Is the alpha male thing true?

[DropToZero]

And when was the last time any of you slept over at an apartment with four girls?

 

Haha, sorry this made me laugh...actually Shy...6 girls...and I didn't sleep with them, I stayed up until 5 am talking and hanging with them in their dorm room, then I had to leave even tho they all wanted me to stay. Besides that, yes I have slept over at friends houses with other girls....don't get too full of yourself lol, I'm sure there are many guys that have done what you've done, and then some...

 

Just had to comment on that for now, later.

[ShySoul]

Hmmm.... interesting. I just added that in there for a laugh and shock value, didn't think anyone would expect me to say that seeing how I am so inexperienced. It was just staying over cause we worked late on a project. So I'm not getting full of myself, staying at girls apartments isn't something I do. But I find it interesting that you feel the need to keep score.

 

It doesn't matter what other guys have done, all that matters is me and the one special person who is worth all the wait and criticism. She'll get what I'm saying and then everything will be right, precisely as I've always known it will be.

[DropToZero]

Yours was for a project...see you left that out....I stayed over because I was invited over by the girl I dated.

 

You added it in your post...but you wanted no one to answer you lol. Hey hey...me keep score...you started it hehe. It's not a shock value, it was a shock at first, but then once you mentioned it was b/c of a project...you lost all credibility on that. If it doesn't matter what other guys have done...then why'd you ask that question?

 

Out of curiosity Shysoul, would you like to fill me in on what's recently happened with you and the girl you had been seeing(in a prvt msg.). I'm not going to critique or anything, I'll let you know what happened to me too, b/c I'm not dating this girl any longer either. I just want to see what's goin on with ya. Later

[ShySoul]

I left that out intentionally just to see how you guys would respond. I felt like it would lighten the tension abit and give people a laugh or make them pause a bit, which it did. I wasn't going for crediblity, I was going for a light hearted, goofy, off the fly comment just cause I was in a silly mood. I asked the question not to compare, but just to be me and make a silly comment. In case you haven't noticed, I've made plenty of silly remarks on these topics that have nothing to do with what were talking about. It shows that I don't take things too serious and that I can laugh at myself, signs of confidence in myself and what I say.

 

Actually, I was invited to stay. One of the girls invited me over in the first place and the original plan was just to drop me off at my place when we finished. But they suggested that I just stay over since it would be so late. And I didn't say what the project was on. For all you know it could have been some study on human sexuality.

 

I was going to post about the girl eventually, but with it being the end of the semester, finals and projects to deal with, and graduation in 8 days (so soon, scary) I haven't been in the mood or had the time to write it all out. Things have gotten interesting though. But I'm not one to kiss and tell so to speak. Wait, did I say kiss. Hmmm...maybe, maybe not. I think I'll take a page out of your guys' book. I'll tease you with lines like that and make you wait and wonder. Don't want to make myself to available now and come answering your every question or reveal too much about myself.

 

Note: That was a joke son. I'm not trying to criticize anything thats been said, I just thought it was amusing that I could somewhat turn the tables like that. I'll let ya know eventually.

[spatzcolumbo]

but more dates doesn't necessarily mean a relationship. The point of dating is trial run for a serious relationships.

 

Once again, read what i said, and take a look at the names of the sites - DATING. Look at the name of the forum - DATING. We are not in the 'Relationship' forum here.

 

This is my point. For a lot of guys who don't know the first thing about the dating scene, these sites are a godsend - they point out things you can do that get you noticed above others. They give tips on how to remain aloof and not blow it. They give guys an idea on how they might increase their chances of getting a date with someone they might see as 'out of their league'. Its like reading a book on ways to increase your chances when playing the stock market. No success is guaranteed, but a lot of people find it useful to do their research!! Of course more dates do not MEAN a real relationship, but there is more chance than just sitting around waiting for something to happen.

