first, he felt betrayed that I talked to this guy who liked me in the past and he didn't want to forgive me. At one point though, he said he understood and that he knows girls who would have broken up with their bf if their bf did not do an activity they really liked with them. He apologized and asked me what are some things I like doing so we can do more of them together. Things were looking better. 

 

Then, he changed his mind because his friends didn't take my side and took his instead. He said I manipulated him into thinking it's his fault and he cannot forgive me. 

 

Basically, I'd like to know how you all perceive the situation. I'd also like to add that this was an isolated event, our relationship at this point in time was doing great outside this event. Who's way of thinking is flawed? Are we both wrong? How should we go from here? What is a fair resolution? 

[smackie9]

 IMO if you have to rely on other people to go have a good time and do things you like, you need to find a different BF. Your BF is neglectful, and how dare he accuse you of manipulation when it was HIM that manipulated the situation blaming you, that you weren't firm enough with him about wanting to go swimming. He's being a jerk, especially now siding with what his friends say, reneging on your settlement of the situation. This will not get resolved. Dump him, you are so better off without him and his crap and his crappy friends opinions. I have to add if you have a BF that searches through your phone...you better get rid of him. He doesn't trust you and that is how he feels about you....you can never be trusted. 

[Andrina]

When he's saying he can't forgive you, I don't understand why you're asking what should happen now. Doesn't that mean you're broken up?

I'm assuming you two are very young, since yeah, there is a lot of immature drama going on here and two people not knowing how to navigate a healthy relationship.

Moving forward, this is what you should do for any future relationships:

Before deciding to become exclusive with someone, first see if you both share the same relationship rules, which includes with whom of the opposite sex it's okay to communicate and hang out with, and whom you're not comfortable for that happening because of certain circumstances. In most cases, there's no right or wrong, just an agreement that both are comfortable with. If you have opposite views on that, it'll never work.

As for him, I think it's lame to cancel a holiday date with you but go with others, but also, that would've been 3 hours of driving time for him, so if you don't have your own transportation, is it really doable to be dating someone this far away?

Did you not have any female friends to ask to go to the beach? Were you trying to punish him by going with a guy who used to have a crush on you? If your bf knew this, and he's never been introduced to this man to feel comfortable with the friendship you have with him (if he's normally not unjustifiably jealous), then I think you were in the wrong.

Many youthful relationships end while people are learning who is right for them and who isn't. If he's going by what his friends are telling him versus how he feels about you, he doesn't care to the extent you need from a partner. Either that or your behavior was deal breaking to him. 

[Batya33]

If I wanted to do an activity like swimming with a male friend I think that's fine and I'm not sure what was inappropriate about possibly borrowing a swimsuit.  I would be ok with my husband going swimming with a female friend at a pool -like if they were both going to do laps and she could get him into a nice pool.  But if it's a one on one trip to a beach where you're going to hang out together all day and swim in the ocean that's more date like -and that could be ok too if your partner knew this guy and especially if it was a group going to the beach including other women you could have your chair/blanket next to.  It's just a different- vibe.  

Honestly given his reactions I think the swimming thing is not the real issue.  But yes if you love an activity and your partner does not that's fine but be careful about it looking like it's actually the person you're going with you're more into than the activity.  

[bluecastle]

Just so I'm understanding this all correctly: Everything you've outlined here happened a year ago and you're still arguing over it? That in and of itself is concerning, maybe more than any of the details here. 

But diving into those details: The thing that strikes me as most out of line in the whole story is the moment when your bf looked through your phone. Why? The answer seems to be what the answer most often is when people look through phones: Your bf is immature and very insecure, was convinced you were "up to something," and, rather than talk to you like an adult, searched for proof. And so thirsty for proof was he that he latched onto the tiniest of crumbs—the business with the swimming that never happened and shouldn't be some huge big thing even if it did.

