IAmFCA Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 I do not like/expect a guy to pay on the first date. It's 2017 and I'm a grown woman with my own income. "Expect" is a strong word to apply to someone/thing beyond my control. Two self sustaining adults. Someone's gotta pay. I don't care how we do it, but if I initiate and plan, I expect to pay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IAmFCA Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 I do not like/expect a guy to pay on the first date. It's 2017 and I'm a grown woman with my own income. You wouldn't like it if he paid? why is that? Is it okay for him to let you pay? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SherrySher Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 Split the cheque, no harm no foul. If you paid for the meal though and it's not split, then hopefully he will be a gentleman and offer a movie afterwards or to pay for the next date. If he offers neither, then don't accept another date. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Everlong13 Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 You wouldn't like it if he paid? why is that? Is it okay for him to let you pay? No I think it should be split 50/50. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batya33 Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 I do not like/expect a guy to pay on the first date. It's 2017 and I'm a grown woman with my own income. LOL I had my own income in 1997 too and was a grown woman as did many of my female peers (and yes in the 1980s too) . Had nothing to do with a man asking me out and paying for what we did on the date. If I'd had no income I would have shared that in the planning as a just in case to let him know what my budget was, especially if he chose something out of my budget. I don't relate to expecting a guy to pay on a first meet or having that arrangement since to me that is not a date. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Everlong13 Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 LOL I had my own income in 1997 too and was a grown woman as did many of my female peers (and yes in the 1980s too) . Had nothing to do with a man asking me out and paying for what we did on the date. If I'd had no income I would have shared that in the planning as a just in case to let him know what my budget was, especially if he chose something out of my budget. I don't relate to expecting a guy to pay on a first meet or having that arrangement since to me that is not a date. Well done....? My point is that expecting a guy to pay for the date is outdated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batya33 Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 Well done....? My point is that expecting a guy to pay for the date is outdated. Perhaps -not what I see around me and not because of the reasons you gave IMO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seizeilgiron Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 Yess girl that happened to me too. I went out with my current bf who will probably be my ex in the very near future, but we went out and had lunch. And it was awkward because he waited to tell me that he did not have any money to buy food. BUt I did not care if he did not pay for me, because I didn't think we were on a date. I would have gladly paid for my part of the meal, and he the other, but he didn't. It was awkward. He also then did this to me several occasions when the bill was going to be more expensive, and if he ever paid for something, it was something small like a candy bar. Months later he told me about his financial situation, but still. I would have liked to know before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willdation Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 This is all pretty simple. It all comes down to women being more vulnerable when pregnant and giving birth to a small child and instinctively needing to feel secure in knowing their partner can support them if needed. End of story. I would also like to point out that both men and women are valuable and we should embrace our differences instead of trying to force everyone into a monotonous / androgynous culture. I actually watched a documentary last night where in Cambodia, the communist party there aimed so much for "equality' they would actually sentence people to death for wearing reading glasses. The reason was that reading glasses gave the perception a person was more intelligent and therefore not fitting in with with their "equality" agenda that everyone must act and look the same. I would also like to point out that even North Korea had a similar agenda where they aimed for a society as "analogous as a bowl of gold fish" I really believe in equal opportunity and celebrating our diversity, including valuing men and women and our differences...NOT saying a woman is only valuable by dressing and acting like a man or a man is only valuable by acting and dressing like a woman. To stigmatize and demonize people for not being monotonous and androgynous is wrong and borderline following the same path of many of those regimes from the past... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Everlong13 Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 This is all pretty simple. It all comes down to women being more vulnerable when pregnant and giving birth to a small child and instinctively needing to feel secure in knowing their partner can support them if needed. End of story. I would also like to point out that both men and women are valuable and we should embrace our differences instead of trying to force everyone into a monotonous / androgynous culture. I actually watched a documentary last night where in Cambodia, the communist party there aimed so much for "equality' they would actually sentence people to death for wearing reading glasses. The reason was that reading glasses gave the perception a person was more intelligent and therefore not fitting in with with their "equality" agenda that everyone must act and look the same. I would also like to point out that even North Korea had a similar agenda where they aimed for a society as "analogous as a bowl of gold fish" I really believe in equal opportunity and celebrating our diversity, including