abitbroken Posted January 4, 2014 Share Posted January 4, 2014 And if he falls in live with someone else and leaves me, then good for him. If that's what makes him happy, life goes on. [/b Really?? "easy come, easy go?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shelty24 Posted January 4, 2014 Share Posted January 4, 2014 Without meaning to be disrespectful-maybe your having a mid life crisis. I think you dont really trust that he will be faithful for 20 years so you gave him permission just so you don't have to get divorced if/when it happens was he the type to sleep around before meeting you? If not then he does attach feelings and emotions to sex and has little desire to have NSA and your just adding drama to your life. Are you also allowed to act on it if you meet someone? Your last statement sounds dysfunctional. "I will put his happieness first even if that makes me deeply unhappy" that is co-dependent and I would not be surprised if your jealousy gene all of a sudden wakes up when you start to feel threatened by every woman he smiles at from now on knowing she could be a new potential gf. Again you are just welcoming unnecessary drama into your life. He chose to marry you, promised to be faithful.. why is that not enough for you? Research shows married men are the happiest and healthiest and they live longer than non-married men. Research also shows that most men are happy with ONE woman as long as the relationship is healthy and all his emotional and sexual needs are being met. That doesn't make him blind. He will find other people hot-doesn't mean he wants to sleep with them and how would you feel if a friend it family member told you he was with another woman last night? Or if one of your childrens friends told them? I dont think you have really thought this all through Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shelty24 Posted January 4, 2014 Share Posted January 4, 2014 Also how are you gonna cope with him coming home late 3 nights a week? Is he allowed sleep over at his gf house? How much money is he allowed spend on her? You said nothing sleazy which means hes allowed date someone right? So your willing to share him 50/50? What rules have you put in place? Is he getting a vasectomy? Does she have to be tested for STDs first? How long have you been married and how old are you both? how old are your kids? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batya33 Posted January 4, 2014 Share Posted January 4, 2014 I think the OP wanted to impress her husband with her perceived sense that she is different from other married people who (gasp!) want a monogamous relationship. I don't think everyone wants casual sex (I sure don't) or sees a variety of partners as anything important in life. Since the husband never brought that up I don't think the OP was doing this to be selfless -she wanted to get something out of it -some kind of reaction from her husband. It sounds like he was a bit confused as to why she said it but that he's not interested. Of course it means that if he does become interested he has a green light. The problem then is that they haven't discussed boundaries. Hopefully the OP gets checked regularly for STDs and would be ok if her husband had a baby with another woman which of course can happen too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ms Darcy Posted January 4, 2014 Share Posted January 4, 2014 I have no intention of bringing it up again and I don't necessarily expect him to either. But he now knows I'm ok with it. Thanks everyone for the input, especially Sauvignon. Super helpful! This all may be an intellectual discussion. He doesn't seem interested in it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iggles Posted January 4, 2014 Share Posted January 4, 2014 I get that there are risks but then I also think there could be potential risk mitigation. Maybe it prevents us divorcing due to infidelity or prevents him from having some wacky mid life crisis. You're ignoring that's there's more than one type of infidelity. If he would cheat for sexual variety then this arrangement would "mitigate" risk in the way you're hoping. It's just for physical thrills. However, when partners start up an emotional affair (which often become physical) it's because they are missing their connection with their primary partner. The scenario plays out as such, you two have started to "drift" and focus on day to day things -- often couples don't realize it until one person develops a crush on someone new. Starts out as a "harmless" friendship with a person of the opposite sex (coworker, fellow parent, etc) and over time they confide in each other. Suddenly one day the married person is having more intimate conversations with this person than their spouse! Physical attraction is always present and as they grow more emotionally closer their physical desire for one another ramps up! This kind of affair is often more devastating to a marriage because the married person begins to envision being in a relationship with that person. It's more than sex -- it's sex and infatuation which in some cases becomes sex and love. With this type of affairs it's rather common to dump the primary partner and start up a new relationship with their affair partner. You giving him permission to sleep with someone else won't be enough! Not if he falls in love with his sex partner and ultimately wants her to replace your role in his life (primary partner/spouse). In fact, giving him permission to sleep around may be a justification in his mind that you don't love him as much as he loved you, since the other woman wouldn't want to share him! (She wants you out of the picture, remember?) And also, mid-life crises are rarely about wanting sex with someone other than your spouse. It's about reacting poorly to aging and deciding you want to make sweeping life changes to prove to yourself you're still "young". For many men, they start an affair with a younger woman -- but that's only PART of escaping their routine and responsibilities. Buying