First "date" confusion

[kim42]

Yes, it's a little disappointing but luckily I have many things going on in my life right now so it will be easier to focus on something else.

[Batya33]

3 hours ago, kim42 said:

Yes, it's a little disappointing but luckily I have many things going on in my life right now so it will be easier to focus on something else.

Good! Yes even I agree he should have been in touch again within a week given the world of texting and cell phones.  Just to say hi -how's your week been?  Especially since he'd referenced coming in a month to see you.  I'm sorry but I'd treat silence as only casual interest and move along.  

[kim42]

We didn't text too much before we met for lunch, maybe once or twice a week so it's not like a big change in texting but at that time we already had a plan to meet in his city. So I think it's different now.

I wish he would say that he changed his mind and doesn't want to come to visit instead of disappearing.

[boltnrun]

He may not be seeing it as a potential dating situation. He may view it as two friends getting together to catch up. 

I do think it's important to establish this detail. I used to go out to lunch frequently with a man I met at work. I saw it as a potential romantic relationship while he (as I found out) viewed it as just  friendly lunches. And yes, there was some flirty "banter" (hate that word BTW).

[rainbowsandroses]

1 hour ago, kim42 said:

I wish he would say that he changed his mind and doesn't want to come to visit instead of disappearing.

Why?  By doing so, he shuts the door for good.

By saying nothing, he leaves it open in case he changes his mind or is simply busy with other things and will reach out closer to when he'll be in your city. 

Why not live your life, meet and date other men, and remain open to this possibility?

Remember you only had the one lunch meet/date, you're not actually "dating." 

Lower expectations, remain open to ALL possibilities and live your life.

Detach from the outcome.

That's what I'd do even though you're disappointed he hasn't reached out.

Life is full of twists and turns, don't rule anything out.

[kim42]

4 minutes ago, rainbowsandroses said:

Why?  By doing so, he shuts the door for good.

By saying nothing, he leaves it open in case he changes his mind or is simply busy with other things and will reach out closer to when he'll be in your city. 

Why not live your life, meet and date other men and remain open to this possibility?

Remember you only has the one lunch meet/date, you're not actually "dating." 

Lower expectations, remain open to ALL possibilities and live your life.

That's what I'd do even though you're disappointed he hasn't reached out.

Life is full of twists and turns, don't rule anything out.

I understand what you're trying to say but I'm not sure if I want to see him again if he disappears now, and then reappears in 2 months. That's not what I'm looking for.

And yes, I know we're not dating.

[rainbowsandroses]

28 minutes ago, kim42 said:

I understand what you're trying to say but I'm not sure if I want to see him again if he disappears now, and then reappears in 2 months. That's not what I'm looking for.

But you said you were not looking for long distance either but were open to it, right?

That's all I'm suggesting here.  Don't give him another thought (for now) and live your life. 

If/when he reaches out later, see how you feel then, at that time. 

You have no idea how you will feel if he reaches out a month from now.  You said so yourself above "you're not sure...".

IDK, this stuff comes easily to me and it's always served me really well in my life.

But I understand not everyone is like me and having certain expectations, whether realistic or unrealistic, and feeling disappointed when they're not met is very common.

Do what is right and best for you, and I'm sorry you got disappointed.

 

 

[Wiseman2]

32 minutes ago, kim42 said:

 I'm not sure if I want to see him again if he disappears now, and then reappears in 2 months. 

Why not? If he's a nice guy who cares if he's kind of around but not exactly dating level intensity? There's nothing to get upset about because you haven't lost anything and maybe made a nice if casual connection.

Try not to shut everyone out of your life due to anxiety.  You can still be "looking for" whatever you're "looking for" without axing this guy out completely.

[kim42]

2 minutes ago, Wiseman2 said:

Why not? If he's a nice guy who cares if he's kind of around but not exactly dating level intensity? There's nothing to get upset about because you haven't lost anything and maybe made a nice if casual connection.

Try not to shut everyone out of your life due to anxiety.  You can still be "looking for" whatever you're "looking for" without axing this guy out completely.

I don't want to get attached to someone who's not interested in me in a romantic way. As you probably know by now, I like him but if he sees only as a friend/former coworker I don't think it makes sense to see him again.

[rainbowsandroses]

45 minutes ago, kim42 said:

I don't want to get attached to someone who's not interested in me in a romantic way. As you probably know by now, I like him but if he sees only as a friend/former coworker I don't think it makes sense to see him again.

