Project Dating!

[Ian4996]

Thanks both.

 

If it helps at all I had a few of those about faces situations when I dated

 

Did you ever get a sense of why that was? I'm quite curious what makes people change their mind like that.

 

Two hot dates, then the nebulous "bad timing" text

 

I HATE those sort of texts. I can tell it's one of them from the first few words of the message even before opening it fully. As soon as I see 'Hi Ian', or 'I've been thinking', I know it's going to be one of them!

 

Both your attitude and radar sound pretty refined

 

Cheers, I feel like I've managed the disappointment of these 2 the past week really well, much more so than I would've done in the past. I feel like I've kind of just brushed them off and am back on the horse ready to meet someone else, which wouldn't have been the case in the past. I've got another first meet lined up for Tuesday with a girl called Catrin, we're going to take our dogs for a walk in the daytime. Catrin keeps sending me voice messages in reply to Whatsapp messages, which is slightly weirding me out, though she does have a nice voice! Maybe it's just a sign of the times (i.e. most people Whatsapp message rather than call or leave Voicemail messages these days) that I find this slightly weird!

[Batya33]

A sense - no because to me it's all up for grabs in the early stages of dating. Anything can happen and you're still basically strangers. I just never have the expectation of another date if there's no time place plan for another date. If not the date I was on (was, stopped dating in 2005) was the last one -from a realistic not a negative perspective. So I didn't really give it thought.

[Ian4996]

Yeah I get that there's no rules etc in the early stages. I just find the sudden change of heart hard to rationalise as it's not something that I ever get myself - I can't recall ever ending a 1st meet by saying to someone 'yeah I'd love to see you again and I'm free next weekend', but then changing my mind a day or 2 later. If I feel that way at the end of the meet, I feel exactly the same a day or 2 later.

 

This isn't something I'm really dwelling on or worrying about by the way, it's more just something that I'm curious about - why do people get these sudden change of hearts between 1st and 2nd meets, and why do I never get them myself?

[Batya33]

Yeah I get that there's no rules etc in the early stages. I just find the sudden change of heart hard to rationalise as it's not something that I ever get myself - I can't recall ever ending a 1st meet by saying to someone 'yeah I'd love to see you again and I'm free next weekend', but then changing my mind a day or 2 later. If I feel that way at the end of the meet, I feel exactly the same a day or 2 later.

 

This isn't something I'm really dwelling on or worrying about by the way, it's more just something that I'm curious about - why do people get these sudden change of hearts between 1st and 2nd meets, and why do I never get them myself?

 

Because it's often not a change of heart - it's not that deep. As my dear friend who passed away young 15 years ago used to tell me "you know you can sneeze the wrong way and it's all over". Many times a man expressed with great enthusiasm how much he wanted to see me again and I would respond with interest. Then silence. But it was like a blip on the radar for me because without a time and place the words were sweet and meaningless to me. So here's a laundry list - the person reflects on the conversation and realizes she missed something you said that is a potential dealbreaker, or tells a friend what you said who advises her of the same, she has a first meet the next night and decides he is actually "the one' and she has no interest in following up with anyone else, her ex contacts her, etc. You're assuming it's about "feelings" -maybe yes, maybe no.

 

Why do you not change your mind? I don't know -maybe you're always up for another go even if you're on the fence/lukewarm (I was).

 

It's not about "no rules" at all. It's about expectations.

 

I'll give you another example -and this has now happened several times. I am trying to meet new people still - through Facebook, friends of friends, etc- not dating but as close to dating as you can get because I'm also setting up first meets, etc. There's a woman S who I spoke with on the phone for 2 hours several months ago- never done that before -we totally clicked and then the whole back and forth about getting together started -well not back and forth -she had this and that come up, etc. She stopped responding to my texts so I stopped texting after once or twice.

 

She got back in touch recently and all of a sudden wrote that she can do this Tuesday or Friday. So last week I responded "so far I can do Friday". She didn't read my message or respond till today. I told her that I still have Friday open and will try to keep it open till she finds out her work schedule. All these details for this point -she was very very enthusiastic about meeting in words. Her actions tell me that she's not willing to put in the effort to meet and coordinate schedules. So yes I'll meet her if I'm still free but I'm underwhelmed with her actions. This is one example of many - women who are all over the "wow I really want to make new friends here/meet new people -can't wait to meet you!!!!" But the actions don't back it up.

