Blue Spiral's Adventures in Solitude

[Fudgie]

Yeah, it didn't work, but that's okay. I wants things I can't have either, like an inordinate amount of money, or a flying car. You can't always get what you want, or rather, the sacrifices to get there are not worth the undertaking.

[Blue Spiral]

I'm continuing to avoid women, in the sense that I'm not pursuing them...but some women are seeking me out. Former FWBs--and women that I wanted to be FWBs--sometimes chat with me, send me pictures, and occasionally even get on cam for me.

 

About half of these women have boyfriends/husbands. I should probably feel guilty, but I don't...

[Blue Spiral]

Well, I don't have any news to report...which is just the way I like it, mostly. I've been avoiding women and doing the things I enjoy. At the moment, I'm extremely happy for football-related reasons, but I doubt that will last much longer, sadly. I'm going to enjoy it for as long as I can, though.

 

I'm not particularly disciplined, so I struggle when it comes to getting things done, but I've been surprisingly productive over the last few weeks.

 

I think that I've perfected my Clark Kent act a little too well. I was eating (alone) at a restaurant, a few weeks back, and a gaggle of relatively young (and presumably single) church women were sitting across from me. I'd say that they were in their late twenties/early thirties. They started a conversation with me and asked me why I wasn't there with my girlfriend/wife, since I looked and acted like a "relationship-type guy". If only they knew. They weren't hitting on me, but they claimed that they have trouble finding "guys like me" (clean-shaven, non-tattooed, never-been-divorced men with no babymamas, I guess?), and wanted to know where we were hiding. I was shocked that females actually approached me in public, but I know church women all too well, and I escaped ASAP.

 

Aside from them, the only women I've spoken with in a personal context have been ENA women (who mostly yell at me) and cam models (who thankfully don't), and I'm inclined to keep it that way for a while.

[Fudgie]

I've been approached by more conservative guys at times too, because I have no tattoos, I dress conservatively, I don't dye my hair, etc. so I look like a "good girl". Only if you get to know me for a few min outside of a work setting, and you'll find that I curse a fair bit, I don't like religion, no marriage/kids, etc. So much for that.

 

You'd think people would learn that determining one's values simply by looks isn't very effective. Unless of course, you're talking about orthodox Jewish folks or something.

[annie24]

wanted to know where we were hiding.

 

wow, their "relationship-type guy" radar is off!!

[Blue Spiral]

I've been approached by more conservative guys at times too, because I have no tattoos, I dress conservatively, I don't dye my hair, etc. so I look like a "good girl". Only if you get to know me for a few min outside of a work setting, and you'll find that I curse a fair bit, I don't like religion, no marriage/kids, etc. So much for that.

 

I'm much more private than you--outside of my oldest friend, the only people who know that I don't want marriage/kids are the women I've slept with. And none of those women know about my other beliefs, nor do they know key things about my personality/past.

 

wow, their "relationship-type guy" radar is off!!

 

I don't blame them...between the way I look and the fact that I give off a safe/stable vibe, women tend to misread me.

[annie24]

A man with tattoos and long hair can be very relationship oriented. They're obviously mistaking clean cut for "looking for a serious relationship." Obviously untrue.

[TMifune]

A man with tattoos and long hair can be very relationship oriented. They're obviously mistaking clean cut for "looking for a serious relationship." Obviously untrue.

 

I dropped my wallet coming out of a restaurant once, right in front of these 5 or 6 bikers who were talking on the sidewalk. Full gear, gnarly facial hair and all. One of them scooped it up and handed it back to me with a really friendly look. As I walked away I'm pretty sure they were talking about a Church Event. Perceptions are a funny thing.

[Fudgie]

Yup, some of the nicest people I've known are part of my city's death metal scene. They usually have a lot of tattoos, wear all black, long hair (both men and women), and hang out in a lot of bars. Lots of genuinely nice people who would help the bands with their gear, offer to stand by and make sure nothing was stolen, pay for your drink if you didn't have enough money to buy a beer, etc. Just a lot of cool people. And yeah, most of them were in long term relationships.