an expensive car. Quitting their jobs and using their 401k to finance exotic vacations. Going skydiving. Etc. And if he falls in live with someone else and leaves me, then good for him. If that's what makes him happy, life goes on. I mean, I'm fully committed to supporting him and making him happy and looking hot and being confident and successful and making him my number 1 priority in life. I would rather keep him happy than keep him trapped. Then why did you get married? Was marriage his idea and you went along with it to please him? It sounds like you are very insecure about whether you could be enough for him over a lifetime. He seems happy in his choice of you and believes in "til death due us part" (i.e., we're together for the rest of our lives) as well as "let no man out asunder what god hath joined together" (i.e., no outside people messing up what we got). He may find your outlook quirky and feel its manageable now, but ultimate your lack of faith and secure attachment can undermine what you have. On your end, it's not a marriage. Just a title. Your last statement sounds dysfunctional. "I will put his happieness first even if that makes me deeply unhappy" that is co-dependent ^^ This! It sounds like unconditional love which works for children and family members but has no place in romantic love. You're not loving him as a wife. Real talk. Because when you're "in-love" with someone you have conditions. They can't do whatever (ruin your trust, seriously disappoint you, show repeated lack of respect, kick a puppy, murder someone!) and your feelings hold steady! Now, it's true to say you will always have "love for that person" but it's not the same thing. More like platonic/friendship or familial love (parents, siblings, cousins). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iggles Posted January 4, 2014 Share Posted January 4, 2014 Of course it means that if he does become interested he has a green light. The problem then is that they haven't discussed boundaries. Hopefully the OP gets checked regularly for STDs and would be ok if her husband had a baby with another woman which of course can happen too. Good point! Wow, there's so many downsides to this scenario. I'm amazed the OP can't see it.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue_Skirt Posted January 4, 2014 Share Posted January 4, 2014 I can only see downsides to this type of arrangement, it’s opening Pandora’s box.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lavenderdove Posted January 4, 2014 Share Posted January 4, 2014 It is the Pandora's box of relationships! And there is a false assumption that you will be able to control of the variables that might come into play once you go down that road, and that you will be able to control and manage all the scenarios that might be enountered to your satisfaction and the survival of the marriage (e.g., what if the other woman gets pregnant and your husband has to give a large sum of money every month in child support and also bring that child into the home every other weekend for visitation)? What if he really bonds with this other women and child and really wants TWO families, or decides that he wants her family to be the primary family. Suddenly you may not only lose your husband, but your family finances go into the toilet feeding family money to other women's children. I am older and have seen many outcomes from the 'open marriage' scenario and at best it causes a lot of drama/extra complications in the marriage, and at worst it destroys the marriage when the husband falls in love with one of his paramours and/or has an unplanned child with her. I subscribe to the 'if it ain't broke don't fix it' philosophy, which is a variant of 'be careful what you wish for.' It is hubris to think that you can like the queen offer a benevolent dispensation to allow him to run around in order to prove how hip and 'better/different' you are from other wives, but the end result could be catastrophe for your marriage and your children. I would NEVER suggest anything that opens the door to things that might lure your husband away from the marriage and from a daily life in the home with your own children. 'Allowing' this scenario comes with a huge amount of risk, and it frankly boggles my mind that you would suggest this to prove how 'different' a wife you are, especially when he is showing no discontentment with the marriage as is. Your ego needs a reality check there... Why mess with a marriage that is working? And beware of hubris which assumes you are so in control of your marriage and your husband that you can and will be able to handle the potential fallout from this when that fallout may well have a horrible effect on your marriage and your children if he chooses to leave for another woman he has bonded with, or impregnates one or more other women. I've seen 'opening' marriages work a few times, but it is usually with swingers who see sex as a sport and go to swing clubs TOGETHER and have very strict rules about only swinging together and no forming of intimate/personal relationships with the people they swing with, and never going one on one with other people. But I've seen so many relationships fail when they try to open them to other people, that I would not recommend it to anybody unless they were already in the swinging lifestyle and had gotten together from the getgo with the understanding that neither person was monogamous and didn't intend to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catherine_3 Posted January 4, 2014 Author Share Posted January 4, 2014 Wow, this really brought out the daggers didn't it guys? Thanks to all who actually answered my question. It's given me some good food for thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iggles Posted January 4, 2014 Share Posted January 4, 2014 Wow, this really brought out the daggers didn't it guys? Thanks to all who actually answered my question. It's given me some good food for thought. Everyone here answered your question. You asked about the