Catherine_3 Posted January 7, 2014 Author Share Posted January 7, 2014 Ok so are you insecure still about the time he almost cheated and fear it will happen again? Have you asked him why he struggled back then? Maybe he wasn't ready for a baby but is happy now No I'm not. When I forgave him and decided to move forward, I gave him my heart and me trust fully. We never looked back. No lingering insecurities or grudges. It was the lying and disrespect that bothered me back then. Not so much the thought of him with another woman, which was probably why I was able to move on without insecurities. I haven't asked him why he struggled. He admitted he used to struggle with it but has now resigned himself to porn and he's fine with that. I honestly find that a bit sad, like there was a part of him that had to die in order for our family to be happy together. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catherine_3 Posted January 7, 2014 Author Share Posted January 7, 2014 Just to clarify, are you saying that no, you would NOT want him to have a relationship with another woman he would be unwilling to give up if you asked? Just want to make sure I understand. I guess it would depend on the nature of the relationship and how it affected us. But that doesn't sound particularly pleasant, no. And I'm not one to put up with disrespect or bs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moontiger Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 I guess it would depend on the nature of the relationship and how it affected us. But that doesn't sound particularly pleasant, no. And I'm not one to put up with disrespect or bs. Well, this is an out come you have to consider. In the story I posted, P and M had an open relationship because M had a long standing sexual relationship with someone and thought it was only fair that her husband get the same options. But when he developed feelings for L and refused to give her up, it was the end of their marriage. Given that you have small children its an outcome I think you need to think a lot about before moving forward. Bottom line, is the risk , even if low, worth it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catherine_3 Posted January 7, 2014 Author Share Posted January 7, 2014 If you feel this way about women cheating. Why do you think its okay for men? I don't think it's ok for either gender to cheat. That's why I nearly divorce him over it. It's only cheating if you define it as such. There are things I can't do that I am fine with others doing. For example, I could never terminate a pregnancy. But I've supported friends through abortion, never judged them for it, and strongly support the right to choose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catherine_3 Posted January 7, 2014 Author Share Posted January 7, 2014 Well, this is an out come you have to consider. In the story I posted, P and M had an open relationship because M had a long standing sexual relationship with someone and thought it was only fair that her husband get the same options. But when he developed feelings for L and refused to give her up, it was the end of their marriage. Given that you have small children its an outcome I think you need to think a lot about before moving forward. Bottom line, is the risk , even if low, worth it? Is he happier with the new woman? I don't see people as a possession you need to grip onto. If my husband would be happier with someone else, and if that is a choice he willingly makes, then fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moontiger Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 Is he happier with the new woman? I don't see people as a possession you need to grip onto. If my husband would be happier with someone else, and if that is a choice he willingly makes, then fine. I honestly don't know. I don't know him well enough to say. My gut feeling is his kids are going to be pissed and things are not going to end well for my friend, L. But I could be wrong. If you can look into the future and be perfectly comfortable with this out come (him falling deeply for someone else, giving her love and attention, and placing her on equal footing with you) then go for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batya33 Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 Is he happier with the new woman? I don't see people as a possession you need to grip onto. If my husband would be happier with someone else, and if that is a choice he willingly makes, then fine. Neither do I. But I trust that when my husband and I took marriage vows we were excited about making a promise just to be with each other. No possessions, no gripping -free will. If he changes his mind about that then the option is divorce, not cheating. If I told him I'd be fine with him having sex outside of our marriage he would be deeply offended that I'd think he'd want to behave that way and hurt that I wouldn't care. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catherine_3 Posted January 7, 2014 Author Share Posted January 7, 2014 Neither do I. But I trust that when my husband and I took marriage vows we were excited about making a promise just to be with each other. No possessions, no gripping -free will. If he changes his mind about that then the option is divorce, not cheating. If I told him I'd be fine with him having sex outside of our marriage he would be deeply offended that I'd think he'd want to behave that way and hurt that I wouldn't care. Well thank goodness we cleared that one up. Thanks for clarifying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batya33 Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 Well thank goodness we cleared that one up. Thanks for clarifying. Any time - seems to me your suggestion to your husband might make him feel trapped when he didn't before - I would think he assumed, like most spouses, that you valued monogamy and fidelity within a marriage (for one thing I wouldn't blame him if he assumed that you asked because you'd like the freedom to cheat - even if you don't). And if you meant your post sarcastically that clarifies my opinions on your post even more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pl3asehelp Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 What you' ve been told is exactly what I would tell my sister. My intention isn't to insult you but to let you know that you're not as opaque as you think you are and that this is unlikely to help your family and very likely to cause significant problems and damage to you and your kids, which would be tragic because that could easily be avoided if you would do a little work here to solve the root problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catherine_3 Posted January 7, 2014 Author Share Posted January 7, 2014 you're not as opaque as you think you are I'm curious - what did I say that indicated I think I'm opaque? could easily be avoided if you would do a little work here to solve the root problem I'm here. I'm ready to work. I have answered all of the questions in this thread truthfully. I am willing to answer more. Bring it on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catherine_3 Posted January 7, 2014 Author Share Posted January 7, 2014 I'm still trying to figure out why everyone is up in arms. I didn't ask any of you to open your relationships. I didn't make generalizations about marriage, relationships or monogamy. I didn't try to start a debate or convince anyone of anything. I thought the original question was pretty narrow in focus and fairly clear. I get that it's controversial, such that most of you wouldn't consider it. But then, I didn't challenge you to. I simply asked if you guys could help me identify some of the potential issues that could arise. And several of you did give me some awesome points to think about. But for some reason the focus keeps coming back to answering the question "what sorts of things could possibly be horribly wrong with this poster? Let's all brainstorm on this..." It's turned into a sport. And I'm not sure why. -I never should have gotten married -I'm not a real wife -I don't think I'm as pretty as I used to be -My self worth is entirely wrapped up in my looks -I think I'm so cool -I think I'm opaque -I'm trying to impress my husband -I'm trying to impress you guys -I want you all to think I'm cool ...And the baseless assumptions continue. Good grief, those are a lot of conclusions to come to based on something very one-dimensional and narrow. Are you guys really that frightened by something you don't understand or agree with? There are societies where polygamy was the norm for centuries. Where a monogamous man would have been mocked and attacked, because he was different and that was scary. Gay people have been horrible mistreated because different scares people. What's the big deal? If I'm not asking you to change your relationship, why does it bother you guys so much? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batya33 Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 This has nothing to do with polygamy because your original question was whether it was a good idea to suggest to your husband -apparently for his own benefit because somehow you don't think he would initiate the discussion on his own- that he have sex outside the marriage if he feels like it, I think what concerns me is that I think you're being dishonest about your motives in asking him and you think you're being open-minded by giving him this option. That's why I think your decision was potentially harmful to your marriage. If what you asked was whether you should suggest to your husband that you both have the option to sleep with other people then yes I agree it would be about suggesting a polygamous arrangement. I disagree with your broad assumptions about being "trapped" just because people choose to be married. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fudgie Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 Bekka, I'm sorry if I ask anything that has been covered. I have read most of this thread. 1) Has your husband ever, and I mean EVER, given any indication that he is unhappy in the marriage or wants to open it? I assume he hasn't cheated, because I haven't read that he has. I am just wondering if your desire to open the relationship is JUST based on your assumption that he may not be happy or if there is clear evidence that he may be interested in this setup. 2) Do you think there is a serious risk that your family may become unstable? If your husband falls in love with another women or maybe just decides that he doesn't want to be married anymore? It would definitely shake up the lives of your children. Honestly, monogamy is for me and I don't date people who want polygamy or have done it in the past. I don't have a real issue with people choosing polygamy, when everyone is consenting adults and everyone is honest. I mean, it doesn't really hurt anyone and it's their choice.l However, I really think when you have kids, things change. I don't believe open marriages and polygamy are conducive to stable home environments, which children need. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pl3asehelp Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 If you really want help, you need to stop being defensive and be more honest. Most of this post is BS and you know it. You have already described marriage and monogamy as a trap, which is a horrible and negative generalization. Stop denying you've expressed these views - they're right here. The reason people are focusing on you is because you have failed to provide any reason for your proposal and given the context, which is more than relevant though you pretend it's not, we can only speculate why you proposed this to your husband. You continually try to obfuscate the issue and by going off on tangents about polygamy (nothing like your proposal), and fear of things that are not mainstream. Nobody can tell you much that will be helpful until we understand why you had this idea - the why is THE most important thing here. 'I'm a special snowflake' is not a reason. I think the fact that you are cut of from your family, are willing to make yourself miserable a neglect your own needs for your husband, got married because of a pregnancy, and that your husband has been very close to cheating on you before (you've been extremely vague on the details, which are very important) leads to a natural conclusion that your husband is all you have and you're deathly afraid of him leaving you - so much so that you are willing to do anything to try to keep a hold on him, including giving him some freedom he didn't ask for or express interest in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catherine_3 Posted January 7, 2014 Author Share Posted January 7, 2014 And if he falls in live with someone else and leaves me, then good for him. If that's what makes him happy, life goes on. I mean, I'm fully committed to supporting him and making him happy and looking hot and being confident and successful and making him my number 1 priority in life. I would rather keep him happy than keep him trapped. I used "trapped" in the context of "if he falls in love with someone else, then he should leave and be happy instead of staying with me and feeling trapped". I didn't say that marriage as an institution was a trap. Perhaps you're confusing me with Blue Spiral. pl3asehelp, I hear what you're saying. Your conclusion that I am deathly afraid of my husband leaving me because he is all I have, is noted. Thank you for taking the time to give your input on my situation. (and I'm not being sarcastic) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catherine_3 Posted January 7, 2014 Author Share Posted January 7, 2014 Hi Fudgie, I don't want to ignore your questions but I did answer them like way back on page 6 or something. I totally understand if you don't want to go back through all the pages. Ok, here we go. The simplified version. We got pregnant at 23, we decided to give marriage our best shot because we were having a baby, the first 3 years he struggled with monogamy but didn't actually cheat, I finally had enough, we nearly divorced, he smartened up, things have been amazing since (not just the monogamy thing but almost every aspect of our relationship), but I do kind of question whether I necessarily need to require him to stay away from other women, given that the idea of him with another woman doesn't necessarily bother me and it apparently was something he highly valued. I'm just someone who questions everything and I don't like doing things a certain way just because that's how it's always been done or because that's what it says in the Bible or whatever. I'm like that in every aspect of my life. If you think I'm bad here, you should see me at work. I'm constantly seeking new perspectives and evolution in my work. I certainly don't want to do anything to devastate my children. I also don't want to lose my husband. I really really super like him and love him. If I thought this would drive him away, I wouldn't do it. Not just because I want to protect my kids but also because I kinda like him. I think we'll be fine as a couple. He's my best friend and my soul mate. I don't know - maybe I need to surround myself with cooler people, lol... But my husband and I appear to be the only couple in our city who actually like each other. Most of the people I know seem to fight viciously in front of their kids, stopped having sex ages ago, are unfaithful, or just generally are discussion separation. Yeah, I definitely need cooler friends. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batya33 Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 Thanks for explaining Bekka. My concern is that your husband will feel that you don't respect yourself enough if you're telling him that you don't think you're worth his fidelity (despite how you put it) and that that will be a turn off to him -because he won't respect you for your "sacrifice". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catherine_3 Posted January 7, 2014 Author Share Posted January 7, 2014 Thanks for explaining Bekka. My concern is that your husband will feel that you don't respect yourself enough if you're telling him that you don't think you're worth his fidelity (despite how you put it) and that that will be a turn off to him -because he won't respect you for your "sacrifice". That makes sense. I also wouldn't want him to feel like I was pushing him away or that I didn't value him in my life. It could potentially send that message. Do you think that this one thing, alone, could be sufficient to cause him to think I don't respect myself? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batya33 Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 That makes sense. I also wouldn't want him to feel like I was pushing him away or that I didn't value him in my life. It could potentially send that message. Do you think that this one thing, alone, could be sufficient to cause him to think I don't respect myself? I really can't say- I am sorry that he behaved inappropriately in the beginning of the marriage. We became parents shortly after we married but we planned it that way -it still can be overwhelming to be newlyweds and new parents simultaneously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fudgie Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 Bekka, Thank you for explaining that to me. I didn't see those posts. I appreciate you taking the time to reiterate. Trust me, I understand you being someone who "questions everything". I really do. I am the same way. I always have doubts and am always running through things in my mind about everything. I am never 100% sure about things in my life. Of course, I do follow through with things, but I'm always wondering. I can understand why you are now questioning monogamy in your own relationship. It sounds like, however, that he has settled in well and is happy. I think you should have a conversation with him regardless, even if it's just to put your doubts to rest. People DO change. He may have struggled in the beginning but honestly, 23 is still really young and people can and do act differently at that age. I know in my own parent's marriage (they have been married for 25+ years) my dad has always been monogamous but boy, he had a GREAT time in college with the ladies. He had many, many girlfriends, one after the other, and although he didn't cheat with them, they weren't serious girlfriends at all. He settled in with my mother well though and they have both stayed faithful, despite my mom having a condition for her whole life that makes sex really painful and therefore, almost impossible. They are happier now than I have seen them in years because they are getting older and they are spending more time at home together. See, people do change. Again, I think you should talk to your husband. See what he thinks about monogamy, how he has changed over the years. You may be surprised. I think if you surrounded yourself with better people too, that would help. My boyfriend and I are finding more "couple friends", couples who are closer to our age, who have lived together a while without marriage or children, and are happy. There is no cheating or other nonsense. Being around positive couples may help you feel more positive too. And it would be fun for you two to connect with other people. When you are around a lot of people who are married and cheating on each other, it's almost expected that your own opinion of marriage/relationships will change and not really for the better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fudgie Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 I forgot to add, when I meant "talk to your husband", personally, I would not bring up the subject of opening your marriage, at least, not yet. I would focus on how HE feels about your marriage right now, how happy he is, what he'd like to change, and even how he perceives himself as being different than the man that you married years ago. Having such a conversation shouldn't drive him away or make him think that you don't love him or anything like that. It's just a deep, reflecting conversation. And honestly, I think it's an important to have with your partner, regardless if you're thinking of opening your marriage or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catherine_3 Posted January 7, 2014 Author Share Posted January 7, 2014 I told him if he met someone he was into, he could go ahead and get with her. He said he wasn't interested, and that even if I didn't know about it, what about his conscience. Then he started being extra nice to me, especially in bed, lol. A day or two later, I told him that maybe it wouldn't be ok, because maybe he would wait until I was 50 and find a 30 year old woman and how could I compete with that? He thought it was funny. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lavenderdove Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 You say your marriage is great... so if it ain't broke, don't fix it... really, why should you rock the boat and introduce a whole lot of risk into a marriage that is going well? That is the part that is bothering everybody, that you seem to want to take a huge risk (and triangulating other people into your marriage is a BIG risk) for some vague idea and not out of any real need either apparent or expressed. Seems like almost a self destructive act and a bit naïve if you think it is worth rocking the boat when things are going well. Don't fall in love with 'ideas' when there are hearts to be potentially broken and lives at risk to be disrupted if he really falls for one of his paramours and decides he likes her better than you, especially the lives of your children. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abitbroken Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 You say your marriage is great... so if it ain't broke, don't fix it... really, why should you rock the boat and introduce a whole lot of risk into a marriage that is going well? That is the part that is bothering everybody, that you seem to want to take a huge risk (and triangulating other people into your marriage is a BIG risk) for some vague idea and not out of any real need either apparent or expressed. Seems like almost a self destructive act and a bit naïve if you think it is worth rocking the boat when things are going well. Don't fall in love with 'ideas' when there are hearts to be potentially broken and lives at risk to be disrupted if he really falls for one of his paramours and decides he likes her better than you, especially the lives of your children. Agree!! Your husband probably had those initial thoughts do to youth. He is very happy being married to you now. So don't go backwards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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