[Blue Spiral]

If people ever realize that perception is overrated, the world will be a much better place...but my life will get considerably trickier. I guess I'll cross that bridge if/when I come to it.

 

I called home, yesterday--my dad answered, and I heard my mom yelling at him in the background. My mom called me, today--when I answered, I heard my dad yelling at her in the background. Ugh.

 

I've been reading Dougie's latest thread, which is probably unwise on my part. I can definitely relate to his immaturity situation. I'm pretty immature, myself, and it's sort of funny how people refuse to connect that to relationship experience, especially when it comes to men. IMHO, the reason that most men mature is because women make them. My year, maybe-year-and-a-half of monogamy has me at roughly a high-school-freshman level of maturity...though some of the women I've known would argue that I'm even less mature than that. It's hilarious how someone will deny you relationship experience and then promptly turn around and accuse you of being inexperienced. Please note, I'm not saying that men are entitled to relationship experience, I'm just saying that it isn't fair to accuse someone of not having something when you're simultaneously refusing to provide it. A man can't get that kind of experience by himself--he's dependent on women to give it to him. If that doesn't happen, you shouldn't be surprised if the man remains in a state of arrested development. Again, I'm not saying that women are obligated to make us more mature, I'm just saying that if we keep getting rejected, you shouldn't be surprised if we remain in a porn-and-video-games haze. Cause and effect is sort of a thing.

[annie24]

IMHO, the reason that most men mature is because women make them.

 

I can definitely see where you are coming from here. I went on a few dates with this guy (Bodhi, I wrote about him in my journal), and while I think he's a good guy, I also didn't feel a connection. He also had a lot of "immature" hobbies (video games, following his favorite bands, etc...) that I wouldn't normally associate with a man in his late 30s. Based on what he told me, it didn't sound like he had a lot of relationship experience. However, I could also see if he had a serious gf, that she would make him mature a bit (i.e., less time with video games, more time having dinner with other couples, etc...) From a professional perspective, Bodhi is doing well in his career and just got promoted.

[TMifune]

If people ever realize that perception is overrated, the world will be a much better place...but my life will get considerably trickier. I guess I'll cross that bridge if/when I come to it.

 

I called home, yesterday--my dad answered, and I heard my mom yelling at him in the background. My mom called me, today--when I answered, I heard my dad yelling at her in the background. Ugh.

 

I've been reading Dougie's latest thread, which is probably unwise on my part. I can definitely relate to his immaturity situation. I'm pretty immature, myself, and it's sort of funny how people refuse to connect that to relationship experience, especially when it comes to men. IMHO, the reason that most men mature is because women make them. My year, maybe-year-and-a-half of monogamy has me at roughly a high-school-freshman level of maturity...though some of the women I've known would argue that I'm even less mature than that. It's hilarious how someone will deny you relationship experience and then promptly turn around and accuse you of being inexperienced. Please note, I'm not saying that men are entitled to relationship experience, I'm just saying that it isn't fair to accuse someone of not having something when you're simultaneously refusing to provide it. A man can't get that kind of experience by himself--he's dependent on women to give it to him. If that doesn't happen, you shouldn't be surprised if the man remains in a state of arrested development. Again, I'm not saying that women are obligated to make us more mature, I'm just saying that if we keep getting rejected, you shouldn't be surprised if we remain in a porn-and-video-games haze. Cause and effect is sort of a thing.

 

That's largely because we're defining "mature" by what serves female interests.....especially if it requires the sacrifice of male interests.

[Fudgie]

For me, I define maturity on the ability to be self sufficient, both in a monetary sense and personal sense. Taking responsibility for your needs, desires, and things that you take on. Knowing how to pick your battles. I don't classify hobbies, like video games, as immature (I spent 2 hours playing Elder Scrolls Online today, heh).

