Should I stay? Am I being unrealistic about marriage?

[Greg40s]

Update:

It's been over a year and things still feel the same. We argue about stupid things, and I feel generally unhappy in the marriage.

I throughly enjoy time spent with my kids and friends and family, but one on one with my wife is more of a chore.

What is sad, is that I don't look forward to the future when the kids move away from the nest. I will probably have a more "roommates" relationship with her....or likely leave the marriage after the kids move out,

and enjoy my senior years single and ready to mingle, or with someone who wants to hold hands, shares the same interests, and enjoys new experiences together.

For now, I am trapped and I think I just have to accept it. I made my bed, now I have to sleep in it.

 

I am really working at:

- the "happy wife, happy life" and doing much more than 70% of the household stuff, and many other things good husbands do. It hasn't worked in the past, but maybe it will take time?

- trying to see the positive in the marriage. She is loyal (unlike my ex), she is a great Mom to our kids, she doesn't gamble, she doesn't beat me, she isn't a drug abuser.

so things could be much worse.

 

I’m new here and this thread is kind of heartbreaking to read because much of this is so familiar and really what brought me here in the first place - to see if reading these threads might help me figure something out or at least help me come to terms with it. So I’m sorry that I can’t offer any helpful advice to you but I can empathise and I’m so sorry to hear that it hasn’t got any better. Yes, I guess it’s good that you are recognising positives in the situation - those are very real and not everyone has those things. Maybe these are trade offs and maybe we don’t all get the perfect life.

 

I wish I could offer some magical piece of advice because I’d then follow it myself! But I wish you well and, if you find ways to help, please let us know.

 

Redswim30, just on why someone would decide to stay, the destruction that leaving can cause would be immense, for so many people. And there is no guarantee of finding those things that are missing. I can totally understand why someone wouldn’t break everything in that situation. While I don’t envy anyone who is in a terrible relationship, there are times when that would be easier because at least then the solution is clear: you leave. But if a lot of life elements are actually working and yet your relationship with your wife is deeply unsatisfying, it leads to a very deep unhappiness around a life that, actually, can be working pretty well and could be far worse. At least I can only speak for my case.

[ThatwasThen]

Update:

It's been over a year and things still feel the same. We argue about stupid things, and I feel generally unhappy in the marriage.

I throughly enjoy time spent with my kids and friends and family, but one on one with my wife is more of a chore.

What is sad, is that I don't look forward to the future when the kids move away from the nest. I will probably have a more "roommates" relationship with her....or likely leave the marriage after the kids move out,

and enjoy my senior years single and ready to mingle, or with someone who wants to hold hands, shares the same interests, and enjoys new experiences together.

For now, I am trapped and I think I just have to accept it. I made my bed, now I have to sleep in it.

 

I am really working at:

- the "happy wife, happy life" and doing much more than 70% of the household stuff, and many other things good husbands do. It hasn't worked in the past, but maybe it will take time?

- trying to see the positive in the marriage. She is loyal (unlike my ex), she is a great Mom to our kids, she doesn't gamble, she doesn't beat me, she isn't a drug abuser.

so things could be much worse.

Codependent relationship at it's finest. ^^^

 

Betterwithout, you would do well to get into your own personal therapy to figure out why you think that what you decide in your update is good enough.

 

You don't believe you deserve happiness so you'd rather wallow in your codependence (using your children as a tool that keeps you from having the strength to change your lot for the better.) as Rue Paul says: "If you don't love yourself, how the hell do you expect anyone else to love you?" Google "codependent relationship" and educate yourself.

 

That being said. Its your life, it's just sad to see you settle like that (more likely then not) until you meet some chicka that makes you feel you have worth wherein the odds dictate you will forget your vows and all that devotion to your children. I hope I'm wrong.

 

just on why someone would decide to stay, the destruction that leaving can cause would be immense, for so many people.

Codependent thinking at its finest.

[Greg40s]

Codependent thinking at its finest.

 

I can’t speak for Betterwithout but you had me very curious about this because, in all honesty, I know little about codependent relationships. Searching it up, yep, I recognise a couple of the boxes in this category but personally I would tick very, very few of them. Even though, as a term rather than a diagnosis, it’s not a bad description but then wouldn’t most marriages fall under that? I mean, just the word rather than the psychological definition. Maybe I’m not seeing what you’re seeing in our words, which I know is possible and maybe even likely - it’s hard to have perspective on a situation when you’re in it. Maybe you could elaborate further?