 

You know what....one of my female friends said a couple of things to me the other day which really made me think about some of the discussion on here:

 

"The first time i meet a guy, i WILL make a decision whether or not i could ever see myself being with him"

 

So the question in that situation, and the one that dating sites are trying to answer is "what can the guy do to increase the chances of making the first impression that gets her coming back for more, and opens up the chance of a 'real relationship'? "

 

About 6 months ago I also had a really in depth conversation about this with a bunch of lecturers from various universities - all about the idea of 'alpha male'. I'm no longer talking about 21 year old girls at bars. I'm talking about lecturers at highly respected universities. One of these lecturers, a 33 year old female said that (whilst it sometime frustrated her) she is inexplicably attracted to certain guys who display 'alpha male' characteristics. She had very little idea why.

 

I wish i had a transcript of the whole conversation, because i think a lot of people here would have found it incredibly interesting!!!

 

You always mention about 'going to the source' and come up with all these girls you have talked to. You claim that women 'grow out of' these phases, yet it is clear to me that they don't!!

 

Oh yeah, one other thing that i meant to share with you Shysoul was a bit from the Simpsons that i saw the other day. It was the one where Milhouse gets his first girlfriend:

 

Bart: Besides, what's so great about kissing?

 

Milhouse: Bart, it's not just the kissing. A lot of it is waiting to kiss. You know, like when you open an Eskimo Pie and you wait just a little bit for it to melt.

 

Bart: But she doesn't melt...

 

Milhouse: Oh yes she does

 

You know what i'm referring to - our other discussion in the locked post - just made me laugh hearing that quote - kinda sums up all i was trying to tell you!!

 

i know, its just the Simpsons...the Simpsons...the voice of a generation!!

 

Sorry to go off topic everyone!!!

[MetallicAguy]

That's a good point spatz.

 

"The first time i meet a guy, i WILL make a decision whether or not i could ever see myself being with him"

Even if you screw up the first impression right there, I GUARANTEE you there is a way to fix it, it might take at the least 5 months, but it's all good in the end you can still end up with her with the right advice (tactics).

[ShySoul]

Somehow we are meeting completely opposite types of girls. I'm always finding girls who tell me:

 

"I've said all along that I wish one day to fall in love with my best friend."

 

They don't judge rather they can see themselves with someone in the first meeting. It takes time to make a decision like that. And I agree with these girls. I have never liked someone or even begun to picture myself possibly ending up with her in any kind of relationship or dating scenario upon simply one meeting. What people do in the first meeting is see if you have enough in common to become friends and hang out more. Once you really get to know someone, only then can you make such a statement as "I can see myself being with him." Don't judge a book by its cover, someone can seem perfect for you at first glance but be all wrong once you dig deeper.

 

If there is one thing I've picked up from these site and from people asking for advice on here, the "dating scene" is more trouble then its worth. It's a bunch of advise to either tell people nothing or tell them what they already know. Following these rules seem to just be creating confusion and doubt in people's mind. It's so much simplier to just be yourself and not worry about it. And it will just as rewarding because you'll still end up finding someone that is right for you. Dates, relationships, love... they all fit under the same umbrella and its best to just go with what happens. Its something that needs to be natural, its not something were you can improve your odds or make things happen.

 

I'm being misunderstood here. I'm not saying wait around for it to happen. I'm saying don't care if its happened or not. Put it out of your mind and focus on the myriad of things life has to offer. The chance of finding someone doesn't depend on how many dates you have, it's all about the people in your life. I meet plenty of people through the course of everyday life, I get to know them and can see if they are someone I would be interested in without ever going on a date.

 

What does the guy do? He acts like himself and if she is going to be so judgmental as to dismiss him right so quickly, then he just realizes there are better girls out there.

 

About this 33 year old lecturer, sadly some people never grow out of these phases. They get stuck in a cycle and refuse to change. I've never said that everyone grows out of it, some continue to go for what they knew is wrong for them. It's like an addiction, you know you shouldn't but you do anyway. An addiction like that can be hard to stop and some people let it drag them down. But most realize the have the strength, address it, and grow out of it.