 

The issue with Dougie and his thread is that he's expecting women to get into a relationship with him despite his immature life outlook and limited experience and he sounds pretty entitled to attention and, as you said, no one is owed that.

 

Personally, I don't mind sexually inexperienced men. One of my exes was an older virgin and pretty much all of my past partners only had a few partners. It's the everything else part. I don't feel like holding someone's hand through everything to show them how to do things that I've learned before I even started dating. How to cook. How to manage money. How to pick a good restaurant. Going to activities other than bars. Having to show the guy new hobbies because he didn't have any before me. That's lame.

 

As I said to Dougie, NSA sex is a good bet but he needs to be open to all venues and lower his standards. A woman wanting NSA sex has the pick of the litter but that is not true for men.

[Blue Spiral]

That's largely because we're defining "mature" by what serves female interests.....especially if it requires the sacrifice of male interests.

 

You're absolutely right. A majority of women do things that I personally think are immature--excessive texting, bridal obsession, watching romcoms, etc.--but, if men up and decided that they agreed with me, women wouldn't stop doing those things and become more "mature" for us. They'd tell us to screw off. They're simply more in-demand than we are, so they have the advantage when it comes to negotiating.

 

Still...I think that women can have a civilizing effect on men. Or at least biological consequences can. If not for relationships and the resulting pregnancies, men wouldn't have much of an investment in society. If I were married and had kids, I'd have to work more to earn more money, which would help the economy--and the added responsibility would force me to be more responsible in general. Instead, I'm the way I currently am.

 

It's the everything else part. I don't feel like holding someone's hand through everything to show them how to do things that I've learned before I even started dating. How to cook. How to manage money. How to pick a good restaurant. Going to activities other than bars. Having to show the guy new hobbies because he didn't have any before me. That's lame.

 

Yeah, my lack of interest in life has definitely hurt me with women. I don't care about activities or travel or anything like that. I like peace and quiet and staying in and sex. That drove both of my girlfriends crazy...I never wanted to go out and do anything.

[Fudgie]

See, it's funny because a lot of girls I know stay in a fair bit. I do myself but I am limited by income at the moment. I am not a jetsetter but any means but I like to take day dreams to Canada to screw around and going to a few local festivals. Is there really a true lack of women who just want to hang out at home all the time? That's unfortunate.

 

It's just the entitled attitude of some men that really bugs me (not you), when they demand and feel entitled to something from other people (like traits, attractiveness) that they don't have themselves. It's like women who don't have much education or anything or even a job but expect a man to make a ton of money so they can stay home.

[Blue Spiral]

See, it's funny because a lot of girls I know stay in a fair bit. I do myself but I am limited by income at the moment. I am not a jetsetter but any means but I like to take day dreams to Canada to screw around and going to a few local festivals. Is there really a true lack of women who just want to hang out at home all the time? That's unfortunate.

 

Well, I did find one woman that was surprisingly okay with it...but my other issues got in the way.

 

It's just the entitled attitude of some men that really bugs me (not you), when they demand and feel entitled to something from other people (like traits, attractiveness) that they don't have themselves. It's like women who don't have much education or anything or even a job but expect a man to make a ton of money so they can stay home.

 

Both of those types bug me, actually. In fact, I dislike men far more than women, but that's another story...

[TMifune]

See, it's funny because a lot of girls I know stay in a fair bit. I do myself but I am limited by income at the moment. I am not a jetsetter but any means but I like to take day dreams to Canada to screw around and going to a few local festivals. Is there really a true lack of women who just want to hang out at home all the time? That's unfortunate.

 

It's just the entitled attitude of some men that really bugs me (not you), when they demand and feel entitled to something from other people (like traits, attractiveness) that they don't have themselves. It's like women who don't have much education or anything or even a job but expect a man to make a ton of money so they can stay home.