One more try and then I'll leave this alone.  🙂

You have no idea how he sees you, as a friend or a potential romantic partner or anything else.

You are basing your assumption he sees you as a friend because he's not pursuing/chasing you as you expect men to do in a "dating situation."

He "should" be texting/calling, he should be making it known he wants to see you, he should do this, he should do that.

Difference is, as you just acknowledged, you are NOT dating

You had one date and another one tentatively scheduled for end of month when he's in your city.

You said you don't want to get attached, then don't.  Don't allow yourself to go there, it's too soon and there is no reason for it.  Not yet after only one lunch meet. 

Remain detached.  From the outcome especially and allow everything to just "be" and let it happen, IF it's meant to happen.

I think you're expectations about this are unrealistic and in an attempt to not get hurt, you're going to cut off any opportunity for you and him to ever connect.  Or reconnect.

I mean who the hell knows. He could come to your city end of month with no contact prior, have a second date and fall in love with you!

I've seen it happen.

All the best whatever you decide. 

 

 

[kim42]

57 minutes ago, rainbowsandroses said:

One more try and then I'll leave this alone.  🙂

You have no idea how he sees you, as a friend or a potential romantic partner or anything else.

You are basing your assumption he sees you as a friend because he's not pursuing/chasing you as you expect men to do in a "dating situation."

He "should" be texting/calling, he should be making it known he wants to see you, he should do this, he should do that.

Difference is, as you just acknowledged, you are NOT dating

You had one date and another one tentatively scheduled for end of month when he's in your city.

You said you don't want to get attached, then don't.  Don't allow yourself to go there, it's too soon and there is no reason for it.  Not yet after only one lunch meet. 

Remain detached.  From the outcome especially and allow everything to just "be" and let it happen, IF it's meant to happen.

I think you're expectations about this are unrealistic and in an attempt to not get hurt, you're going to cut off any opportunity for you and him to ever connect.  Or reconnect.

I mean who the hell knows. He could come to your city end of month with no contact prior, have a second date and fall in love with you!

I've seen it happen.

All the best whatever you decide. 

 

 

Even if we're not dating, I don't think it's unrealistic that I expect that he texts me until we meet again - IF he's interested.

I don't expect him to chase me, but I think that IF he's interested, it should not be so hard to stay in touch, especially since we're far away from each other.

I think it's strange that he said he wanted to visit me in my city and then disappeared for one week. So I assume he's changed his mind and doesn't want to do it anymore.

[rainbowsandroses]

40 minutes ago, kim42 said:

I think it's strange that he said he wanted to visit me in my city and then disappeared for one week. So I assume he's changed his mind and doesn't want to do it anymore.

Well, I think if you had more of an abundance mindset and were chatting, meeting and dating a few other men, you wouldn't be so hyper-focused on one man you had a lunch date with who lives in a different city or country? 

By having other options you're able to remain detached from the outcome and simply let things happen naturally at its own pace. 

It's almost like you need him to be into you NOW, know what he wants NOW and if he doesn't, screw him, next.

Again it's been one lunch meet kim, and only one week since you last talked.  And might I remind you, you haven't reached out to say hi either. 

Sorry that's the impression I'm getting.  And if true it's a bit of an entitlement mindset which is unfair and not a healthy positive mindset to have imo. 

Some men have this mindset too.  There is an expression some men have "comply or bye" which means you need to be into me now, the way I need you to be into me (which often times means agreeing to early sex) and if you're not - Bye!  Next. 

It's entitlement, which many men do acknowledge and feel entitled to. 

Entitled to have an entitlement mindset. Lol

In your case, it's 'you need to be into me now, the way *I* need you to be into me, which means texting the way I expect, and if you don't, next.' 

Anyway, just my take and apologies if I've got any of it wrong. 

You do you as they say.

Be happy.  😂

 

[catfeeder]

3 hours ago, kim42 said:

I wish he would say that he changed his mind and doesn't want to come to visit instead of disappearing.

This sounds a bit control-freaky to me. You're the one with the anxiety, and you're the one deciding that he won't be visiting in August. You're back to making up a narrative then frustrating yourself because you can't control unknowns.

Speaking only for myself, if I have tentative plans for a month or two away, I don't feel a need to text about it this far in advance, and that's no reflection on the person I'm visiting.

You've already established that this guy has never been much of a texter, and he's being true to form. It was ONE date. He may not even know where he stands with you, or not. He's open to seeing you some more, and he's willing to make a trip to do that. But meanwhile? He's not your boyfriend.