In your shoes? I would be livid that he looked through the phone—that's immediate eject button stuff for me—and livid that he's guilted you into thinking you did something wrong. You didn't. What you did—or almost did—is something he was uncomfortable with. Fine. Happens plenty, especially in the early days of a relationship, when you're both still carving out the boundaries of the whole thing. In another circumstance, the result of all this would have been a good talk where you both got a little clearer on that and moved forward—or, recognizing your differences, opted not to. 

Alas, that didn't happen.

Where to go from here? What's resolution look like? To my eyes it comes down to the question of when your bf feels like growing up. He's young now, I get it, and he may very well look back at this from the vantage point of 28 or 35 and cringe at his insecurities. Then again, there are plenty of people in their 50s, 60s, 70s who are wildly jealous, who look through phones, and who believe every interaction with the opposite sex is loaded with hot sauce. In ways, it sounds like your bf's initial response was rather mature, and promising, though less promising is that a few bros carping in his ear was enough to revert back to a caveman mentality about the whole thing. 

All in all, I go back to what I said at the beginning: It's been a year. You've talked it out, pulled every thread. If that hasn't brought you two closer, and to a place where you both now agree on what is acceptable inside your relationship, it's awfully hard to see a way to another side. 

 

 

 

[Capricorn3]

I have nothing more to add to all the above comments, other than to say I second them all.  He needs to be an EX.

[gryffindor28]

@Andrina Thank you for your reply. To answer some of your questions, the transportation issue is now resolved and I did not hang out with the guy to make him jealous. For me, I have always had guy friends that I have a strictly platonic relationship with and so I did not think my actions would be so hurtful to him as I had no bad intentions. To me this was just an activity I like doing that I couldn't do with my bf after multiple attempts so I resorted to a friend (most of my friends are male). He was not introduced to him in the past. To be clear, my bf and I had never defined those boundaries in the past (although he knew I was going to see a male friend for the 4th). I realized what I did made him uncomfortable even though I didn't follow through, I apologized, and never did it again and he hasn't been able to forgive me. Do you think that is a fair reaction on his part? To me this is an immature thing that happened at the start of our relationship I expected us to easily move past. 

You bring up an important issue we've had about hanging out with opposite gender. To me, it has never bothered me and I think a man/woman can have a platonic relationship. However, it does bother him. One time, I asked him if I could have lunch with a male friend that he HAD been introduced to and who's never liked me and he said yes. Afterwards, he was angry with me because he said I pressured him into saying yes. In a healthy relationship is it OK for one partner to restrict all contact with the opposite sex? 

[gryffindor28]

@Batya33 What do you think the real issue is? I agree with you. I did not think it was bad for me to swim with a friend who is a male, I declined in the end because I knew it would hurt him. I think he felt especially hurt because the guy had liked me in the past and so he interpreted it more like cheating, even though I had rejected this friend multiple times and he put his feelings aside and we remained platonic friends for years. I think the other concern for him was the nature of swimming (i.e. minimal clothing). What are your thoughts on this as a married woman? 

[gryffindor28]

@bluecastle Yes, this happened a while ago. Can I ask if you are a male or female? Also, the reason why he is so offended is because this guy liked me in the past, even though I rejected him and we remained platonic friends. He also scrolled to messages that guy had sent me a year ago before I was even dating him that he said were "suggestive emojis" and was angry I would ask to swim with him even though I never had a sexual or romantic relationship with that guy, and I didn't even REMEMBER those messages. Finally, he was offended because I would be wearing a bikini around that guy who liked me in the past. He was angry that I wore one with that guy before we dated. What are your thoughts on that? 

[Morello]

I think it was a bit inappropriate for you to go swimming with a guy who has romantic feelings for you. That's inviting trouble into your relationship. I wouldn't be comfortable with that if my wife did the same, to be honest.

But having said that, there seems to be more disconnect than just this single event, so it's probably more like a symptom than a cause.

