Mercurial Girl Posted February 27, 2014 Share Posted February 27, 2014 ur very limit in ur view, all u see is i dont fight for her, ive fought the proper way. What a JOKE!!! NO, NO, NO. You HAVE NOT petitioned for parental rights. THAT is the proper way. PERIOD. You haven't even TRIED. You ALREADY decided that it wont work. I suspect because you don't want the assigned child support bill that you know comes with it. Sending clothing is far easier on the budget, and you can start and stop that at any time you like - unlike court ordered child support payments. You have PROOF that you tried to be in her life? What proof is that, receipts from the clothes you bought in the first little while before you disappeared for good? Copies of letters you wrote? Do you realize that trying to be in her life doesn't just mean you try for a few months and then decide it isn't worth it? Do you have any concept of how long her life will be? Do you REALLY think she's going to turn on her mom and come running into your arms because once upon a time, for a little while, you kind of sort of tried? She will never forgive you, and she never should. I have seen people try harder at cooking a meal. Again, whatever makes you feel better about yourself. You aren't fooling me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
22n32 Posted February 27, 2014 Author Share Posted February 27, 2014 [QUOeithedaughteral Girl;5973149]What a JOKE!!! NO, NO, NO. You HAVE NOT herselfitioned for parental rights. THAT is the proper way. PERIOD. You haven't even TRIED. You ALREADY decided that it wont work. I suspect because you don't want the assigned child support bill that you know comes with it. Sending clothing is far easier on the budget, and you can start and stop that at any time you like - unlike court ordered child support payments. You have PROOF that you tried to be in her life? What proof is that, receipts from the clothes you bought in the first little while before you disappeared for good? Copies of letters you wrote? Do you realize that trying to be in her life doesn't just mean you try for a few months and then decide it isn't worth it? Do you have any concept of how long her life will be? Do you REALLY think she's going to turn on her mom and come running into your arms because once upon a time, for a little while, you kind of sort of tried? She will never forgive you, and she never should. I have seen people try harder at cooking a meal. Again, whatever makes you feel better about yourself. You aren't fooling me. again u dont get it and talking more then listening, i put all the money aside from child support and lawyer fees to an acct just for my daughter every month, has nothing to do with money.. its about doing it right, seeing my child for few hrs a week is neither good for me or my daughter.. and ur in denial if u think it is.. when are daughter is old enough. she can decide for herself. and see for herself that it was her mother who tried to keep me away, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheetarah Posted February 27, 2014 Share Posted February 27, 2014 You are the only one in denial, here. Yes, it is WAY BETTER for your daughter to have a chance to know her father for a few hours a week than never knowing her father at all, knowing he walked. Way better. And you're in denial if you think otherwise. You are desperately justifying your decision, I'm sure for your own benefit and not ours. Some part of you knows how fudged this is(at least, I hope). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeartGoesOn Posted February 27, 2014 Share Posted February 27, 2014 What did your attorney advise you to do in terms of child support? I hope that is not what this is all about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lorem Ipsum Posted February 27, 2014 Share Posted February 27, 2014 22n32, I gotta ask... if this child was a boy, would you be trying harder? Because here's the thing... even if you only get to see your daughter on Saturday afternoons, it's better than nothing at all. Depending on your jurisdiction, you don't need a lawyer, you may be able to do this through mediation. You think a few notes will be enough to make your daughter see that you fought for her, it won't. By the time she's old enough to come looking for you, it won't be because she's angry at her mother for pushing you away, it will be because she wants to satisfy her curiosity over who this stranger who is supposed to be her father is. You think it's hard missing the first steps? Which you probably would anyway, unless your job is being a full-time child care provider. What would be even harder is missing *everything*. School plays. Sports leagues. Hallowe'en and Xmas. Birthdays. You simply can't get any of that back when your child is an adult... and is a stranger to you. Not to mention that she'll miss out on having your parents in her life -- grandparents rock. The thing is, sure right now it would only be for a few hours at a time, but as you proved that you were responsible and a good parent, that time could lengthen. Your ex can't be angry forever, but your child isn't going to stay a child forever. Here's the thing: my father walked away. I barely remember what it was