[ThatwasThen]

We are all codependent to some degree. It is when your whole life is dictated by it that it is an issue. Codependency is a set of learned behaviours that have you forgetting what is in your own best interests to the point that it affects your own emotional well being. It is an enabling mechanism that allows others to continue in inappropriate behaviour in order to keep the status quo because the thought of leaving is too terrifying to them. You have made yourself believe (in order to justify your staying) that you adventuring out of the codependent relationship would destroy others when stats have shown that two separated parents that are happy within and showing love and dedication (through joint custody and harmony together as parents) destroys no one. It is the unbalanced, revengeful, antagonistic, and absent parents that use their children as pawns that destroy lives.

 

Here's a link that is relevant.

 

https://www.mentalhealthamerica.net/co-dependency

 

Dysfunctional families do not acknowledge that problems exist. They don’t talk about them or confront them. As a result, family members learn to repress emotions and disregard their own needs. They become “survivors.” They develop behaviors that help them deny, ignore, or avoid difficult emotions. They detach themselves. They don’t talk. They don’t touch. They don’t confront. They don’t feel. They don’t trust. The identity and emotional development of the members of a dysfunctional family are often inhibited

 

Attention and energy focus on the family member who is ill or addicted. The co-dependent person typically sacrifices his or her needs to take care of a person who is sick. When co-dependents place other people’s health, welfare and safety before their own, they can lose contact with their own needs, desires, and sense of self.

[Greg40s]

Thank you for that. That’s one of the links I read when you mentioned it and thanks for explaining your take on it. For me, yes, some of the things you write are correct in my case but I guess mine is a bit different to the OP’s situation. The hard part (and yet what I should also be thankful for) is that so much in our lives is actually really good and the good things are connected to my wife and me being together. And she is a wonderful person. On paper, everything looks rosy and, in all honesty, I’m extremely fortunate in many ways. We don’t really have tough issues to deal with (I mean beyond what many deal with such as money worries etc). We’re not unbalanced, revengeful, antagonistic or absent. We don’t even argue.

 

But the love isn’t there and, while there have been attempts to fix that over the years, I realised last year that it’s an element that is just gone. It’s done. And it was gone for years and I knew it at times and pushed it down and got on with things until it grew inside me. And when everything seems great (and it is), it’s hard to feel so unhappy inside.

 

I didn’t mean to hijack the thread! Sorry. I did come here desperately for advice but I’m trawling through the archives to see how others have faced similar situations before posting one of my own.

 

Thank you for your thoughts. Some of what you describe is definitely applicable in some ways.

[ThatwasThen]

Well, if you can accept it while being happy in that acceptance then is it really 'wrong?'

[Greg40s]

Well, if you can accept it while being happy in that acceptance then is it really 'wrong?'

 

Sorry, I was really unclear there! I’m normally not so bad at putting things into words but this is a subject that seems difficult to express. What I meant is that I am deeply unhappy in a way that seems to physically hurt now and that’s hard because I feel like I should be grateful for what I have rather than pining over what I don’t. I SHOULD be happy. But it’s becoming harder to push the unhappiness down each time it surfaces.

[abitbroken]

Why not go to counseling to learn how to fight fair, to learn to voice concerns instead of arguing about "stupid things". Arguments are not one sided. you are participating in them. Doing chores doesn't change communication styles.

[abitbroken]

also, what can you do to be happy with yourself inside? whether its exercising, hanging out with male friends or a hobby? if you are happy or fulfilled aside from arguments with your wife, it might spill over into your marriage. People can't argue about stupid stuff in a vacuum -- you will not be as motivitated to pick stupid fights on your end because whatever little picky thing you are upset about will be small beans and you won't care about it so much.

[ThatwasThen]

Sorry, I was really unclear there! I’m normally not so bad at putting things into words but this is a subject that seems difficult to express. What I meant is that I am deeply unhappy in a way that seems to physically hurt now and that’s hard because I feel like I should be grateful for what I have rather than pining over what I don’t. I SHOULD be happy. But it’s becoming harder to push the unhappiness down each time it surfaces.

 

Go to therapy, Greg. If nothing else, it will help you to accept what you are embroiled in which in turn will leave you happier in your lot. It's called acceptance.