[gryffindor28]

@Morello Thank you for your response! I understand that and I knew it would make him uncomfortable so I didn't swim with anyone, despite asking 

[Tinydance]

Well, to be honest I think you're both kind of in the wrong. My belief is that you shouldn't be pressuring your partner to do an activity with you that they're not into. I think it was quite obvious that your boyfriend isn't into swimming, it's just not his thing. I think in that case, yes you can go swimming with other people because he's not interested. I also don't really understand why you can't just go swimming by yourself? I understand it's more fun to go with other people but it's also the sort of activity that someone can do alone.

What I see a red flag with is that your boyfriend was going through your phone. I don't think that anyone has the right to go through anyone's phone. Even if they suspect something, they should talk to their partner directly and try to sort it out. Going through someone's phone is a violation of privacy. It also sounds to me like you're pretty upfront about what you're up to, who you're talking to, etc. So your boyfriend doesn't really need to look at your phone because you're not hiding anything.

I think that unfortunately you and your boyfriend have very different views on opposite gender friends. It doesn’t sound like your boyfriend is OK with you having male friends. Which is actually a problem if most of your friends are male. I do understand though why he got suspicious about this particular friend. This friend used to like you in the past. Also you'd be swimming in a bathing suit, presumably even a bikini. A guy is likely to check you out, especially a guy who used to be into you. Your boyfriend obviously knows how guys think because he is one lol

[Kwothe28]

5 hours ago, gryffindor28 said:

Also, the reason why he is so offended is because this guy liked me in the past, even though I rejected him and we remained platonic friends.

That guy is not your friend, that guy is an "orbiter". Somebody who you put into friendzone and who waits his opportunity when you break up with your boyfriend to try to be with you. You are young so you probably dont think about that too much, but there is no friendship there.

On the other hand I dont agree with your boyfriend jealousy and how he does things. You are both young so you are probably not very emotionally intelligent to handle some stuff in the right way. But its still not a good way to handle this.

[Batya33]

9 hours ago, gryffindor28 said:

@Batya33 What do you think the real issue is? I agree with you. I did not think it was bad for me to swim with a friend who is a male, I declined in the end because I knew it would hurt him. I think he felt especially hurt because the guy had liked me in the past and so he interpreted it more like cheating, even though I had rejected this friend multiple times and he put his feelings aside and we remained platonic friends for years. I think the other concern for him was the nature of swimming (i.e. minimal clothing). What are your thoughts on this as a married woman? 

I think it's what Bluecastle wrote.  The lunch anecdote is another example. 

 My thoughts on this as a woman -not just a married woman -I've had platonic male friends for over 40 years (and before that but that's-kids!) and I'm 57.  My husband has had platonic female friends for all that time including one woman he dated who I am also friends with separately.. We still do. 

Swimming requires a bathing suit. I would think differently if you went to lunch with your platonic friend in a sports bra and short shorts "just because".  Because there is an appearance of impropriety -it's not a good look to go to a romantic dinner restaurant on a Saturday night with a platonic male friend.  Or to go to his home alone and get drunk.  For example.  Even if nothing happens.  It's somewhat about respect. 

In general each couple has to decide boundaries -mine are - no date like activities.  I have to have the opportunity to meet the friend and she has to be supportive of our relationship.  Having said that I said yes to him meeting an ex for dinner when he was in her city because they had a professional connection, and it was important to maintain that. She absolutely wasn't supportive of our relationship in the past but that was the past and now she was happily married. And knew he was as well. 

But my husband was uncomfortable -before we were married -with my meeting a platonic male friend an hour earlier than our planned group outing on a weekend night (so my husband could meet him) to have a personal conversation he requested.  The platonic male friend totally understood and went out of his way to befriend my husband.  I  then put my husband first. I knew my male friend totally supported my new relationship with my future husband.

It's a case by case sometimes but with a foundation of -trust (which was lacking with the two of  you) and respect (also lacking as Bluecastle wrote)

I think your assumption that what happened here means couples restrict all contact is a faulty one - truth is some do and  some are very happy and content to do so -that's great for them -I mean it!. I wouldn't be able to do that in a relationship and be happy.