like to have a "traditional" nuclear family, I was so young when he left. My mother was not an easy person to get along with, but she never prevented him from seeing us, he did that all on his own. He was "busy", he picked girlfriends and wives who were not happy that they weren't #1 (although we weren't either) that actively worked to keep him from bringing us over for visits, he moved thousands of miles away to a place where he would be free from paying child support. He rationalised that since we were girls, we were "better off" with our mother (ha!) and admitted at one point that he didn't want to come and get us, because we still lived in the house and it reminded him and made him sad (poor effin' baby). In short, he was weak. So here's a suggestion that I didn't see (and I don't know if it's a good one), can you contact your local children's welfare agency/government agency and ask them for referrals for mediators or lawyers for your situation? Even your ex has said go to court and you're not doing it. There are probably men's rights groups in your area, too, they would have a list of attorneys or other resources. If you don't have the strength to do this, talk with your parents, I'm sure they would be willing to be your support group as you go through this. One day, your ex may apply for benefits and it may happen that the government would rather not pay her, but make you pay support. All things worth having are worth working for. Your daughter is worth working for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
22n32 Posted February 28, 2014 Author Share Posted February 28, 2014 LOREM IPSUM, thanks for taking the time to give ur input, boy or girl doesnt matter to me, Im not the type of guy who preffers a son over a daughter.. if i may say this is not what i want or how i want it to be with my daughter, but its come to i have no other choice. many of you wont agree but having few hrs with my daughters is not a proper rel, and this is not something i want to half a$$, IMO its done right or not done at all. Ive made it known in my letters i love our daughter and i want to have a rel with her and i want us to work together to give our child a proper healthy rel and childhood. at this point i have no other choice then to walk away from the situation at the moment, my ex needs to feel what she has caused over the last yr, she needs to feel that her actions have been nothing but negative and its an allienation. and there are consquences for these actions and she needs to relize/ snap out of it or whatever, but we need to work together in proper way for the sake of our rel Im sorry if it seems cruel to others, but i will not be subjected to in and outa of court and strain on everything so i can have few hrs a week with my daughter who i will never truly now. what my ex is doing there are consequnces for it, and she needs to feel it and relize it. u cant activley partake in allienation and feel everything is okay. she will have to answer to herself and our child. may seem cruel to others but it has to be this way to make it work right, i know way to many fathers whos exes have played these games, and there left broke, broken and broken hearted, and with a broken rel with there daughters Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheetarah Posted February 28, 2014 Share Posted February 28, 2014 It's your DAUGHTER who is going to be affected. Stop trying to stick it to your ex through your child. Your daughter will feel your choice. Your daughter. Your daughter. Your daughter. If all it took were letters there would be no need for a legal system and family courts. It's there for a purpose, because people can't and don't get along, or make poor decisions, or whatever the case is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
22n32 Posted February 28, 2014 Author Share Posted February 28, 2014 yes it will be my daughter who is affected, and person responsible for that is my ex not me, ive tried having a cival friendship with her for the sake of our daughter. why should i miss work, and pay thousands of dollars for wastefull lawyers and be left broken hearted and broken rel with my daughter because my ex wants to be this way.. im not trying to stick it to my ex at all, she is the one playing these games.. if she truly wanted whats best for our daughter then she would work with me, and she truly wanted to give our daughter the best she would work with me in a cival friendly way, im sure my ex will always work against me regarding our child even after court, its not fair to our daughter or me.. this is not what i want at all, but im left with no choice, if this is what my ex wants its what she will get. i want nothing more then a proper rel with her. but if she cant change it wont happen.. and my ex can live with the consequnces for her actions because she caused this.. it truly sucks, i think about her everyday most of the day, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheetarah Posted February 28, 2014 Share Posted February 28, 2014 why should i miss work, and pay thousands of dollars for wastefull lawyers and be left broken hearted and broken rel with my daughter because my ex wants to be this way.. Because she's your daughter. Because