Head high, move your focus onto productive things. Date other guys. If this one raises another date, decide THEN whether you'll cross that bridge at that time. 

 

 

[rainbowsandroses]

9 minutes ago, catfeeder said:

This sounds a bit control-freaky to me. You're the one with the anxiety, and you're the one deciding that he won't be visiting in August. You're back to making up a narrative then frustrating yourself because you can't control unknowns.

Speaking only for myself, if I have tentative plans for a month or two away, I don't feel a need to text about it this far in advance, and that's no reflection on the person I'm visiting.

You've already established that this guy has never been much of a texter, and he's being true to form. It was ONE date. He may not even know where he stands with you, or not. He's open to seeing you some more, and he's willing to make a trip to do that. But meanwhile? He's not your boyfriend.

Head high, move your focus onto productive things. Date other guys. If this one raises another date, decide THEN whether you'll cross that bridge at that time. 

Thank you catfeeder, I thought I was alone in this!

Well said, much more articulate and succinct than I did!  

[kim42]

I know I get anxious easily, I think I don't want to lose time with someone who doesn't follow up/is not interested.

I would make all kinds of excuses for guys I dated in the past and tolerated hot and cold behavior, and I don't want to do this anymore.

[catfeeder]

1 hour ago, kim42 said:

I know I get anxious easily, I think I don't want to lose time with someone who doesn't follow up/is not interested.

I would make all kinds of excuses for guys I dated in the past and tolerated hot and cold behavior, and I don't want to do this anymore.

The only time you’re losing is spent on analysis paralysis. You could be dating others or doing anything else beyond pretzeling your mind to come up with definitive conclusions about someone who isn’t going to play.

You’ll either hear from him or not, but unless you want to get in there to message him as a prompter, it will be based on his calendar, not yours.

So let go and see what happens.

[rainbowsandroses]

1 hour ago, kim42 said:

I know I get anxious easily, I think I don't want to lose time with someone who doesn't follow up/is not interested.

I would make all kinds of excuses for guys I dated in the past and tolerated hot and cold behavior, and I don't want to do this anymore.

What is your definition of hot/cold behavior?

Reason I ask is I have one acquaintance who if a guy doesn't text back within 30 minutes (or an hour tops) of her text, will accuse him of going cold and block him.

She complains about never finding a good guy but never gives any man a chance!  

 

 

[NighttimeNightmare]

8 hours ago, kim42 said:

I wish he would say that he changed his mind and doesn't want to come to visit instead of disappearing.

When you say things like this are you aware it’s a cognitive distortion? 
 

you remind me a lot of myself, I’ve spent a lot of my life deciding what people felt because it was a safe bet for me.  I didn’t have to let go of any sort of control, I believed that i knew what people were thinking, how they felt, what they wanted, and it gave me a very clear cut understanding of how I should behave in response, no questions asked.  I had created a world where no one else existed 
 

once I started to allow myself to accept people were their own person, with their own thoughts and intentions that I really couldn’t know for sure, well that’s when my own anxiety started.  Everything I had used in my past to feel confident with my interactions with others became dismantled 

I see you are doing this, too.  You’ve already determined how this person feels, and what he should be doing, how things need to look like; and when it follows suit your anxiety goes away so certain behaviors in others are rewarding for you.  You’re trying to control the narrative so that your tensions about the situation also go away  

 

the thing is that is not how life actually works.  Your anxiety is a byproduct of not being able to self soothe and expecting another’s behavior to regulate you and it’s so distressing you just want the person to “admit they don’t want to see you” to get it all over with.  It’s robbing another person of their autonomy and it also causes you to live in a sort of fantasy world where another’s reality isn’t actually acceptable to you (because it brings you anxiety)

 

in someone else’s silence, is there anyway you can work on teaching yourself that their silence doesn’t have to mean or represent anything in particular? 
 

Even though it might [mean something], the issue is that your anxiety isn’t a trustworthy guide to help you discern those sorts of things  

 

 

[Batya33]

1 hour ago, kim42 said:

I know I get anxious easily, I think I don't want to lose time with someone who doesn't follow up/is not interested.

I would make all kinds of excuses for guys I dated in the past and tolerated hot and cold behavior, and I don't want to do this anymore.

I agree with Catfeeder. No need to lose even a second.  You had a lovely afternoon and spent a short time texting after.  I would do what Catfeeder suggested.

[rainbowsandroses]

In my experience there's always going to be a bit of push/pull (hot/cold) in the beginning, until a couple finds their rhythm. 

