First "date" confusion

[kim42]

7 minutes ago, NighttimeNightmare said:

You’re doing it too!!!!!!

I know I've been silent too - I replied to one of your comments a little earlier and explained why I think there's a difference between me and him in this situation. 

 

[Wiseman2]

42 minutes ago, kim42 said:

It's hard for me to believe that someone who's interested would go silent for 11 days 

He's probably thinking the same thing. You can play the "it's your turn" game but I'm not sure how that's helping. A quick friendly text is not "chasing" anyone. 

[Batya33]

1 hour ago, kim42 said:

I know it's bad, and I don't expect him or any other man to text me all the time.

It's hard for me to believe that someone who's interested would go silent for 11 days but there are some very interesting comments over here that help me to look at this from a different perspective.

My future husband did for around 7 days 18 years ago this month-ish.  Between our second platonic meet up and (unscheduled third).  Prior to that after our first meet up he called me a few days later to ask me to the theater that weekend.  At the second I knew he was supposed to leave town in a couple of weeks, for a couple of months, with a business trip in between.  I'd baked him cookies and a day or so later emailed him to ask him if his parents had enjoyed -he said he was visiting them the next day.  He said he'd decided they were too good to share with them lol.  

But then -silence. A week later -I figured what the heck  -made up a lame excuse to email again -partly the "hope you have a good [business] trip" I knew he was taking.  Also that iroinically I'd had a strange dream and he'd been in it (totally G-rated, yes it was true)

Well he emailed back that he'd call me that day or the next.  He did and asked if we could meet up - two weeks in advance - when he'd be back in town.  Specific evening, etc.  I said yes.  I'm really not sure how often we communicated till then -he had  flip phone, I had no phone.  Next meet up was when he asked me to get back together.

I speculate that he didn't call because he was tying up loose ends re: an ex - plus very busy at work -and trying to decide if he should ask me to get back together while still in town or wait a few months.  Do I know for sure? No.  I do know he wasn't seeing anyone else or wanting to.  Obvious.  Do I think he would have called me eventually -for sure, yes - when - I don't know.  Also -so you know - I didn't ask him ever about the "gap" in time -because it was irrelevant not because I was worried.

Bottom line -constant communication/chatting doesn't mean interest in seriously dating - it could be boredom, could be habit, etc.  

[NighttimeNightmare]

1 hour ago, kim42 said:

I know I've been silent too - I replied to one of your comments a little earlier and explained why I think there's a difference between me and him in this situation. 

 

I read it and thought it interesting your brain seems to dump everything I’m saying and you route back around to, “I know I’m doing it too but let me explain to you how it’s different when I do it!”

 

You won’t convince me this isn’t anxiety related, not founded on any real evidence that would hold up. I don’t doubt that some his behavior may have shifted, my doubt is that you have some super power as to why that is without even consulting him. 
 

like I said, had he left you on read I’d feel very differently, but that isn’t what happened.  You’ve both been silent, but you’ve come up With a million justifications as to why it means one thing when you do it, and another when he does it.  Even if you were to actually text him and he says he’s no longer interested, it wouldn’t give you basis to say “see, I knew it” because your methodology of “detective work” is flawed 

 

I did this same thing in my thread. I ran around and round in circles about the woman I’ve got a crush on. She had not called or texted in over a week, I used it as “proof” she wasn’t interested. “If she were interested she’d call or text. It’s different. She’s never done this before.”  I hurt my own feelings and vented in my thread. Then one day I woke up and thought, “wait, I haven’t called or texted either.”  I decided to bite the bullet and reach out. She seemed surprised to hear from me and ended up inviting me out. 
 

my point is, anxiety isn’t trustworthy and it blinds you from the truth.  There’s many reasons things may have shifted with this guy, and you’re holding him to some weird rule book that he isn’t privy to. You want him to text first, and text constantly, and be all of these things in order for you to even consider believing anything other than your own fatalistic views 
 

but if you want to keep saying you “know” how he feels, by all means keep doing it, but it’s sort of a sh*tty thing to do. At least practice rephrasing it to “I think he’s doing this, and it may be my anxiety.”  You’ve not asked him so how the heck do you know? 

[Batya33]

I wanted to add - no I would not have asked (in the situation I wrote about) whether he wanted to see me again.  Even though he asked twice.  I knew he was leaving town  in a month, for months and that was partly why - what's the point?  I was willing to reach out again, show interest.  I felt almost totally in the dark as far as whether he was romantically interested in me again.  I mean -I thought -maybe - but nothing like "oh he wants to actually date me".  But -I wanted to date him! So I reached out.