your children are the one thing worth fighting for, if nothing else. Because she's going to know when she grows up that her father did not do all he could to be with her, in any way that he could. You do have choices. You need to take ownership of the fact that you are choosing not to exercise them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batya33 Posted February 28, 2014 Share Posted February 28, 2014 You need to know you did all you could. Refusing to spend $ and miss work is not doing all you could and no that doesn't make it your ex's fault in the least. I do know that in certain circumstances you can get free representation (I only know this indirectly -a friend of mine had to fight for child support but couldn't afford a lawyer). I'm sure you know of many examples of this but this reminds me of my friend who married a guy who had to fight for custody of his son for years and my friend -the potential stepmother -supported him every step of the way even though it meant spending all that money and all that time/missed work. Many examples of this. Don't take the easy way out. Even if heaven forbid you don't get any visitation (I suppose that could happen) you can stand tall and tell your daughter what happened in the future, when it's in her best interests to know. I have a friend who lost custody of her daughter for awhile (or most visitation). Her daughter was angry with her. She called her daughter every single day to say she loved her and for years sent her a card in the mail every single day, not knowing if she was getting every card or not. That's doing all you can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheetarah Posted February 28, 2014 Share Posted February 28, 2014 The reality, is that this is what you want to do. You want it to go your way, and you're going to flare your nostrils and get all bull-headed and not do any work-arounds, because that's really going to "show" your ex you mean business. You say it's not about the money. But then you follow up with why should you have to dole out the $$$. You say it's not about sticking it to your ex, but you have said more than a handful of times that she needs to feel the consequences of her actions. The truth is, your daughter is going to care who was there. Mom is there. Dad is not. When she gets older, and I do have a friend like this, she's not going to see it the way you want. She is going to see it as "Yeah...mom can be unreasonable...But wait, how come Dad didn't go to court? How come he didn't at least try to see me like that?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
22n32 Posted February 28, 2014 Author Share Posted February 28, 2014 Its not about the money to our child, id give my last penny to our daughter for clothes,food, shelter. but wasting money on lawyer to line there pockets is wastefull. hey she can see mom was there and dad wasnt there, and when she gets older she can relize and question why i wasnt there ? well why i wasnt there was because of mom and not my lack of wanting to be there. im not gonna be walked all over for the rest of my life because of a spitefull women, she doesnt want me there its exactly what she will get. and let her live with that.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batya33 Posted February 28, 2014 Share Posted February 28, 2014 Its not about the money to our child, id give my last penny to our daughter for clothes,food, shelter. but wasting money on lawyer to line there pockets is wastefull. hey she can see mom was there and dad wasnt there, and when she gets older she can relize and question why i wasnt there ? well why i wasnt there was because of mom and not my lack of wanting to be there. im not gonna be walked all over for the rest of my life because of a spitefull women, she doesnt want me there its exactly what she will get. and let her live with that.. No, she will know that you didn't pursue the courts to try to get to see her. Don't even try the "lawyers are a waste of money" tactic with her -that would just make her more upset, to say the least. Once again you're focusing on revenge and not what is in the best interests of your daughter. She won't have to live with anything -she can tell her daughter that Daddy walked away. What have you learned about getting free legal advice? What have you learned about representing yourself in court? You don't have to get a lawyer -in my opinion, representing yourself at least will show your ex and your daughter that you did your best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