 

Ah, the Simpsons. I remember that episode. And if I'm not mistaken that relationship almost ended Bart and Milhouse's friendship. Just a little warning there to be careful about priorities and being jealous like Bart was. Notice how Milhouse, the nice geeky one, was the one in the relationship as opposed to Bart, the bad boy. Or the episode where Lisa liked Nelson, the alpha male, until she realized that they had nothing in common and that he wasn't right for her. Or the episode where Bart goes out with the preacher's niece and Bart realizes that she's too much of a bad girl. What was the line, "Your turning me into a criminal when all I want to be is a petty thug." The relationships based upon being an alpha guy or girl didn't last, while relationships based upon a real connection and love, last. And what do you mean the perfect girl can't fall into your lap. Homer and Marge met when they were in detention, probably the one and only time Marge was in there.

 

Ok, I've seen to many Simpson episodes.

 

About waiting to be kissed, try looking at this from my perspective. I've been letting the ice cream melt for 22 years to make sure the moment is right with the right person. Once I actually have that moment in front of me, any more waiting and the ice cream will become soup. I'm looking at it more as fine wine (and I don't drink so feel free to tell me I'm wrong about this too), it's better when aged. Let the wine sit there and once the corks come out, it'll taste all that much better.

[spatzcolumbo]

If there is one thing I've picked up from these site and from people asking for advice on here, the "dating scene" is more trouble then its worth.

 

Two points:

 

Firstly you wouldn't KNOW the dating site is more trouble than its worth for YOURSELF as you have never tried it.

 

Secondly, of course you will get a negative view of it if you come on to this board, because most of the people on this board have come looking for advice on things not working out or things they are not happy with.

 

The majority who find the dating scene a hell of a lot of fun are out there enjoying it.

 

I'm on here because i came on in a bad way a few years ago, and stuck around to offer the advice that i gained from learning the hard way!!

 

As for your comments about the Simpsons....hahahaha. I meant it as a light hearted joke based on what we had said before!! I wasn't looking for an in depth analysis of all the relationships - besides it really wouldn't work in the simpsons for any of the main kids to get in relationships!!! But THAT is for another forum!!

 

As for your comments about alpha male, and this lecturer...you should not be so quick to judge someone you do not know.

 

She has been married and is now separated. Her ex husband left her, she was deeply in love. She looks after a kid on her own, and holds down a very demanding job. I'd appreciate you not suggesting she has never grown up out of this 'phase'.

 

Don't judge a book by its cover, someone can seem perfect for you at first glance but be all wrong once you dig deeper.

 

I completely agree, and obviously you have used a well known phrase. However, the fundamental fact of life (and the reason this phrase was first coined) is that people DO have first impressions, and they ARE very important. This is the reality.

[ShySoul]

Firstly you wouldn't KNOW the dating site is more trouble than its worth for YOURSELF as you have never tried it.

 

As I've been trying to get people to see, I don't have to try something to know I won't like it. I haven't actually tried smoking but I've been around people who do smoke. If I can't stand the smell of second-hand smoke, I really don't think think I want to be inhaling it in my lungs. I know who I am, I know what I'll enjoy and what I'll despise. If "the dating scene" is what I have heard from those on this site and from people in person, it's not for me. And I know this from experience as well. Hey, I even made a New Years Resolution to do one new thing a month, and I'm actually keeping that resolution. Two of those things I did was go to a bar and go to a club with some acquitances of mines. Suffice to say, maybe the least fun nights I ever had. I've looked on dating sites just for a kick, gone into chat rooms where people are looking for love. All I find are messages from perverts or it's clear that I don't have anything in common with these people. And the whole idea of having to join a site is contradictory to my vision of what dating, romance, love, is. It's not something that you find, its something that finds you.

 

I realize that there are benefits of dating to. But based upon who I am, I think the negatives outweigh the benefits. I can get all the benefits I would want from simply being someone's friend. I can enjoy life with worrying about having a date and the problems that come with it. And when I do find someone, I'll get all the same benefits plus the satisfaction of knowing that I waited for the one special person who was all worth it.