  But the real issue was he was trying to control  you in general - and burden you with his insecurities by reacting that way.

Editing this to add - I read what Kwok and Tinydance said.  I am not into swimming -I was in the past -my husband is and when he travels he goes for a swim (business travel).  He also takes our son including in the ocean.  If he wanted to plan to go swimming with a platonic female friend while he was traveling (meaning a friend attending the same business event) I would find it odd and likely be uncomfortable.  But if it was a group thing to go snorkeling or on a boat where you're wearing beach attire - I mean fine -no matter who would be around (and also he doesn't get drunk or tipsy ever). 

Or if the female friend was there with her young kids and asked my husband to come along so she could have some company (and some help watching the kids!) totally fine.  I too find it odd that you need company for swimming which is why I referenced the beach -it's different to wear a bikini and go with a male friend for a beach day which will include riding the waves/going into the ocean -that's not just swimming. And since he did send  you suggestive texts in the past the environment might make me uncomfortable.  

[Andrina]

11 hours ago, gryffindor28 said:

I apologized, and never did it again and he hasn't been able to forgive me. Do you think that is a fair reaction on his part?

In a healthy relationship, when there's a disagreement, the purpose should be to come to a consensus each can be satisfied with and put the matter to rest. So since he's been regularly bringing this up then that is punishment and something you should not be tolerating.

11 hours ago, gryffindor28 said:

One time, I asked him if I could have lunch with a male friend that he HAD been introduced to and who's never liked me and he said yes. Afterwards, he was angry with me because he said I pressured him into saying yes. In a healthy relationship is it OK for one partner to restrict all contact with the opposite sex? 

With that last question, if you told him that the survey says in healthy relationships, each can hang out with opposite gender friends, that he will admit he's wrong and now everything will be fine between you two?

As I earlier said, if a couple has opposing views on that subject, it'll never work. Much as you care about him, you're living a life in a toxic environment of arguments that will continue because you two aren't compatible. Free yourself to eventually find a man who is compatible with you in all the major ways, plus doesn't hound you about one mistake during the one precious life you have on this planet.

[catfeeder]

20 hours ago, Andrina said:

When he's saying he can't forgive you, I don't understand why you're asking what should happen now. Doesn't that mean you're broken up?

I second this ^^^. I wouldn't even want a BF who didn't trust me, much less one who would go through my phone, or rally people against me.

Skip that, and skip him. A relationship means being on the same team--not adversaries. If someone is unwilling to work through a disagreement so that the 'relationship' can win, he'd be of no value to me.

[gryffindor28]

@Tinydance @Batya33 Thank you for your replies. you both brought up that I could have gone swimming alone. The only reason I reached out to this friend is because he has access to a swimming pool. I do not, so I could not go alone. My bf does, but he didn't want to and didn't tell me directly. 

[Batya33]

24 minutes ago, gryffindor28 said:

@Tinydance @Batya33 Thank you for your replies. you both brought up that I could have gone swimming alone. The only reason I reached out to this friend is because he has access to a swimming pool. I do not, so I could not go alone. My bf does, but he didn't want to and didn't tell me directly. 

Maybe consider joining your local Y or community center for pool access?

[LootieTootie]

If you both have been arguing about this for a year and both or one of you is still holding this as "unforgivable" ... then I'm sad to be the bearer of bad news, but this relationship is doomed.

 

[TeeDee]

When you say your BF has access to a pool what do you mean?  Does he have one at his apartment complex or something?  If so he's kind of a jerk for not letting you swim when you clearly like it so much. 

My husband hates to swim & hates the beach.  We do go a couple of times per year.  We joined a beach club.  I go all day & he comes down around 4-5 pm when the sun is setting & we have cocktails.  We also take cruises.  I get beach & he gets all sorts of other activities.  

You & this guy need to find compromises that work for you. 

I do go to the beach with groups & female friends but I avoid going with me & 1 other guy where possible.