possible downsides and warnings. No need to be snarky because you read some responses you may not have liked. Ultimately, it's your life OP. You're going to do what you want to do. Don't be surprised if your one-sided open experiment has unintended effects. It's playing with fire to let your husband get his jollies elsewhere without being involved (as lavenderdove pointed out, swinging together with rules is a different set up where you can monitor/head off any outside attachments forming). And yes, a "one woman" man will likely subconsciously feel you love him less for not mate guarding him. In the reverse, many women feel unloved and/or taken for granted when their men don't make any attempts to mate guard. It can also lead to loss of respect which is crucial for a healthy relationship. Good luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue Spiral Posted January 4, 2014 Share Posted January 4, 2014 I would rather keep him happy than keep him trapped. I wish that more women had this attitude... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SapphireNoir10 Posted January 4, 2014 Share Posted January 4, 2014 ^^ Blue Spiral, a man chooses to get married and part of being married is committing to one person. Some people are happy with committing to one person. Other people would prefer to non remain monogamous and that's fine too. I think it's wrong to assume that a married man is 'trapped' maybe they are happy with their lot in life, a woman that loves them and cares for them and is faithful as well... I don't judge those that want casual relationships or open relationships. Lets not assume monogamous means trapped. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batya33 Posted January 4, 2014 Share Posted January 4, 2014 I wish that more women had this attitude... I would have declined my husband's proposal -or any proposal -if I felt that he believed marriage meant being trapped. As I've written b efore I find marriage freeing because when I was single I felt I needed to restrict myself to activities that could lead to my finding a good match. I also love being married to my husband and love being married in general. I don't think the OP's motives are so that her husband doesn't feel trapped -I think she has other motives and not motives that have to do with any kind of altruism or lack of jealousy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abitbroken Posted January 4, 2014 Share Posted January 4, 2014 Wow, this really brought out the daggers didn't it guys? Thanks to all who actually answered my question. It's given me some good food for thought. No one is throwing daggers. It is only your perception - because the majority of us are not jumping on the bandwagon of "what a great, giving wife!" Some of us speak from experience. Also, I agree that "putting him first" as you perceive you are is dysfunctional. why don't you adopt the attitude "dang, I am an awesome wife and a hot woman and of course my husband wants me and only me' and get a boost from that instead of playing games your hubby doesn't want to play? Your husband could think you are losing interest by saying those things.. Just sayin' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue Spiral Posted January 4, 2014 Share Posted January 4, 2014 I don't judge those that want casual relationships or open relationships. Lets not assume monogamous means trapped. I'm not judging anyone. I'm just saying that, for me, monogamy did feel like being trapped. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SapphireNoir10 Posted January 4, 2014 Share Posted January 4, 2014 I'm not judging anyone. I'm just saying that, for me, monogamy did feel like being trapped. And thats perfectly ok and as normal as wanting to be monogamous. Some people just dont want monogamy and never will and I think it's great as long as they don't try and force themselves into it and end up cheating. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue Spiral Posted January 4, 2014 Share Posted January 4, 2014 I would have declined my husband's proposal -or any proposal -if I felt that he believed marriage meant being trapped. I've never believed in marriage, even when I was younger and relationship-seeking. Here's why: I want someone to hold my hand because they want to, not because they're handcuffed. I want them to be with me because of nothing but their own free will, not because it'd take too much effort to get out of the arrangement. I'm sure that many people marry for positive reasons...but you can't deny that the legal/financial "trap" angle is built-in, in order to make it harder for either party to get out of the marriage. And that's where I agree with the OP: if someone would be happier without me, I want them to leave. I'd rather have them be happy and with someone else, as opposed to miserable but staying with me because it'd be a legal/financial nightmare. I'm sorry, but I think that some people use marriage as a crutch to ensure that the person they love is "stuck" with them regardless of circumstances/changes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iggles Posted January 4, 2014 Share Posted January 4, 2014 I'm sure that many people marry for positive reasons...but you can't deny that the legal/financial "trap" angle is built-in, in order to make it harder for either party to get out of the marriage. The same could be said if any vow/legal contract. Being held to your word is a "trap" for those who choose to view it with a cynical lense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue Spiral Posted January 4, 2014 Share Posted January 4, 2014 The same could be said if any vow/legal contract. Being held to your word is a "trap" for those who choose to view it with a cynical lense. Call me crazy, but I think that vows/legal stuff shouldn't be combined with feelings-related stuff, because people tend to change over time. If someone's feelings fade, I don't think it's healthy (or logical) to keep a promise out of obligation, as opposed to genuine emotion. Again, if