 

I'm also giving advice on what I've learned the hard way. I've learned to stop seeking dates/relationships/love. It's something that has to happen when it decides the time is right.

 

Sorry about my Simpsons comments, you got me thinking about all those old memories and jokes. Simpsons have been around since my childhood, I got lost reminising. But when you think about it, what I said does make sense.

 

On the lecturer, I didn't say she specifically wasn't grown up. Your the one who said that she said she always ends up going for bad boys. All I did was make a logical inference from what you said. Without all the facts its hard to make the right call and since I've never met her, how was I to know? I'll refine my comments. Even the most grown up of us can make mistakes and pick something that seems right when in fact it isn't. The problem is really not even hers, its the guys she is meeting that have the problems. Unfortunately, she has had bad luck in the men she has met. I know all about that, remember what happened to my mother? Great person, horrible luck with men. But it is also true that some women don't learn there lesson and do bring it on themselves.

 

people DO have first impressions, and they ARE very important. This is the reality.

 

And based upon what I have said and who I am, my first impression should come off as a nice, kind, respectful, thoughtful, intelligent, honest, sincere person. That's the kind of person that people respond to and want to get to know. On the other hand, if I came of as someone who is going to play games, not be expressive of what I'm thinking or feeling, like I don't really care if I'm there with her or not (all things you guys have said), thats not a good first impression. Yeah, some people may not like me based upon initial impression, but if they are going to dismiss me that quickly, I'm not going to give them another thought. I'd rather deal with someone who cares about digging deeper and getting to the heart of who I really am.

[spatzcolumbo]

Shysoul,

 

once again just to point out i have no problem at all with you or your opinions, you are of coure welcome to have your own thoughts, and i obviously respect them even if i disagree with half of them

 

Your the one who said that she said she always ends up going for bad boys

 

I never actually said she always goes for bad boys. Read it back. I never said that at all. I said she claims that she is often drawn to guys who have alpha male style qualities. You are suggesting that is a bad thing.

 

You are saying that alpha male = bad. Which is just not the case.

 

She doesn't always go for bad boys. In fact i don't think she has ever gone for a 'bad boy' !!!

 

Simpsons - its a TV show, and of course you can make all those suggestions about the things it says. It is a great TV show, and i don't think i have ever missed an episode (was actually just watching it - the one where Moe has plastic surgery - now that is something i'd NEVER consider!!). However, i could of course come up with loads of other TV shows which argue my points brilliantly!

 

I'm not going to conitnue with the dating thing here because its kinda off topic, and i know you are happy sticking with where you are.

 

But i DO find the alpha male thing pretty interesting. And i don't think it is right to always equate alpha male with negative qualities. There are plenty of 'Alpha Males' out there who are actually really nice blokes, and who treat women right. Its not about the bad boy thing with alpha males, its just about an attitude and a 'way'. If that makes any sense at all (not sure it does now i read it!!!). It is about an air of confidence and happiness, but also something else. It is something that is just there - nobody knows what it is, but it DOES attract a lot of women!!

 

Thats how i see it anyway!!

 

Hey the TV show thing - i just thought of it. I just got it. Happy Days. Fonz.

 

I don't need to say any more.

 

But i will anyway. Classic alpha male.

 

He was the classic 'bad boy' but without actually BEING a bad boy - he always ended up doing the right thing.

 

But the point was that he just had something about him that made all the women notice!!

 

Um thats all for now i gotta go out for some drinks!!

 

Take it easy!!

[MetallicAguy]

But i DO find the alpha male thing pretty interesting. And i don't think it is right to always equate alpha male with negative qualities. There are plenty of 'Alpha Males' out there who are actually really nice blokes, and who treat women right. Its not about the bad boy thing with alpha males, its just about an attitude and a 'way'. If that makes any sense at all (not sure it does now i read it!!!). It is about an air of confidence and happiness, but also something else. It is something that is just there - nobody knows what it is, but it DOES attract a lot of women!!