valuing men and women and our differences...NOT saying a woman is only valuable by dressing and acting like a man or a man is only valuable by acting and dressing like a woman. To stigmatize and demonize people for not being monotonous and androgynous is wrong and borderline following the same path of many of those regimes from the past... Wow. Nobody is stigmatising or demonising anyone as far as I can see? People earning their own wages should be able to pay their own way. Once my ex and I had defined ourselves as a couple he paid for meals more than I did as he stayed at mine most of the time and was eating my food/using my electricity. But when you're on a date I think it's unfair to expect the man pays just because he has a penis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willdation Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 I know it may seem far-fetched, but there really are biological and instinctive reasons for our actions.... I am not saying a man should pay for everything, but, I can at least appreciate the reasoning why a woman would deep down in her subconscious want security....I can appreciate the needing for a woman to feel secure and not be interested in perusing a romantic relationship with a guy who is unemployed and not able to support himself or others. I get that.... There was a comment above along the lines of that if anyone thinks there are differences between men and women, they are sexist....It is this thinking that I am pointing out as a version of "equality" that does not embrace diversity... Anyway, it all comes down the the couple and what works best for them.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
katrina1980 Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 I do not like/expect a guy to pay on the first date. It's 2017 and I'm a grown woman with my own income. Have you read this thread? It's NOT about the money. I have my own money too, make a good salary, but I like a man to pay for first few dates because doing so reflects his interest. It doesn't have to be expensive. Heck, if I liked him (and wouldn't be out with him if I didn't), a walk and ice cream would be fun! It's the gesture, spending time, not how much money he spends. For me. Call me "old fashioned" if you want, but I was raised to believe when a man invites me out on a "date" (as opposed to friends), he pays. Why wouldn't a woman expect him to pay under those circumstances? HE invited her out on a date! And the men I date are happy to pay, they expect to pay because it was a romantic date, he invited me, and treating me reflects his interest. Again, what I was raised to believe. It's sort of ingrained in me to think this way. I am only talking first few dates. It's called "courtship" and I don't care how old someone is or how much money they make, courtship is still alive and kicking in our society today. I rather like it. If a man insisted we split, or forgot his wallet, or some other lame excuse to wiggle out of paying, then I would assume, naturally, he was not that interested, after spending time with me on the date. Or cheap. No thanks. That said, if you or anyone enjoys splitting, or paying whole tab, more power to ya! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IAmFCA Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 Whether one has one's own income is not relevant. How much we each make is not relevant. If one needs clarity, get some before going out. The idea that a date SHOULD be split because we each are adults is needlessly rigid. If a man opens my door, am I to think he thinks I am unable? Nonsense. Kindness is kindness. If a man wants to pay for our date, then I thank him for it. If I have been in control of the invitation and the agenda, then I expect to pay. Similarly I expect to be paid for if an invitation has been issued, such as "Would you let me take you to that new place on the corner?" If a plan is tossed out for joint approval - "Lets do something Friday - dinner maybe?" - then I have no such expectations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willdation Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 I agree with the above. I also strongly believe that the courtship should never end in a relationship. Even if if you are married for 20 years, a man should always court his woman..... A lot of men after being married will stop all the courtship. They will stop taking their wives out on dates... Stop with the little surprises. Then after 10 years are shocked when their wife wants a divorce and there is a lack of romance... They were once cheap with the dates, but not soo cheap in dealing with lawyer fees.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IAmFCA Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 I agree with the above. I also strongly believe that the courtship should never end in a relationship. Even if if you are married for 20 years, a man should always court his woman..... A lot of men after being married will stop all the courtship. They will stop taking their wives out on dates... Stop with the little surprises. Then after 10 years are shocked when their wife wants a divorce and there is a lack of romance... They were once cheap with the dates, but not soo cheap in dealing with lawyer fees.... Agree, and this goes both ways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