I were in a relationship, I'd want the person to be with me because they wanted to be, not because they made a promise a long time ago and it's boring but sort of comfortable and not breaking it up is the path of least resistance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catherine_3 Posted January 4, 2014 Author Share Posted January 4, 2014 the majority of us are not jumping on the bandwagon of "what a great, giving wife!"' Quite the contrary. I requested no judgements as to whether I'm a great wife, a cool wife, a bad wife or "not a real wife" (as someone amusingly suggested). I consider that to be off topic and a such have steered clear of that debate. My worth as a wife is determined by a multitude of factors that have played out over the past 9 years I've known him and will continue to play out over the next several decades. It isn't something that needs to be determined, or even discussed, in this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iggles Posted January 4, 2014 Share Posted January 4, 2014 Call me crazy, but I think that vows/legal stuff shouldn't be combined with feelings-related stuff, because people tend to change over time. I think that's the root of your issue with marriage right there. You don't see the point in legally connecting yourself with someone because -- in your view -- lifetime love with a partner is not likely. As long as there are no firm commitments it's all good. Why promise to be together and build a life together when you're going to change and want other things/people later on? Some people are inclined towards monogamy and others aren't. That's just how it is. For those of us that are, making a deep commitment isn't threatening. In fact in enhances what you have together as you build a life with one partner. As for feelings/emotions being brought together with legal contracts, that happens all the time. Friends going into business together. Parents co-signing college loans with their children. In fact, parents have legal responsibilities for their children. There are things they are expected to do and if they don't, they are held accountable in court.. Don't see how just marriage is problematic; it's another form of legal partnership. Now the other aspects of marriage -- becoming a social unit, vowing to spend you life together, etc -- they are not desirable if you feel all relationships come with more expectations than you're comfortable with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
90_hour_sleep Posted January 4, 2014 Share Posted January 4, 2014 I think that's the root of your issue with marriage right there. You don't see the point in legally connecting yourself with someone because -- in your view -- lifetime love with a partner is not likely. As long as there are no firm commitments it's all good. Why promise to be together and build a life together when you're going to change and want other things/people later on? I think it's an absolute given that people will evolve and change and want other things as a relationship progresses. It's built right into traditional vows. It shouldn't be taken for granted that two people will continue to share the same patterns of relating just because they've agreed to spend their time together. And, that can mean very different things for different people. Maybe I've got a personal bias here, but I like the idea of being able to bounce ideas/thoughts (even taboo and potentially contentious ones) off of my partner without fear of judgement or some form of retribution. That's what an intimate relationship is all about. Acknowledging and accepting another person, even as he/she evolves into something unknown or unforeseen. I don't think any of this is dependent on, or mutually exclusive with, monogamy. Seems the thread has kind of veered off course though. This discussion doesn't seem all that relevant to the original poster, as she seems quite secure in the nature of her marriage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shelty24 Posted January 4, 2014 Share Posted January 4, 2014 Living together, a joint marriage, kids is the same thing as being married whether you have the ring/piece of paper or not. Marriage is not designed to "trap" people. Its a celebration of your commitment and love for each other. Sure its not for everyone and that is fine.. being "trapped" is a co-dependent mentality. The only way anyone can be truly "trapped" in a relationship is if you have a chain around their neck tying them to the bed. You always have choices if your unhappy-you can leave at any time! I love my partner and am extremely happy but if that changed-I would leave and if he lost love or interest in me-Id let him go without a fight. Being "trapped" is in your head. You always have choices and freedom people over complicate everything. To me its black and white really Also a healthy couple will have boundaries that they are both happy with in order to protect their relationship and not allow others to come between them. Giving hubby permission to get a gf even though he has not even asked for it-IS putting your marriage at risk of failure which IMO is ridiculous. If he fell for someone and she said "okay go, I want you to be happy" that would make a little sense but pushing him into a situation that is almost guaranteed to push a wedge between them emotionally and physically as well as possibly destroy what they have together is insane. It is not "honorable" to sabotage your relationship and put it at risk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batya33 Posted January 4, 2014 Share Posted January 4, 2014 It takes plenty of effort to get out of a live-together arrangement especially if there are kids involved. You are describing it as a trap-angle - but that's just how you see it. So if you're against commitments related to feelings then in your opinion people shouldn't become parents and people shouldn't become pet-owners either, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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