[Betterwithout]

I just listened to a good podcast from Tony Robbins (love him or hate him), he opened my eyes to something very interesting I never thought of...

This is my relationship to a "T". Our POLARITY is way off. I always looked at Love Languages as the key stumbling block in the marriage, but it's actually it's the polarity of feminine and masculine energies.

 

I started out my dating life in my teens as a "people pleaser" and beta male. This continued into my 20's and early 30's. After my divorce, I began to "grow a pair" and refused to be a doormat to anyone who met me.

This opened the door to much more quality woman including my current wife. At the core, I still have my beta, people pleasing attributes, but I try to instill a little more leadership and assertiveness in my relationship.

The problem is that this my wife has similar polarity to me. She has more of a masculine presence, and I have a more feminine presence. So when she is acting masculine its a huge turn off and when I express a masculine side

we butt heads. It's like our disagreements would be resolved in minutes if I was more feminine, but I wrestle with being walked on. Women desire masculine, is this a myth?

I admit am not great at fights...words come out the wrong way, and my unwillingness to submit and show my feminine core fuels the fire.

 

SO,

I think the key to making this work is either:

1) me to let my guard down, be vulnerable and not worry about being walked on.

and allow her to be masculine in the relationship. (thus increase the polarity)

or

2) Hope the she can be less assertive and allow my masculine energy to shine. I realize I don't need to be the boss of the relationship, but somehow create space for polarity.

 

Does any of this make sense?

 

A part of TR article on Polarity..

You couldn’t stand being away from your partner at the beginning of your relationship. You thought about them all the time. You were physically near them whenever possible. Why is that? It’s because there was an initial spark, an enormous sense of passion, that was binding you two together.

Over time, you’ve found that that passion has fizzled. You still love your partner, but your relationship is lacking the magnetic attraction it once had. One thing is certain: Love is not enough. You need both love and passion for your relationship to work.

What helps create passion in a relationship? Polarity.

 

Polarity is the ultimate key to passion. In any successful relationship that has an intimate connection and sexual attraction, there is polarity. What does this mean exactly? Polarity is defined as the spark that occurs between two opposing energies — masculine and feminine. Gender does not affect whether you have masculine or feminine energy. Couples can be the same or opposite sex, but in order for the pairing to work, one partner has to provide the masculine energy while the other brings the feminine. The primary driving force behind masculine energy is working toward a direction or goal, while feminine energy seeks emotional fulfillment and connection.

 

Has your relationship depolarized? You’re not feeling the connection you used to because both of you have developed the same type of energy, be it masculine or feminine. This can happen in a variety of ways. A masculine partner can become more feminine when they are required to take on the role of caretaker in the relationship, and a feminine partner can become more masculine when they’re tasked with leading the charge in major decisions or confronting stressful situations. When polarities become too similar, passion dies. Now what do you have? In place of what was once a sexy, fun, amazing relationship is now a friendship.

[IAmFCA]

I have lived through this as the woman who skews to theoretically masculine traits, and I have a people pleaser bf now.

 

Yes, the dynamic you describe is true. It does not have to be that way.

 

Try reframing everything. I mean, everything, your whole world view, in such a way that there is no Good, and no Bad. There is only skills of various kinds. You are a set of skills. She is a set of skills. Skills include knowing ways to think, to see, to choose, to find words, to behave. Its all part of a set of skills. Consider that she wants to please you too -- saying you're a people pleaser seems to set you apart from her. But most of us would prefer to please others, especially our SOs. You two SHARE this trait.

 

You can do only what your skills permit. She can do only what her skills permit. Maybe you please one another, maybe you don't. What's it matter -- you can't do what you don't know. Maybe you feel bad when you don't please her; how does that help? All it does is bring you down and bring your focus away from her and onto yourself. Instead, accept your skills as they are and when you fall short in your own eyes see that as a gift. That is an opportunity to learn a new skill.

 

Being a people pleaser makes you just like the rest of us. Please yourself (aren't you a person?) by accepting yourself and learning new skills as you go.

[abitbroken]

I agree in not being a doormat helps you attract a mate...but...