 

This is similar to what you're going through - she might be a person who throws around "yes I would love to!!" but when push comes to shove she realizes that she's not willing to put in the effort to make the time to plan a date with you. Or maybe she realized it a second after she gushed her interest because she blurts things out without thinking about the other person. I don't do that. If I want to make a plan I express sincere interest and I do the necessary follow up ASAP. Sometimes right then if possible. If I'm not sure I express it in a tentative way because I don't want to take up the person's time. If someone says to me- which happened at an event last week "yes, link in with me and we'll grab lunch sometime" -I smile and know it aint never going to happen even if she "felt" interested when she said it.

 

It's frustrating. Sometimes I too take a break from my "first meets" because it takes so much time and is aggravating.

[Ian4996]

This is similar to what you're going through - she might be a person who throws around "yes I would love to!!" but when push comes to shove she realizes that she's not willing to put in the effort to make the time to plan a date with you. Or maybe she realized it a second after she gushed her interest because she blurts things out without thinking about the other person. I don't do that.

 

Yeah I'd agree with the above. Sounds like you're similar to me in that if you say 'I'd like to meet you again' you mean it, it's not just a rhetorical phrase.

 

Updates (Mon 21st & Tue 22nd October)

 

Had a 1st meet with Catrin yesterday. This was a 1 and done. To be honest, I could tell it was going to be as soon as I saw her, as she was probably 2 to 3 stone overweight (and as I've mentioned before, I just can't find overweight women attractive).

We went for a bit of a hike up a hill and both took our dogs, and it was a pleasant enough hour and a half and nice to experience a new walk in a new area (I'm finding this to be one of the side benefits of dating, as I make the effort to go to places that I wouldn't bother to go to if I wasn't meeting someone else). But it was clear we weren't a match, even without the weight issue – she was very much a career person and talked very seriously about her job for long periods, while also being a bit dismissive I felt about my work (which is a bit unconventional). I guess this is just a compatibility thing rather than a criticism of Catrin – Catrin's match would be a man who isn't bothered about her being overweight and who is also a serious career person. Whereas my match would be someone who's in great shape and is open minded enough about work to appreciate what I do.

I've taken away something from this though (as well as a couple of previous meets) and that's to be more certain if someone's in good shape before we meet. I'm finding that if this is unclear from their profile (e.g. Catrin's profile was 4 face shots and a full body pic taken from quite a distance in which it was hard to tell), they're generally not.

 

One thing I have done this afternoon by the way is taken a bit of time out to reflect on how my dating has gone since I started this journal 2 and a half months ago.

In terms of numbers, I've had the following:

 

20 arranged 1st meets

4 of these never took place (each time, they cancelled and didn't reschedule)

16 actual first meets

13 of these 16 were '1 and dones'

3 of these 16 went as far as a 2nd meet

0 of the 16 went further than a 4th meet

 

So in terms of the numbers, I haven't achieved yet what I set out to achieve, which is to find a partner. However, I feel like I'm doing well and in a good place with dating overall. I've got a sharper focus than I've had in the past over the sort of person I'm looking, I'm being efficient (ie meeting people quickly rather than getting bogged down in weeks long message exchanging) and I've got a positive enough mindset to brush off the disappointments and go again. I feel like I'm potentially not far away from meeting someone who's really right for me.

 

In terms of the next few days, I've got a coffee meet arranged tomorrow with a girl called Claire. I'd suggested we go for a nice walk somewhere but Claire was of the opinion that 'a 1st date with a stranger should just be a coffee to see if you like each other'. I don't particularly mind either way myself so we're going for a coffee.

Then Friday and Saturday, I've got 2 more 1st meets agreed but not arranged as yet. Will try to get the details fixed up this evening.

[Ian4996]

Updates (Wed 23th October - Fri 1st November)

 

Ok, haven't updated this in a while but got a few updates. Had 2 first meets over the past week or so, both of which have ended up being one and dones. The first was a week ago, a coffee with Claire (who I mentioned in my last post - I'd suggested we go for a walk but she'd said that a 1st meet with a stranger should just be a coffee).