To me this is normal.  I don't stress, I try to stay centered and go with it.

It always worked out, literally all my long term relationships and marriage started out that way.

[Batya33]

Just now, rainbowsandroses said:

In my experience there's always going to be a bit of push/pill (hot/cold) in the beginning, until a couple finds their rhythm. 

To me this is normal.  I don't stress, I try to stay centered and go with it.

It always works out, literally all my long term relationships and marriage started out that way.

I think of it as dance of intimacy but not extreme hot/cold -that to me has no place in getting to know someone.  There's testing boundaries - coming together then maybe twirling away a bit -dance metaphor -but not those extremes IMHO with reasonably healthy people.

[rainbowsandroses]

10 minutes ago, Batya33 said:

I think of it as dance of intimacy but not extreme hot/cold -that to me has no place in getting to know someone.  There's testing boundaries - coming together then maybe twirling away a bit -dance metaphor -but not those extremes IMHO with reasonably healthy people.

Agree!   That's why I asked Kim what her def of hot/cold was.

Here, I don't consider this guy "disappearing" as she called it.  Or going "cold."

They had one date, there was nothing to disappear or go cold from. 

She's letting her anxiety drive her ship which never leads to anything good or positive my experience.

 

 

[Batya33]

2 minutes ago, rainbowsandroses said:

Agree!   That's why I asked Kim what her def of hot/cold was.

Here, I don't consider this guy "disappearing" as she called it.  Or going "cold."

They had one date, there was nothing to disappear or go cold from. 

She's letting her anxiety drive her ship which never leads to anything good or posting my experience.

 

 

I also think she's been a bit of a moving target -including internally -about what her intentions and goals are with this person -all important given the long distance and he saying he was looking for something potentially serious -as she says she is too - I think the moving target stuff increases anxiety.

[kim42]

10 hours ago, NighttimeNightmare said:

When you say things like this are you aware it’s a cognitive distortion? 
 

you remind me a lot of myself, I’ve spent a lot of my life deciding what people felt because it was a safe bet for me.  I didn’t have to let go of any sort of control, I believed that i knew what people were thinking, how they felt, what they wanted, and it gave me a very clear cut understanding of how I should behave in response, no questions asked.  I had created a world where no one else existed 
 

once I started to allow myself to accept people were their own person, with their own thoughts and intentions that I really couldn’t know for sure, well that’s when my own anxiety started.  Everything I had used in my past to feel confident with my interactions with others became dismantled 

I see you are doing this, too.  You’ve already determined how this person feels, and what he should be doing, how things need to look like; and when it follows suit your anxiety goes away so certain behaviors in others are rewarding for you.  You’re trying to control the narrative so that your tensions about the situation also go away  

 

the thing is that is not how life actually works.  Your anxiety is a byproduct of not being able to self soothe and expecting another’s behavior to regulate you and it’s so distressing you just want the person to “admit they don’t want to see you” to get it all over with.  It’s robbing another person of their autonomy and it also causes you to live in a sort of fantasy world where another’s reality isn’t actually acceptable to you (because it brings you anxiety)

 

in someone else’s silence, is there anyway you can work on teaching yourself that their silence doesn’t have to mean or represent anything in particular? 
 

Even though it might [mean something], the issue is that your anxiety isn’t a trustworthy guide to help you discern those sorts of things  

 

 

Thank you, this is really helpful. There are some days when my anxiety is really bad.

He actually texted me yesterday in the evening and we talked a little.

[kim42]

11 hours ago, rainbowsandroses said:

What is your definition of hot/cold behavior?

Reason I ask is I have one acquaintance who if a guy doesn't text back within 30 minutes (or an hour tops) of her text, will accuse him of going cold and block him.

She complains about never finding a good guy but never gives any man a chance!  

 

 

I don't take it this far, I know people get busy so I don't expect everyone to reply quickly.

This guy has been for most of the time quick to reply to my messages.

For me hot/cold behavior is mostly when a man is not consistent in how he communicates with me - earlier this year I went for 2 dates, then I didn't hear from the guy for almost a week, and then he started to message me and ask me out again.

Or when a man is texting me, interacting with me on social media but doesn't ask me out or makes vague plans/doesn't follow up.

I have been on many dates with men like this, and I've kept meeting men that I didn't have much in common so maybe that's why I like this 'one lunch' guy, because I finally clicked with someone.

We're originally from the same country but we both moved to a different country so I feel closer to him than the local guys in a way.

Just thought I'd give you a bit more context as to why I like him.