Basically what I've been trying to explain all along, just never thought of a way to say it like that. Spatz you nailed it dead-on .

[MetallicAguy]

Oh yeah, same thing goes with teasing, IT'S NOT PLAYING GAMES (seriously, do we need to pointlessly argue over stupid **** like this?), it's what teasing does that creates this emotion and no one really knows what it is but it just so happens that a lot of alpha males use...it fits with this attitude and a way that attracts women (basically same thing as spatz put). And teasing isn't mean...if you don't get it, don't bother, you miss out, your problem.

[Double J]

Interesting topic. I remember having a good discussion with you two guys a while back on something related to this, and i'll join in on this one as well.

 

I'll start off by saying that before I got with my current g/f about a month and 3 weeks ago, I was an avid reader of sites like double your dating, the seduction one, link removed, and others. Now ShySoul, I understand that you disagree with the stuff they talk about, and that you say it "isn't for you." And I respect your opinion. But just because it isn't right in your eyes doesn't make it definitively wrong for everyone else. It's very easy to say that something is not good when you haven't even tried it, and we do that all the time. I'm sure in the past you might have judged a certain food as being unpleasant when you hadn't even tasted it, or a certain movie/book genre as not being your type without having read or seen it.

 

Being c0cky/funny, teasing, being unavailable at times, and doing all that other stuff to attract women works for many guys who are willing to step out of their comfort zone to attempt them, but obviously, you're not willing to do that because you feel it's not for you. We're all wired differently with different predispositions. You seem like you don't want to try it because you feel it might change you, or you feel like you'd be compromising your personal values.

 

You guys seem to be arguing different points - Shy is saying that the gimmicks don't work in the long run for finding love, but Spatz is talking about the stuff in a different context - he says they are effective in the world of dating.

 

I can level with ShySoul on one point, though. For example, I met a couple of girls from online in person last year, and i used those meetings as a good opportunity to apply the stuff I learned from Double Your Dating. It turns out that none of the stuff really worked - the meetings led to nothing. Now, this can be attributed to a number of different things. You can say that the girls wanted to meet a guy at their own convenience (one was a rebound attempt, the other had recently gotten cheated on) and weren't looking for anything substantial in the first place, but why lie to myself. The truth is that they didn't seem to feel attraction for me in the first place, and I honestly didn't feel the same about them. Thus, under those conditions, the c0cky stuff just ain't gonna work.

 

Believe it or not, ever since I was young I was a really shy and quiet guy. It wasn't until college that I was tired of being a nonamer and decided to come out of my shell. I won't deny that once I came accross the DYD stuff and became intrigued by it, I did change a little once I started practicing the material. I became a little more c0cky and aloof around girls, but it still didn't get me anywhere. I think girls might have sensed that I was trying to act different.

 

When I hooked up with my current g/f in March, I can honestly say that everything happened "naturally." I didn't have to alter the real me - she liked me just the way I was without having to be a bit arrogant, and I guess that's what ShySoul is trying to say. That the right girl will like you for who you are without having to change anything about your personality (by the way, I DO tease her, but in a playful kind of way she loves).

 

Truth is that I was lucky, but, was I? There's a saying by Thomas Jefferson: "Why is it that the harder I try, the more luck I seem to have." I didn't try to deliberately look for a g/f any way I could. Instead, I tried MEETING as many girls as possible in school, in the gym, anywhere. When I set up an account on link removed, a girl who I knew back in 6th grade contacted me. We met in person and guess what - she is my g/f now.

 

Realize something, guys. Relationships are very complicated. No offense to the ladies, but girls can tend to be very indecisive. Your success rate also depends greatly on the actual girl you're dealing with. She might like you for who you are one day, but another day she realizes that isn't what she really wants.

 

I think your best bet is to be yourself, but with flair and confidence. Go out and LOOK like you enjoy life, even if you're faking it. I don't agree with what Shysoul said about all nice guys having confidence. That's not necessarily true. And what spatz said about first impressions is true.