22n32 Posted February 28, 2014 Author Share Posted February 28, 2014 No, she will know that you didn't pursue the courts to try to get to see her. Don't even try the "lawyers are a waste of money" tactic with her -that would just make her more upset, to say the least. Once again you're focusing on revenge and not what is in the best interests of your daughter. She won't have to live with anything -she can tell her daughter that Daddy walked away. What have you learned about getting free legal advice? What have you learned about representing yourself in court? You don't have to get a lawyer -in my opinion, representing yourself at least will show your ex and your daughter that you did your best. if she tells her that i walked away, then she will be living a lie.. its not about revenge at all, i dont think like that. to me its doing right or wrong. to me right is being mature adults who put aside our diff and work for common goal and thats our daughter.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheetarah Posted February 28, 2014 Share Posted February 28, 2014 She lives in Mass, right? Do you want help? I did live there previously. I can help you find legal aid resources that can guide you through doing this pro se. I doubt with your income you'd qualify for low income or pro bono services BUT, there are many legal aid agencies that if you are over their threshold limit, they have a very reasonable fee for their advising services. Not sure what they've got out there but if you know how to search it's not hard to find out. OR, the court house has information desks where they can help you find legal services, and self-help materials. I can just hope that you are overwhelmed and can't see a way out. I'll help you as limited as it will be from this end but I'll find you a starting point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batya33 Posted February 28, 2014 Share Posted February 28, 2014 if she tells her that i walked away, then she will be living a lie.. its not about revenge at all, i dont think like that. to me its doing right or wrong. to me right is being mature adults who put aside our diff and work for common goal and thats our daughter.. Well, no. You're only responsible for your individual choice. Your choice right now is to prioritize your finances and time over seeing your daughter. (And as I wrote there might not even be much $ involved -you avoided those questions I wrote). She will not be lying if she says you walked away without pursuing the courts. That will be the truth. It's not about whether your ex is right or wrong in her behaviors -it's about whether you want to put the best interests of your daughter -and her best interests is having an involved father -first or not. You'll have to live with prioritizing differently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lorem Ipsum Posted February 28, 2014 Share Posted February 28, 2014 if she tells her that i walked away, then she will be living a lie.. No, she won't. If you aren't there, then you left. It doesn't matter the reason(s) why you left, you left. All your daughter will see in the end is that mom has been there for her and you weren't. You will be a stranger to her. It'll be even worse if you manage to find another woman who can overlook the fact you walked away from your child (and sadly, you will) because when that daughter shows up on your doorstep and you have another family, she's immediately going to think that they're the reason you left, you wanted them more than you wanted her. I can help you find legal aid resources that can guide you through doing this pro se. 22, in case you were wondering what pro se means, it means link removed. In other words, you wouldn't be wasting any money on lawyers, you would be spending your time fighting for what you want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mercurial Girl Posted February 28, 2014 Share Posted February 28, 2014 hey she can see mom was there and dad wasnt there, and when she gets older she can relize and question why i wasnt there ? well why i wasnt there was because of mom and not my lack of wanting to be there. Really? She's really going to come to that conclusion on her own? Just wake up one day and have an epiphany that no wonder dad isn't around, mom is an evil B? Or is she going to trust the person who raised her, rather than just pick this thought out of thin air that dad isn't around because mom doesn't want him around? Or maybe you think she's going to come accross your letters one day, the few letters you wrote in her infancy, and think that a few letters = love? You want her standards for future relationships to be that low? You want her to think that all she is deserving of is clothing and letters? Fathers, above anyone else in a girl's life, teach their daughters how to expect treatment from a man. Dad is the first man who sets the bar. You've set hers awfully low. Even if she somehow miraculously came to that conclusion (since you aren't around to feed it to her), at the end of the day she still knows that it doesn't take much to keep you out of the picture. That you give up easily, that she isn't worth the effort. Not even worth a day off work! That's what she would see if she came here and stumbled upon that somehow. No matter how crazy she might think her mom is one day, she will never think that's enough of an excuse for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