I quite liked Claire, both personally and looks wise but it was one of those where, although I liked her, it all felt far too platonic. Like I wanted there to be flirting and chemistry with her but there wasn't.

The second was a couple of days ago, a walk in the forest with a girl called Laura and both my dog and hers. Laura was a nice person and physically attractive but I could tell early on that we weren't right for each other. Conversation, although we kept it going for the whole hour and a half, didn't feel that natural and it was one of those where it was fairly clear that neither of us were going to follow up for a 2nd meet.

 

However, I have got 3 promising meets lined up for the next week.

 

The first is tomorrow afternoon with Ola. I met Ola last week on a group hike and we got on really well. In contrast to the Tinder meets I've described above, there was chemistry between me and Ola. I'm looking forward to seeing her tomorrow - we're taking my dog for a walk in the forest.

 

The second is Sunday afternoon with Anna. I've been chatting to Anna on Tinder for probably a month but she's been abroad for 2 or 3 weeks and only got back this week. She seems nice and she's a national league volleyball player, which I find really attractive - as I've mentioned before, my type is very much sporty athletic women.

 

The third is next Friday with Laura, again from Tinder. We had a chat on Skype today - she'd suggested a phone call, I'd told her I'm really not keen on phone calls (I find them incredibly awkward in terms of having chit chat with a stranger) but suggested Skype instead. I liked how Laura looked on Skype and the conversation was nice and she was easy to chat to. So that's made me look forward to meeting her in person.

 

I've not started any new Tinder chats over the past week or so - I'd struggle to fit any more than 3 first meets into my schedule this week anyway.

[Ian4996]

Updates (Sat 2nd Nov - Tue 12th Nov)

 

Updates over the past week and a half: I've had a 2nd and a 3rd meet with Ola. On the 2nd, we took my dog for a walk in the forest then went for food. On the 3rd, we played squash, then went for food and drinks. They've been enjoyable and we've made out quite heavily, although things haven't become sexual just yet. I'm not 100% sure just yet if it's going to be a long lasting thing - as I've mentioned previously, I have a tendency after 2 or 3 dates to unfavourably compare how I feel about someone with how I've felt at a similar stage with women in the past. But I am enjoying seeing Ola, so I'm just going with the flow for now, see how it goes.

 

I've also had a first meet with Anna, which I think is going to be a 1 and done unfortunately, as I was attracted to her. I was quite nervous when we first met (I can get like that sometimes) which I think came across and possibly put her off. I suggested a 2nd meet a couple of days ago but haven't heard back.

 

The third meet I had lined up last time I posted (with Laura, who I had a Skype chat with), she bailed. Too busy to date at the moment.

 

In general, I've been very lazy with the Tinder messages last couple of weeks. I made an effort this morning to send out a few first messages. I get that someone could say 'why don't you just concentrate on Ola, rather than messaging new women?'. But I think it helps me make a sound judgement about how much I like someone if I've got other options around in the early stages. Whereas if there was no-one else in the pipeline, I might think 'I'll keep seeing this person because I've got no other options', which is obviously not a great reason!

[Batya33]

Glad you are enjoying seeing Ola! Would you be interested in being sexual with her before knowing whether it was going to be a long lasting thing?

[Ian4996]

Thankyou. And yes I would.

 

My 'position' on casual sex is that I'm not actively seeking it - e.g. when using the apps, I'm only swiping on women with who I could see relationship potential (e.g. women who sound like they've got their heads together, we share common interests etc). Women who look the 'up for a s**g' type / very revealing photos etc, I'm swiping left on.

But at the same time, if I'm dating / seeing someone, I'm not at all against having sex while in the 'let's see how things go' stage, even though that's not my primary intention.

[Batya33]

Thankyou. And yes I would.

 

My 'position' on casual sex is that I'm not actively seeking it - e.g. when using the apps, I'm only swiping on women with who I could see relationship potential (e.g. women who sound like they've got their heads together, we share common interests etc). Women who look the 'up for a s**g' type / very revealing photos etc, I'm swiping left on.

But at the same time, if I'm dating / seeing someone, I'm not at all against having sex while in the 'let's see how things go' stage, even though that's not my primary intention.