 

All in all, if you're looking for a harmless date, a fling or casual sex, the double your dating stuff is a good source. If you're looking for a serious relationship head on, there's nothing better than link removed and those other sites where you know exactly what other people are seeking and it's less of a hassle.

 

Until next time guys.

[spatzcolumbo]

See this is what i am saying - i talk about all this in a dating context because we are posting in a forum called 'DATING'. As i pointed out previously, those sites are also about dating, NOT relationships!

 

In any case the teasing and all that other stuff is great if you know how to use it, if it is you, and if you use it at the right times. For instance, i'd only use it for people i am attracted to. To be honest, more often than not, that will be someone who also appears to feel something back!

 

But the alpha male thing can apply to all situations and all women - its not something you are specifically doing to get women to notice you, its just how some guys ARE. Its almost like an aura that these guys give off - an energy.

[jurupa]

Oh yeah, same thing goes with teasing, IT'S NOT PLAYING GAMES (seriously, do we need to pointlessly argue over stupid **** like this?), it's what teasing does that creates this emotion and no one really knows what it is but it just so happens that a lot of alpha males use...it fits with this attitude and a way that attracts women (basically same thing as spatz put). And teasing isn't mean...if you don't get it, don't bother, you miss out, your problem.

Metallic you have this worng very worng. You know in elemtery school boys will chase girls around the play ground and sometimes have "gross" things in there hands, like worms, mud etc. Well back then the boys and some girls veiwed it as a game, since the girls will tease the boys and the boys will chase the girls. Now you are almost doing the same thing here. But now you are trying to hook up with the girl. You are playing games, trust me. Trust me Metallic I am not trying to insult you, but you bearly know anything. Yes sites like DYD may be helping your game, but sooner or later you will run into a girl or a group of girls where DYD will not help you and all your "tool" are no good. I am not trying to one up you or put you down, I am just stating reality thats all.

 

Flirting is playing games. Just think about it. For example lets say you see a girl in class your interested in. You frist look at her and try to get her attention. Lets say you get her attention, but mean while she is eyeing the jock that is sitting in another row. She gives you a couple of looks becuase you are checking her out, but most of her attention is on the jock, not on you. She is just leading you on until you talk to her and unless you impress her or remove the jock image from her head, she will blow you off.

[MetallicAguy]

...someone kill this thread its so ******* ridiculous.

 

Look I don't just tease the girl and let her chase me, I know that you can only do this for a short while then you strike (talking to her).

 

I will just come out and say I'm really bad at explaining these sorts of things, oh yeah and I'm not up to your level like, in your 20's.

 

Look now I understand what everyone is trying to say and all, but it's just the way you say it that makes it sound wrong or confusing. Maybe it is, maybe it isn't. It's just really annoying to hear people ***** and whine over these issues.

[GuiltyAsCharged]

Okay, no we've found a technically bullet proof way of testing are we alphas link removed

[CASS020283]

OKay, first of all, any decent self respecting female is not gonna want anything to do with a man who shows no emotion just to keep control. if you do find her, you can look forward to a very unfulfilling relationship with someone who doesnt know anything about herself. now, true girls are first attracted to that kind of guy, but you end up feeling so unappreciated, that it never works. and goofy down to earth guys who can make you laugh an dgive you security in some sense are the best. if you want to play games and be the man who never finds true love, go for it, im sure the mind games may work but do you really want to put the future of a relationship on the "facts of the alpha male" whatever the f***. i highly doubt it. in life you gotta take the punches and the medals. yeah you'll get hurt, yeah you'll be happy, and i can promise you confused, but if you dont find out what you want all on your own, you wont be true to yourself, to your heart. so screw the books, the games (though sometimes necessary for protection...u will learn) just have fun, be who you are, and dont let girls take advantage of you. but dont take advantage of them either. thats not the way to a womans heart. unless you have no desire to go there????? think about that...what do YOU want....then again, u r young, you have plenty of time to learn.