 

Love languages come into play not to attract a mate with it, but help communication in a relationship that has already started -- its part of the communication and helping it grow. There are so many couples who say "i don't think he/she loves me anymore" when the other person actually fiercely loves the other person, but somehow things are breaking down. Classic example is the guy who is changing a woman's oil on her car, putting up shelves for her, making her a cake, and then the woman says "he doesn't say he loves me enough..." Well, when she opens her eyes and sees all the things he voluntarily does without her asking....he is saying it constantly...

[Greg40s]

Yeah, I don't know if I subscribe to any of this, be it the use of the terms masculine and feminine energy or the idea that a relationship requires polarity but, if it helps you make sense of some of your behaviours and how they might be approached better between the two of you, then absolutely take what you can from it. But I'd be wary of jumping on a Tony Robbins simplification as if those basic things have now defined who you and your wife are when, as Abitbroken says, there could be a lot more to see. Not being completely walked over is a good thing, whether it attracts your partner or not. Being a people pleaser is, as IAmFCA points out, just like most of us and again not a bad thing. It's how we get on with people. And these things aren't mutually exclusive. You can be a people pleaser who still looks out for his own needs when they matter. And if your disagreements could be resolved quicker, unless you truly were being walked over and about things that genuinely strongly matter to you, I would jump at that.

 

This feels like it has been a long story for you. Have you talked these things out with your wife recently? Given how the thread started (love languages) and now polarities, I can't help but wonder if you're looking for something to define what is wrong when, really, it's going to come down to the two of you and where you're at in life.

[IAmFCA]

Exactly

 

 

It is 100% possible to look after yourself, heed your own inner voice, and be kind to others, concurrently.

 

In fact, it is kindest to do so, even when the thing you need to do is contrary to what someone else wants.

 

Be kind; it is not the same thing as nice.

[Betterwithout]

Thank you all. There are so many angles. Relationships are so complex aren't they?

There is no "one size fits all", so we have to try different viewpoints.

 

Seems the more I delve into meaning in my marriage, the more confusing it gets.

I like what IAmFCA mentioned about reframing as "no good, no bad". Sounds like if I can get out of my own way and just stay kind all throughout, things will all work out.

 

Greg40s Yes, it's been quite a journey with this marriage. My first 9 year marriage was so simple and so easy. This one has been much tougher, but like no two people are alike, no marriages are alike.

 

Thanks for all your words everyone.

 

Aside from love languages and polarity theories, maybe my goal should be to simplify and not overthink.

I can simply focus on being a kind supportive loving person to everyone in my life (family, friends, co-worker, children and wife) and see where that takes me.

Maybe at the end of the day, I should let go of wanting to receive and continue on giving unconditionally. I've seen many succeed at that.

 

Have a great weekend everyone!

[Savannian27]

Try different things in the bedroom. The same old thing gets boring after awhile. I agree with @ThatwasThen as well, you can't judge a woman on the fact that she won't orgasm every time. Everyone is different. It can happen immediately or after an hour or two of several different positions. Your expectations should only be what you expect of yourself every time you have sex. Putting the pressure on her will make her lock up emotionally, and as a result the other 30% you mentioned that aren't the sex-related issues are entirely attributed from that feeling.

 

Opening her up to a newer & different kind of sexual experience would show her what she's missing out on. Ask her what she enjoys the most, and then build from there. The second you allow judgment to enter the bedroom, game over.

[IAmFCA]

Thank you all. There are so many angles. Relationships are so complex aren't they?

There is no "one size fits all", so we have to try different viewpoints.

 

Seems the more I delve into meaning in my marriage, the more confusing it gets.

I like what IAmFCA mentioned about reframing as "no good, no bad". Sounds like if I can get out of my own way and just stay kind all throughout, things will all work out.

 

Greg40s Yes, it's been quite a journey with this marriage. My first 9 year marriage was so simple and so easy. This one has been much tougher, but like no two people are alike, no marriages are alike.

 

Thanks for all your words everyone.

 

Aside from love languages and polarity theories, maybe my goal should be to simplify and not overthink.

I can simply focus on being a kind supportive loving person to everyone in my life (family, friends, co-worker, children and wife) and see where that takes me.

Maybe at the end of the day, I should let go of wanting to receive and continue on giving unconditionally. I've seen many succeed at that.

 

Have a great weekend everyone!

 

OP

 

Be a kind loving and supportive person to yourself first, before all else. When you th8nk about it, it relates directly to how you interact generously with others. Remember to respect your own voice first, that way, you will feel energized by your choices and have plenty of "you" available to focus on others.