 

So basically while you won't initiate contact with someone looking for a casual sex partner you will have casual sex with someone who you meet who wants to have sex with you. I see that it matters to you that it's not your "primary intention" - kind of like when I went to a grocery store today -my primary intention was just to buy milk (and yes a cupcake for tomorrow since my son is missing out on free cupcakes tomorrow at our apartment building) but when I saw someone offering free orange truffles as samples I consumed one even though my goal is not to eat any sweets between meals (luckily this is one of the very rare times I've made this exception since early August). So to me, I ate the truffle even though it's not my typical goal or habit - but the "even though" is irrelevant since at the end of the day I chose to eat the truffle, the end. The process preceding the truffle consumption doesn't matter to me other than it gives me more information about what might trigger me to go against my primary intention. Certainly your approach -and mine -mean that we'll indulge in the "not so great for us" activity/food less often than if our primary intention was to seek out sex/truffles in the first instance. But for my life, the fact that I chose not to keep to my goal is what matters, not "why" or "at least I didn't go to the store intending to sample a truffle. It's your journal and I hope my perspective was at least food for thought lol.

[Ian4996]

I can see the harmful / not so great for us element in other scenarios but, being honest, I'm struggling to see it here.

 

To use your analogy, is it harmful for someone to stuff their face with chocolate truffles between meals? Clearly yes, if they're trying to keep their weight down.

 

Is it harmful for me to pursue women on Tinder who I know I'd never have any romantic interest in purely for the purpose of sex / cheap thrills? Probably, yes, it'd take my focus away from my main aim, which is to find a long term partner. Hence why I'm not doing that.

 

But if me and Ola, on our 4th meet, are kissing on the sofa tomorrow night (which probably will happen, as she's coming round, we've got a film to watch) and she says to me 'come on, let's go upstairs, I'm dying for you to f**k me', why would it be harmful for me to go along with that?

We like each other, we both want it - if I said to Ola 'no thanks, I'd rather refrain from sex for now', how would this benefit either of us?

[Batya33]

I can see the harmful / not so great for us element in other scenarios but, being honest, I'm struggling to see it here.

 

To use your analogy, is it harmful for someone to stuff their face with chocolate truffles between meals? Clearly yes, if they're trying to keep their weight down.

 

Is it harmful for me to pursue women on Tinder who I know I'd never have any romantic interest in purely for the purpose of sex / cheap thrills? Probably, yes, it'd take my focus away from my main aim, which is to find a long term partner. Hence why I'm not doing that.

 

But if me and Ola, on our 4th meet, are kissing on the sofa tomorrow night (which probably will happen, as she's coming round, we've got a film to watch) and she says to me 'come on, let's go upstairs, I'm dying for you to f**k me', why would it be harmful for me to go along with that?

We like each other, we both want it - if I said to Ola 'no thanks, I'd rather refrain from sex for now', how would this benefit either of us?

 

No not my point at all. I just don't really get your distinction about not responding to profiles looking for casual sex but being open to casual sex should someone you meet through a dating site want to have sex and you do too. You are comfortable with casual sex -to me the fact that you'd pass over a profile that only wanted a casual fling makes little difference since at the end of the day you are a person who will have casual sex if the opportunity arises so to speak.

 

It's not harmful at all to have casual sex since you are a person who is comfortable having casual sex. Just the same as a person who would respond to a profile looking only for casual sex- I take it that you think that somehow your interest in casual sex is more limited since you also are looking for a serious relationship and therefore you limit your pursuit of casual sex to those women who also claim to want a serious relationship in their profiles. The truffle analogy to me meant that whether I went out and bought truffles vs. accepting the sample that was offered -end result was I still ate a truffle in a situation where I'm trying my best to avoid sweet treats between meals. I would not have told myself "well it's not like I went to the store to buy truffles -they were offered" On the other hand if my goal was "I'm not going to eat sweets between meals unless I'm at a store where they're offering free samples of sweets" I'd be acting true to myself. Just like you are explaining "I won't date someone who from the beginning says she only wants casual sex but if a woman offers sex before we are exclusive I'll take it."

 

For my life I found huge benefits in not giving in to a desire for casual sex. First, my emotional health would have suffered had I given into that desire when I had it (and I had almost no interest in casual sex after my 20s or so). I would have risked STDs and pregnancy. And I would not have been acting true to my values or showing the man in question that I act consistently with my values.