[spatzcolumbo]

Hey Cass,

 

Just wondering who you were directing that comment at?

 

I'm not sure anyone is putting the future of a relationship on the ideas / fact of alpha male! But the idea of the alpha male is a perfetly acceptable one in any animal society, humans included!!

 

As for the games, i've always thought that a lot of people on here have different ideas of what games are. A lot of relationship games are fun teasing each other playfully, flirting, etc. In my eyes at least, there are games which are needed in a relationship.

 

The alpha male thing does not have to equate to dating books or sites. Nor does it have to equate to 'bad boys' or games. The guy you describe (goofy down to earth guys) are just as likely to be alpha males as anyone else!!

[CASS020283]

I WASNT REALLY DIRECTING IT AT ANYONE, JUST THE IDEA. FROM READING WHAT HE WAS EXPLAINING IT DIDNT SOUND ALL THAT INNOCENT, BUT IT WAS NOT MEANT TO BE OFFENSIVE. GAMES ARE NEEDED, YES, THEY HAPPEN PRETTY NATURALLY ACTUALLY, FLIRTING ETC. AS YOU HAD STATED. TO ME IT JUST SOUNDED ALOT LIKE SOMEONE WHO WANTED TO MANIPULATE AND CONTROL{WHAT THE SITE HAD SAID} THATS WHAT I HAD GOTTEN ANYWAY, OR AT LEAST HOW IT CAME accross TO ME. THATS ALL, WE ALL HAVE OUR OWN IDEAS, AND WAYS OF SEEING THINGS. SOME MORE INFORMED THAN OTHERS, SOMETIMES A DIFFERENT SET OF BELIEFS. THATS ALL. TRUTHFULLY, I GUESS PART OF IT COMES FROM COMING OUT OF A RELATIONSHIP WITH SOMEONE WHO TRIED EXTREMELY HARD TO PORTRAY THE TRAITS THAT WERE MENTIONED. ITS WHERE IM AT RIGHT NOW, I MIGHT HAVE TAKEN IT DIFFERENTLY IF I WAS AT A DIFFERENT POINT.

[pchellak]

CASS020283,

The guy you last dated was trying to show those traits because he wanted to be the dominant male or atleast make you believe that he was one. It sure did work on you and obviously you fell for him. Thats the whole point of the thread, girls fall for alpha males (genuine or fake). It seems hypocritical for you to advice guys not to be alpha male when you prefer to date alpha males yourself.

[ShySoul]

Ok, I'll be back in the action with lots to say later, got to worry about my last final in a bit first. But I wanted to say saying about Cass here.

 

She isn't saying that she goes for the "alpha males" quite the opposite. She went out with this guy yes, but once she saw his attitude and how he was trying to portray himself in this way, the relationship went south. From the sound of it she is very irritated and annoyed at him and that kind of behavior. This is what I'm saying, girls don't fall for that behavior. Oh, it may intrigue them at first but then they wake up and realise its not something they want. And we don't know why she went out with him in the first place, she never said. Maybe it was the top dog attitude, or maybe it was a common interest. Maybe she got set up by a friend. She hasn't said that yet so to assume that she fell for him because he's an "alpha male" is jumping to conclusions. The only thing we really know is that the "alpha male" behavior is what she is upset and disgusted with right now.

[pchellak]

She did fall for a guy with traits that were mentioned in the forum(according to her).

Let me assure you my friend, most likely she will fall for another similar guy (They almost always do). Theres something about the bad boy persona (can be directly linked to alpha male persona) that attracts the women. I think most bad boys are alpha males while not all alpha males are bad boyz. I think it is tough for some women to pick the alpha males who are also nice. I have seen many similar complaints in the forum for a long time now.

[MetallicAguy]

Shysoul, she's annoyed that he's fake. If he had the brains to develop it into him I'm sure it'd be a lot different. He probably wasn't confident, that's why he was trying too hard in the first place.