 

I tend to think this is because the homebodies (and I don't mean that negatively like some might) just don't cross each other's paths as much. You know. If someone goes to work, stops at the grocery store and then goes home everyday, the only places they're likely to meet the people who do the same are at work or at the grocery store. It think that you're right, it's far more common than people think, but by definition the people that are spending a lot of time at home aren't seen because most of us aren't sharing our homes with strangers.

[TMifune]

For me, I define maturity on the ability to be self sufficient, both in a monetary sense and personal sense. Taking responsibility for your needs, desires, and things that you take on. Knowing how to pick your battles. I don't classify hobbies, like video games, as immature (I spent 2 hours playing Elder Scrolls Online today, heh).

 

I think I'd define it as a recognition of how your behaviors affect the world around you in both scope and magnitude. Responsibility would be a direct outflow of that. So if for instance you recognize that being 23 and living at home without contributing creates a drain on your parents, you'd want to take action to prevent that.

 

So I think that what you're saying is a large part of what I was getting at. If someone's neglecting their responsibilities to play video games, I think we could call that immature. (if done regularly....every once in awhile people need to be able to slide on something). But certain activities are mentioned as being inherently immature, and I don't think that's the case. If a 35 year old man has met his obligations and wants to play some video games or follow some indie music or build a pillow fort in his living room, I don't think that makes him immature anymore than going to a Broadway show would make him refined.

[Fudgie]

I absolutely agree. Meeting responsibilities and learning life skills and dealing with difficult situations properly is what makes someone mature. Not one's interests. I'm 26 and I like video games, stuffed animals, doll houses, and Disney/Pixar movies. My autistic sister loves My Little Pony and yes, I'll watch it with her. I am not immature for doing these things and I think anyone who judges maturity based on this doesn't know the true definition.

 

I am a big believer in play and making yourself feel good. It's healthy. I think one of the appeals of having children to some people is that they get an "excuse" to indulge their inner child and childhood interests. I don't need an excuse.

[Blue Spiral]

This may be a good time to mention that my idea of "interior decoration" consists primarily of action figures...! I make a run-through of the classic Mario games every year, as well.

 

Some single women wear wedding rings to keep guys from hitting on them. I make sure to tell women about my interior decoration, so I scare off/weed out the ones that I wouldn't be compatible with. Works like a charm.

[Fudgie]

Honestly, that's not that bad. I have 3 Star Wars art pictures up, plus a dragon poster, framed next to my "real" art posters, also framed.

 

What is a big no-no to me with decorating is many liquor bottles out in the open. I don't know why. I like to drink so it's not like alcohol bothers me. I just don't like it when people display their cheap liquor bottles like on mantels as if it's something to be proud of. Extra negative points if the bottles are empty. It's so trashy. Literally, it's trash! Ooo you drink! So sophisticate, much maturity, wow.

[annie24]

yeah, it's like in college when i went to a frat house, and they "decorated" with dozens of empty bottles of Jager. That's great for a frat house, not good for anyone else.

[itsallgrand]

Literally, it's trash! OMG, that's funny. I never connected the two - trashy and actual trash on display. But it's true.

 

I particularly love as I've seen more than my fair share of these collections (people who are not college age, way beyond with children) displayed proudly. I won't diss on it because I like some of those people, even if they do display trash lol. Usually a fair bit of brand loyalty going on too.

[itsallgrand]

And I won't diss on people with classic video game collections either, or Star Wars, or comics, or posters, or anything. You guys are just collectors - it's not me, but it's cool.

[Blue Spiral]

I'm not a collector at all, for the record. I'm a geek. I don't preserve stuff in plastic, I read it/use it. OK, I don't actually play with my toys, anymore, except when my niece is here...

 

Also, I don't drink, and never have--which has not exactly helped me with women.

 

I continue to be contacted by women that I tried to be FWBs with, but failed, and they can't figure out why I don't want to be "platonic friends" with them. I've had more than enough of that for one lifetime, thank you.