 

Your standard for choosing intercourse is "we like each other, we both want it". In that case sure saying no would be silly.

[Ian4996]

Batya, thanks for your thoughts and apologies for the slow response, had a busy time and took a break from posting.

 

Anyway thought I'd get this journal going again. To update on the past 3 and a half months, I kept seeing Ola for about a month and a half but realised we weren't really right for each other in the end. We're still on good terms and in touch though.

 

Over the past 6 to 8 weeks, I've been on maybe 9 or 10 Tinder dates, the majority of which have been 1 and done. However, over the past 2 to 3 weeks, I have made some positive changes (both to lifestyle and dating) which have then led (I believe led rather than coincided) to an upturn in fortune.

 

 

 

So the changes:

 

I've been making meeting people (particularly women) a bigger priority in my life. I realised that I had been putting too much time into my work and this was impeding my chances to meet people (e.g. choosing to work all day on a Saturday, when I could have gone out with the hiking group)

 

I've been working hard on attraction techniques. I felt, from the number of “you're a really nice guy but” messages I was getting, that I just wasn't attracting women when meeting them in person. But I've recently found an excellent Youtube channel that I've been listening to when travelling day in day out. The content on there isn't so much seedy pickup tricks, but more stuff on making yourself just genuinely more attractive to women – conversation techniques, paying compliments, speech tonality, texting, flirting, mindset when dealing with knockbacks. It's stuff that I feel I can apply myself while still being me (ie not being unnatural).

 

 

 

So recent positive results:

 

I had a 1st date with a girl, Jill, last week, that led to a 2nd date weekend just gone. She came to my house and we ended up making out. I realised after that 2nd date that she's probably not right for me and so I don't plan to suggest a 3rd date. But at the same time, having had my confidence knocked by so many “really nice guy but” messages, this really helped.

 

I went out with the hiking group on Saturday and met a stunning girl, Claire, who I had the courage to ask out at the end of the day. This really took her by surprise (she said “wow I don't know what to say, you've really put me on the spot!”) but then said “yes that'd be nice”. We've been texting to arrange although it's proving a little tricky (not sure if she's having 2nd thoughts or not, we'll see).

 

I had a 1st date this morning with a girl Lena, from Tinder, that went like a dream. I'd describe it as the best 1st date I've had since I met J back in August 2017. We took my dog for a walk, then went for a pub lunch and a drink. She's stunningly attractive, exactly my type both looks and personality and I felt we really hit if off. We made out at the end of the date.

 

 

Moving forward, I've got another 1st Tinder date arranged tomorrow morning with a girl called Helen (who also looks really attractive in her photos). I get the impression that she might be a bit too straight-laced for me but we'll see – I've done enough app dating to know that someone can be totally different in person to what you expect, both good and bad.

[bluecastle]

Ian! Good to hear from you, and even better to hear you're doing well out there in the world. This Lena person sounds promising. Did you guys make plans to see each other again? On that note, I'm curious: Do you find, after a fantastic date with one person, that you lose excitement about meeting another, like Helen?

[Batya33]

Do you have any particular feelings in general about whether making out with someone on a first meet is a good way to approach dating for you? Maybe it is -just curious -and maybe you don't have any particular feelings about but just react in the moment.

[Ian4996]

Hiya BC, cheers for the message! How's everything going with you?

 

This Lena person sounds promising. Did you guys make plans to see each other again?

 

No, I should have! Will text her later today though. If we have as good a connection as I thought we had, I'd hope she'd want to see me again anyway.

 

I'm curious: Do you find, after a fantastic date with one person, that you lose excitement about meeting another, like Helen?

 

I actually quite like that situation. I've found that when I'm dating, if I'm getting a whole succession of first meets not going the way I'd hoped, they can become quite dispiriting and pressurised. Whereas a 1st meet straight after a great 1st meet with someone else kinda feels like a free shot and helps me feel more relaxed. My first date with J in 2017 was actually the day after I'd had a really good 1st date with someone else. I remember going to my date with J thinking 'I kinda hope this doesn't go well because if it does, it could end up being awkward'. I do feel that this mindset really took the pressure off and, as it was, I was blown away with her and crazy about her by the end of the date (which obviously isn't the ideal thing, but you get my drift).