[ShySoul]

She fell for a guy with those traits, but it didn't last. We can't say for certain that it is what made her like him, there are almost certainly a variety of other factors to consider. Just because he had a few certain characteristics that happened to match up to the so called "alpha male" doesn't mean those are the characteristics that made him appealing. That is being very selective and only assuming to be true what you want to be true. These things could very easily have been a big part in the attraction, but they are by no means the only thing or even the major thing.

 

I know a girl who liked a guy who demonstrated these triats. But what she was intrigued by wasn't so much the "alpha male" part as it was the sensitive guy beneath that. She dislikes it when he is macho and tough around his other friends, preferring the nice, caring, sensitive person that he allows to show through around her. What got her upset and made her realize that he isn't right for her was the fact that he would go around acting like an "alpha male." And I think cass might be in the same position, though she is free to correct me or clarify anything.

 

MetallicAguy, or maybe he wasn't that way to begin with and was trying to be something he's not. Maybe he adopted that personality because someone told him it would help him get girls. Oh ya, he got a girl but, just as I've been saying, she grew sick of it and left as soon as she came to her senses. Maybe people should be less concerned with getting girls and more concerned with how to keep one.

 

Ok, did some research on the "alpha male" thing (ok, first website I found). Here's what I got:

 

The position of Alpha Male is seen as one of the most socially desirable (in wolves as well as humans) as having it enables a male to make decisions about how their social group/pack is run, to exact submission and obedience from subordinates, and generally to control things and boss others around at will. The power of the alpha male is matched only by that of the alpha female, who is just as in control as the alpha male is. Though in human society, individual ego and desire for authority often exclude the possibility of a partnership at the top. Humans seem to have a remarkable tendency for aggregating ultimate authority to one (usually male) person.

 

Now, based upon that the idea of being an "alpha" is about having control, boss around others, exact submission and obedience. If you believe any of those things are good for a relationship.... you've got to be joking. Also not the part about "exclude the possibility of a partnership at the top." Sounds like being an "alpha" is a lonely road to take.

 

This is really common sense. Think about any project you have worked on in your life, for work or school. Did you like it when someone took control and started ordering you around? Did you really like the guy who acted like he had all the power, knew what was best, withheld information just so he had the upper hand? Or did you get along better with the person who was open to suggestions, willing to hear criticsm about his plans, shared control with others? Someone who fostered a team environment? The latter person is someone who will draw more respect and motivates people to do their best. The first person who tries to be the "alpha male" is likely to draw resentment and is likely to get things his way out of fear and intimidation, not because people like him.

 

The same applies for relationships/dating. Someone who intentionally seeks control is just that, a control freak. This isn't a good thing.Things should be 50/50, if one or both persons want to be in control, it will jsut cause problems. No one wants to go out with somebody who shows more concern for control or for domination then they do for love or for the person they are with.

 

And lets look at what alpha really means here. Alpha, by definition, means first. But do you know of many things that come first and aren't seriously flawed? There's always bugs and kinks to work out. Don't english teachers recommend to write several drafts of a paper and not go with the first? Don't computer programmers go through all kinds of testing before a final product is sold? Isn't beta testing usually tested by the public, meaning that they don't even present the alpha product to the outside world? Taking that to dating, the first type of guy that girls are drawn to aren't generally going to be the one they end up with. So you can be the alpha male if you want and have girls paying attention to you for awhile. Personally, I'd rather be beta or gamma (that is what comes next, right?), not the first that gets attention, but the one that ultimately is the final selection.

 

And like I said earlier, if alpha is suppose to be the leader of the pack, how much different and a leader are you being if you are just doing the same thing you think you have to do to be an alpha male. Your not leading, your following the herd. Instead someone who refuses to give into these ideas of how you are suppose to act and instead acts like himself, not giving a thought to "rules" or "control" or "postions of authority," is being a true leader. He is the true nonconformist, the rebel who challenges the way things are.

 

So any way you cut it, being an "alpha male" isn't all its cracked up to be.