[Jaunty]

Well I will pipe in one final time on this:  I do NOT think it's in the OP's best interests to ask him again.  I think she's made her interest known to him to an extent even farther than she's probably shared on this site.  He's remained more circumspect, at least from my take on things.  

The thing is ... they are long distance.  They live in different countries.  The OP has issues with anxiety which she has demonstrated over the course of this thread.   

Would any further reasons to nurture hope (and sort of obsessive rumination) for this to turn into some kind of romance benefit the OP?  I'm thinking not.

And, if I'm wrong, and if he wants to reach out and initiate some type of LDR, the door is still open.  

 

[boltnrun]

I'm the type who would rather know. No head in the sand for me. So I would send a text asking if he thinks he's going to make it later this month. If the answer is no at least I would know. Instead of anxiously presuming what he's thinking. 

[Jaunty]

1 hour ago, boltnrun said:

I'm the type who would rather know. No head in the sand for me. So I would send a text asking if he thinks he's going to make it later this month. If the answer is no at least I would know. Instead of anxiously presuming what he's thinking. 

I see the merit in that, including for the OP.  I just think she's been in this rabbit hole quite a while... 

 

[NighttimeNightmare]

3 hours ago, Jaunty said:

Would any further reasons to nurture hope (and sort of obsessive rumination) for this to turn into some kind of romance benefit the OP?  I'm thinking not.

Being direct is not “nurturing hope,” if she were direct she could come face to face with the truth and make peace with it, whatever the outcome  

 

56 minutes ago, Jaunty said:

I just think she's been in this rabbit hole quite a while..

Yes and until she learns to be direct and face reality she will be back here doing this same anxious rumination regarding the next guy 

 

That’s why I’m convinced (1) she doesn’t know how he’s feeling (2) she should ask to find out instead of choosing her anxiety hole (3) she should accept the outcome, whatever it may be 

Her learning to be direct will counteract the anxiety spirals where she’s making up all sorts of sh*t to herself 

 

[kim42]

I realize it's silly to assume things instead of asking him. If it was someone else im my situation, I'd advise them to ask directly instead of analyzing all possibilities.

Thank you for your patience with me, I know many of you said that sending him a message is not chasing him. I think my fear of coming across as needy is too strong. I realize that I've done this in the past too - with different men in different situations, that instead of communicating directly, I would just assume things and let my fears paralyze me.

[kim42]

12 hours ago, NighttimeNightmare said:

I read it and thought it interesting your brain seems to dump everything I’m saying and you route back around to, “I know I’m doing it too but let me explain to you how it’s different when I do it!”

 

You won’t convince me this isn’t anxiety related, not founded on any real evidence that would hold up. I don’t doubt that some his behavior may have shifted, my doubt is that you have some super power as to why that is without even consulting him. 
 

like I said, had he left you on read I’d feel very differently, but that isn’t what happened.  You’ve both been silent, but you’ve come up With a million justifications as to why it means one thing when you do it, and another when he does it.  Even if you were to actually text him and he says he’s no longer interested, it wouldn’t give you basis to say “see, I knew it” because your methodology of “detective work” is flawed 

 

I did this same thing in my thread. I ran around and round in circles about the woman I’ve got a crush on. She had not called or texted in over a week, I used it as “proof” she wasn’t interested. “If she were interested she’d call or text. It’s different. She’s never done this before.”  I hurt my own feelings and vented in my thread. Then one day I woke up and thought, “wait, I haven’t called or texted either.”  I decided to bite the bullet and reach out. She seemed surprised to hear from me and ended up inviting me out. 
 

my point is, anxiety isn’t trustworthy and it blinds you from the truth.  There’s many reasons things may have shifted with this guy, and you’re holding him to some weird rule book that he isn’t privy to. You want him to text first, and text constantly, and be all of these things in order for you to even consider believing anything other than your own fatalistic views 
 

but if you want to keep saying you “know” how he feels, by all means keep doing it, but it’s sort of a sh*tty thing to do. At least practice rephrasing it to “I think he’s doing this, and it may be my anxiety.”  You’ve not asked him so how the heck do you know? 

He's never ignored any of my messages and was always very quick to reply.

I admit I need a lot of reassurance in these situations, I tend to have all these negative thoughts.

[Wiseman2]

9 minutes ago, kim42 said:

. I think my fear of coming across as needy is too strong

It's ok to be nervous about a potential new crush however a bit of insight into how your "anxiety" could make you come across as icy and playing games could help you. 

He doesn't have to confirm plans that were never actually made.  And yes you could err on the side of being warm friendly and approachable and shoot him a friendly text. But that would take courage and confidence. 

Unfortunately if your GFs are telling you to make men jump through an inordinate amount of hoops and icy behavior to assure that they're chasing you rather than you chasing them, you may be single for a long time.