I've also done enough app dating to know that people can be fickle and that things can change very easily and that a great 1st date doesn't always lead to it going places and so I'm wary about putting all my eggs in 1 basket after only 1 date.

 

This morning's date with Helen was a really interesting one. We met fairly early morning (she was a cop, which I didn't actually know and on duty at midday) and took my dog for a walk in the sand dunes by the beach for an hour / hour and a quarter. She was attractive and it was enjoyable and I felt we had a good vibe and interaction without feeling the huge sparks that I felt with Lena yesterday. I came away from it thinking, 'hmmmm maybe I'll give it a 2nd shot, I'll see' which is still my thinking now. However, a half hour after we'd parted, I got a message from her. I opened the message expecting to see the phrase 'really nice guy but........' maybe partly because I've become accustomed to getting these. However, the message said all the normal stuff of 'thanks for coming to meet me, it was lovely to meet you etc etc' but the 'really nice guy but........' wasn't there and instead it was a compliment on my eyes: 'much nicer than in your pictures!'

The reason I say this was really interesting is because, reading between the lines of the message, she was attracted to me. Yet I'm in no doubt that had we met 3 or 4 weeks ago, it would've been a 'nice guy but' message. It shows to me how much the attraction work I've been putting in is working which is a great realisation to have!

[Ian4996]

Do you have any particular feelings in general about whether making out with someone on a first meet is a good way to approach dating for you?

 

Hiya Batya. I go with the vibe. I guess it all depends on the situation on whether it feels right. I definitely don't feel that kissing on a 1st date is harmful to future prospects though.

[bluecastle]

The reason I say this was really interesting is because, reading between the lines of the message, she was attracted to me. Yet I'm in no doubt that had we met 3 or 4 weeks ago, it would've been a 'nice guy but' message. It shows to me how much the attraction work I've been putting in is working which is a great realisation to have!

 

All is well on this end.

 

I highlighted the above because, in reading that, I have two thoughts. First one: right on, buddy! Second one: I hope that, in time, you can come to feel exactly how you felt receiving that text whether or not you get that text.

 

Guess I'm just saying that there are limitations to the primary gauge of success with women being that you can "attract" them. Not saying that to be a buzzkill or to negate this work you're doing, at all, but just to encourage you, if something like partnership is the goal, to be finding thrill in connection more than being a magnet of attraction.

[Batya33]

Do you have any particular feelings in general about whether making out with someone on a first meet is a good way to approach dating for you?

 

Hiya Batya. I go with the vibe. I guess it all depends on the situation on whether it feels right. I definitely don't feel that kissing on a 1st date is harmful to future prospects though.

 

Here's what I find interesting - and I'm referring to more intimate making out than just a kiss - with that you go with the vibe but as far as coming across as desirable instead of passive (meaning "nice") you study and implement tips, tricks, strategies. Not a judgment or criticism at all -an observation.

[Ian4996]

I hope that, in time, you can come to feel exactly how you felt receiving that text whether or not you get that text.

 

Guess I'm just saying that there are limitations to the primary gauge of success with women being that you can "attract" them. Not saying that to be a buzzkill or to negate this work you're doing, at all, but just to encourage you, if something like partnership is the goal, to be finding thrill in connection more than being a magnet of attraction.

 

I agree. I would say I'm looking for both attraction and connection, they aren't mutually exclusive.

But it is great (in any area of life, not just dating) when you see evidence of success in an area that you've previously struggled in but then put a lot of work into improving, and that's where I feel I am with attraction at the moment.

[Batya33]

I hope that, in time, you can come to feel exactly how you felt receiving that text whether or not you get that text.

 

Guess I'm just saying that there are limitations to the primary gauge of success with women being that you can "attract" them. Not saying that to be a buzzkill or to negate this work you're doing, at all, but just to encourage you, if something like partnership is the goal, to be finding thrill in connection more than being a magnet of attraction.

 

I agree. I would say I'm looking for both attraction and connection, they aren't mutually exclusive.

But it is great (in any area of life, not just dating) when you see evidence of success in an area that you've previously struggled in but then put a lot of work into improving, and that's where I feel I am with attraction at the moment.

 

Isn't it about just being more confident in yourself and showing that confident energy in all interactions including on dates?