katrina1980 Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 Agree, and this goes both ways. Agree. Relationships are give and take. In different ways perhaps, but give and take nevertheless. No one is suggesting the man do "all" the work here. Who pays is really a very small part of the overall dynamic in my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Giblesp Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 A guys asked me out to a dinner and picked the restaurant. Toward the end, when the waiter came to drop off the bill, the waiter leaned toward the guy and put the bill on the table closer to him. I reached out to my purse to get my credit card; and even though he noticed it, he did not make any comments that he will pay for everything. I put my credit card on the bill. Meanwhile he was still trying to find his wallet in his jacket. He put his card on the table next to mine; and then few seconds later he made an offer to pay for everything. He was not very insisting or anything. To me, if he really wanted to pay for the dinner, he could had grab the bill right away when the waiter put it on the table. I replied "That is fine; I will pay my share." When the waiter came back, he asked how he should split it; and I replied half 50-50. He was just silent. I am not one of those women who thinks men must always pay because that is how it should be. However, it was a bit weird how he acted. He was the one who asked me out on a dinner date and picked the place. I do not think it is his lack of interest because he texted me right after we left the restaurant that he cannot wait to see me again. When on a date, I always offer to pay on the first date, and the guys say no except this one. Also in my last relationship, my ex paid most of the time, but I would pay here and there because I did not feel right he paying all the time. But I personally cannot stand cheap people and to me what he did last night was a bit not nice for a gentleman. Why do you expect him to pay for your food? Have you provided a service for which you expect payment? If so, you must make clear that you expect payment before meeting. If its a date that your going on, then in this day of equality where women can work sometimes women will pay, and sometimes the man will pay. Unless your from a country where women don't have equality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Giblesp Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 I have my own money too, make a good salary, but I like a man to pay for first few dates because doing so reflects his interest. That would indicate that though you are making money, you are willing to take his. You cant have equality with the benefits of the 1950's. This is selfish, self centered behavior totally hypocritical to the idea of equality and self sufficiency. You are also indicating that you must be given materialism to feel someones interest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
katrina1980 Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 That would indicate that though you are making money, you are willing to take his. You cant have equality with the benefits of the 1950's. This is selfish, self centered behavior totally hypocritical to the idea of equality and self sufficiency. You are also indicating that you must be given materialism to feel someones interest. I explained my position and WHY I felt this way. It's conditioning for one thing, how I was raised, what I was raised to believe. First few dates. If you are confused about my position, suggest you go back and read. It has NOTHING to do with "materialism." Again, go back and read my posts if confused about that. Anyway, not gonna apologize for that, I own it. Apparently you and others have an issue with it, why? The men I date feel same as I do, it works for us, so what's your point? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
figureitout23 Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 Wow. Nobody is stigmatising or demonising anyone as far as I can see? People earning their own wages should be able to pay their own way. Once my ex and I had defined ourselves as a couple he paid for meals more than I did as he stayed at mine most of the time and was eating my food/using my electricity. But when you're on a date I think it's unfair to expect the man pays just because he has a penis. You say you're not stigmatizing and demonized but that's exactly what you're doing ' I make my OWN money.' You meant for that to come off condescending. No where on this entire thread did any responder say they EXPECTED a man to pay for their dinner. Preference, yes expectation, no. I like when a man pays but don't get confused, I make my own money as well and go into any situation fully prepared to pay for what I order. It's the same as going out with friends and they surprise me and cover my tab, should I jump up and scream, ' back off I can pay for this I'm an independent woman!' If you're gonna come in here guns blazing at least read the thread. Sheesh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
katrina1980 Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 To clarify, if a man invites me out on a date, assuming a romantic date, I do expect him to pay. Why wouldn't I? HE invited me out on a date! If I was the initiator and invited HIM out on a date, then "I" would expect to pay. If we plan together to do something, then I actually wouldn't assume it was a "date" and would would split. But when HE specifically invites me out? On a date? Yes I most certainly would and do expect him to pay, and if he didn't I would assume low interest on his part or he's cheap. FIRST FEW DATES as explained previously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
figureitout23 Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 Why do you expect him to pay for your food? Have you provided a service for which you expect payment? If so, you must make clear that you expect payment before meeting. If its a date that your going on, then in this day of equality where women can work sometimes women will pay, and sometimes the man will pay. Unless your from a country where women don't have equality. That makes 3 prostitution references on this thread alone. Because everyone knows if a man opens his wallet it's to pay for sex... And this thread was going so well yesterday... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
figureitout23 Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 Katrina I think you quoted the wrong person, I agree with your stance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
katrina1980 Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 Katrina I think you quoted the wrong person, I agree with your stance. Oops sorry! I'm a bit frazzled this morn, have tons to do before work and this thresd is distracting me!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
figureitout23 Posted December 11, 2017 Share Posted December 11, 2017 Oops sorry! I'm a bit frazzled this morn, have tons to do before work and this thresd is distracting me!! Same. I gotta leave it be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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