22n32 Posted February 28, 2014 Author Share Posted February 28, 2014 She lives in Mass, right? Do you want help? I did live there previously. I can help you find legal aid resources that can guide you through doing this pro se. I doubt with your income you'd qualify for low income or pro bono services BUT, there are many legal aid agencies that if you are over their threshold limit, they have a very reasonable fee for their advising services. Not sure what they've got out there but if you know how to search it's not hard to find out. OR, the court house has information desks where they can help you find legal services, and self-help materials. I can just hope that you are overwhelmed and can't see a way out. I'll help you as limited as it will be from this end but I'll find you a starting point. yes she lives in mass.. worst state ever for this. im always open for new advice and suggestion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batya33 Posted February 28, 2014 Share Posted February 28, 2014 yes she lives in mass.. worst state ever for this. im always open for new advice and suggestion Good for you!!! Keep at it, ok? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheetarah Posted February 28, 2014 Share Posted February 28, 2014 Check here about seeing if there are any services that can help you. Even if something weird comes up(like aid for people with Lupus or something, even though you don't have Lupus), CALL THEM ANYWAY and ask them if they have any resources for you. I actually found an agency to help me before I hired an attorney like that. link removed If nothing is coming up with your income in the search, input low numbers so something comes up. Call them, too. You won't be able to get services from them, but again - They can possibly give you other numbers of agencies. Law libraries. link removed link removed Law librarians can help point you to the information you need. They are not going to advise you legally, but they will help you find materials that are pertinent so you can have an understanding of the applicable laws so you're not just running around like a chicken with your head cut off. link removed - This breaks it down for you, first. Gives you a rundown. Because this is your first step, establish paternity. link removed - This instructs you in a basic way, of what the steps are for filing a case. It tells you exactly what forms to ask the clerk for at court. Often there is someone there who can assist you in filling them out. I would suggest calling ahead and asking if there is someone there that can help you. You may even be able to find some of the forms here: link removed link removed And this may tell you how to fill out some of those forms: link removed link removed - This then instructs you, on how to serve the complaint to your ex. You can actually see on the bottom, there is a "Next" button that gives you a rundown of each step. There are law forums like link removed, for example, where you can ask questions. Sometimes, there are attorneys on there but NONE of it is to be construed as legal advice. Check their information against your own. link removed is a site I really like. You can research legal advice, ask questions, or even look for attorneys as well. Sometimes, you will even find some agency listing gems in there. I'm going to be honest, yes it seems like a lot and I've only touched on the tip of the iceberg. It's a lot of information, and paperwork. And that can seem overwhelming and impossible, but it really isn't as horribly intimidating as it appears. You just have to take the time to learn. Right now it is not terribly complicated. If you get in over your head as it progresses, then you can think about getting an attorney. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheetarah Posted February 28, 2014 Share Posted February 28, 2014 Another thing. Look for Fatherhood coalitions/advocacy groups. They may have their own special legal aid programs or advising services to help you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
22n32 Posted February 28, 2014 Author Share Posted February 28, 2014 cheetarah.. Thanks for the links, I will look thru it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mercurial Girl Posted February 28, 2014 Share Posted February 28, 2014 This man needs to be your role model, OP link removed I'd hope it wouldn't get that far for you, but anything less than this is simply giving up too soon. Sure he's a celeb and has the power of the media (double edged sword...) but she also apparently comes from a family of lawyers and has spent millions on this case. He is still fighting for his child despite that, even if the courts are saying he isn't the father - that is one thing you don't have to overcome, at least. If you'd just get your damn paternity test. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
22n32 Posted February 28, 2014 Author Share Posted February 28, 2014 I love someone wrote this in comments.. Now, this is what will happen... In 15 years, the boy will want to know his dad. The mom will wind up being hated for keeping the father and son apart. The boy will miss out on his dad. The dad will miss out on his son. And despite that, the father and son will still bond and the mother will lose. So why doesn't this woman realize this inevitable, grow up now, stop the selfishness (I want, I want, I want) and let the father and son get to know each other NOW and show herself to be a kind, loving woman (the way most woman I know, are). In this story, BOTH "want" The mother wants to KEEP. The father wants to GIVE and SHARE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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