[kim42]

So you guys think I won't look needy if ask him if he's still planning to come later this month? 

[Wiseman2]

4 minutes ago, kim42 said:

 if ask him if he's still planning to come later this month? 

You don't have to ask him this. Just send a friendly text. He doesn't owe you an explanation for something that isn't really planned. It's not about "looking needy", it's about he never made any promises or plans.

[kim42]

15 minutes ago, Wiseman2 said:

You don't have to ask him this. Just send a friendly text. He doesn't owe you an explanation for something that isn't really planned. It's not about "looking needy", it's about he never made any promises or plans.

I understood that it was suggested I'd ask him if he thinks he can come later this month.

A friendly text is not a bad idea either.

[Wiseman2]

3 minutes ago, kim42 said:

 it was suggested I'd ask him if he thinks he can come later this month.

Why would you do that?   He never planned or promised anything so it seems silly to try to nail him to something that doesn't exist. Just a friendly text is good for now. If he engages and responds great, if not you can finally put this to rest without embarrassing yourself and sort of making him feel guilty  to visit. 

[boltnrun]

If you want a relationship you're going to have to address your unreasonable fear of rejection and anxiety over even basic communication. 

You've been obsessively ruminating for days, which I imagine isn't much fun. That's why I recommend sending a text (just a text!) either saying "Hey there, did you still want to come for a visit? If so, that would be great!" Or "Hey there, just wanted to see how things are going. Are you staying cool in all this heat?"

Or something like that.

This strange thing about thinking a simple text makes you seem "needy" is a bit bizarre, TBH. 

[kim42]

29 minutes ago, boltnrun said:

If you want a relationship you're going to have to address your unreasonable fear of rejection and anxiety over even basic communication. 

You've been obsessively ruminating for days, which I imagine isn't much fun. That's why I recommend sending a text (just a text!) either saying "Hey there, did you still want to come for a visit? If so, that would be great!" Or "Hey there, just wanted to see how things are going. Are you staying cool in all this heat?"

Or something like that.

This strange thing about thinking a simple text makes you seem "needy" is a bit bizarre, TBH. 

I know it's strange, so even if it doesn't work out with this guy, at least I want to try to do things in a different way.

[MissCanuck]

1 hour ago, kim42 said:

So you guys think I won't look needy if ask him if he's still planning to come later this month? 

Ask yourself this: how will you feel if you send him a friendly text, he sends one back, and still neither of you has mentioned this potential visit? 

[boltnrun]

36 minutes ago, kim42 said:

I know it's strange, so even if it doesn't work out with this guy, at least I want to try to do things in a different way.

So have you decided to do nothing? No text?

In that case, realize YOU have made a choice to stop allowing this to infiltrate your life and thoughts. In that case doing nothing is a choice, which is healthy BTW. 

But if you have decided to do nothing, don't wait around for him and don't fantasize about him as a romantic prospect and don't agonize over thoughts of "I'm sad it didn't work out" because honestly, there was nothing to "work out". Just set him aside (figuratively) and move forward with your life. 

[kim42]

19 minutes ago, MissCanuck said:

Ask yourself this: how will you feel if you send him a friendly text, he sends one back, and still neither of you has mentioned this potential visit? 

I think I'd be a little disappointed.

[kim42]

17 minutes ago, boltnrun said:

So have you decided to do nothing? No text?

In that case, realize YOU have made a choice to stop allowing this to infiltrate your life and thoughts. In that case doing nothing is a choice, which is healthy BTW. 

But if you have decided to do nothing, don't wait around for him and don't fantasize about him as a romantic prospect and don't agonize over thoughts of "I'm sad it didn't work out" because honestly, there was nothing to "work out". Just set him aside (figuratively) and move forward with your life. 

I'm leaning towards sending him a friendly message to see if and how he replies.

[boltnrun]

27 minutes ago, kim42 said:

I'm leaning towards sending him a friendly message to see if and how he replies.

Then I suggest not sitting on this decision, agonizing over it for days. 

[MissCanuck]

38 minutes ago, kim42 said:

I think I'd be a little disappointed.

So then ask him if he's still thinking about visiting. Don't waste time with friendly feeler texts. 

At least you will have an answer. 

[boltnrun]

10 minutes ago, MissCanuck said:

So then ask him if he's still thinking about visiting. Don't waste time with friendly feeler texts. 

At least you will have an answer. 

Kim, do you fear he'll say "no" if you ask him if he still plans to visit? Is remaining in this anxious limbo preferable to hearing a "no"?

I personally despise anxious limbo. I would rather deal with some disappointment than be mired in anxiety, ruminating, losing sleep, having my appetite affected, etc.