[Ian4996]

Yes, there is a huge positive knock on effect in confidence that I've also been noticing in other, non-dating, interactions. This is a big part of the Youtube video series that I've been following.

[bluecastle]

Best I can tell, you were doing pretty great prior to the YouTube videos. Lots of matches, lots of dates, many leading to enjoyable kisses, enjoyable sex—and, in the case of Ola, a little almost thing that petered out. Sure, there was some of the "nice guy, but..." stuff as well, and you're still single, but all in all? Your dating journal, at least to my eyes, has been a chronicle of someone with a lot more "success" than "failure."

 

That's not to knock the videos, or the benefits, not one bit. But I'm just trying to encourage an outlook that creates confidence more than it coming through a series of behavioral adjustments that are validated by other people, with that validation boosting confidence. Because the "you're a nice guy, but..." stuff? It is coming for you, again, in one form or another. It is part of life, part of being in a relationship, and I think the confidence to not give it too much weight goes a long way.

[Batya33]

Yes, there is a huge positive knock on effect in confidence that I've also been noticing in other, non-dating, interactions. This is a big part of the Youtube video series that I've been following.

 

So I read some parenting books/articles and I take tips from them, I watch Supernanny -but I try to avoid seeing any of them as be all end all solutions or focusing too intensely - so that I don't lose sight of common sense, of my background knowledge, etc. I am a little concerned about your level of focus on youtube videos that are targeted in a specific way and by non-professionals who are addressing the masses.

[Ian4996]

an outlook that creates confidence more than it coming through a series of behavioral adjustments that are validated by other people, with that validation boosting confidence

 

Yes I agree on this and this is something I feel I'm making good progress towards. My actual 'results' (if you could call it that) with women has unfortunately taken a nosedive since I posted in here last week but I still feel decent, I feel like I'm on the right track even though dating hasn't gone my way over the past week.

 

Best I can tell, you were doing pretty great prior to the YouTube videos. Lots of matches, lots of dates, many leading to enjoyable kisses, enjoyable sex

 

Thanks for the kind words. I partly agree with you on the above - I feel I was doing very well in the first 2 areas that you mentioned (I.e. getting a lot of matches and going on a lot of dates). I know these things are big sticking points for a lot of guys who do online dating but I don't find them a real problem. I've got a well-written profile with good photos and I'm engaging and chatty enough when exchanging messages for women to want to meet me. In writing this journal, I've barely made any mention of my profile itself or the messages I've been exchanging and this probably is a reflection of how comfortable I am with these areas.

However, I don't feel that my dates overall have gone as well as I'd hoped (even with the expectation that I wouldn't hit it off with the majority of people I met) and I knew myself that I wasn't where I wanted to be in a few areas, irrespective of 'results'. And this is why I've actively been working on a few things (particularly around voice and tonality, paying compliments, flirting and teasing, general conversation skills etc) and I've made huge progress in these areas. Over the past couple of weeks, I've had some really great interactions with people, both male and female, that I wouldn't have had before and I can feel my confidence levels and chattiness growing, in spite of the knockbacks I've been experiencing with dating.

I'm quite a big believer that inter-personal skills really can be worked on and improved. I get the impression, Bluecastle, that you're a bit different to me in this regard – I get the impression that you see this sort of self-improvement as being a little bit forced and not being yourself. One of my best friends is exactly the same but he's one of these people who's very naturally charismatic and so he's never had any need to 'work on' inter-personal skills. Would you say that you're like this too or have you ever had to work on inter-personal skills in this way?

 

I try to avoid seeing any of them as be all end all solutions or focusing too intensely - so that I don't lose sight of common sense, of my background knowledge, etc. I am a little concerned about your level of focus on youtube videos that are targeted in a specific way and by non-professionals who are addressing the masses.

 

Thanks for your concern. I definitely don't feel I'm regarding the videos I'm watching as the 'be all end all' nor do I feel like I'm losing sight of common sense and background knowledge. I've got no problem if you do think this though. One of the main things I've learnt when discussing anything with anyone (whether that be over the internet or in real life) is that we aren't always going to agree on everything. Sometimes you just have to say 'ok I take on-board and I appreciate your feedback but I know my own mind and I am happy with what I'm doing at the moment'.