ecaryn Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 Because I'm developing feelings for him. That's the thing. It doesn't seem as though you are. Or at least not to the level necessary for a romantic relationship. And there's nothing wrong with that. I'm not at all implying that you don't have growing feelings of affection and comfortableness with him, I just don't see in your postings that the romantic factor is developing enough to make for a sustainable relationship. I appreciate that the last several pages of your postings regarding him are more from a stance of defending, or better yet, attempting to explain your negative opinion of him, but it doesn't seem to be isolated only to this forum of Mike-pro posters, you are debating his merits with your friends 'in real life' as well. And, of course, you should analyze the compatibility of any long term partner, but I think when we are romantically in to someone, we tend to lean towards the side of giving them the benefit of the doubt, and even in some cases, persuading others to a more forgiving opinion of the prospective partner. Your position seems to be the opposite. In the beginning, I was Team Mike as well - give him a chance!, he's a nice guy!, etc... but after reading your commentary about him, I now actually think he's not the one for you and you should let him go. You're just incompatible. Nothing wrong with that! All this debate over expectations, generosity, promises, values, etc. seems moot when it comes to the bigger picture of can you REALLY see yourself in an intimate relationship with him?? Perhaps it's because everything has been focused on Giftgate and not much else, but I don't see that in your writings about him. And, while I was not a fan of Pedro, I could definitely feel that desire/hopefulness of developing an intimate relationship with Pedro in your writings about him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
missmarple Posted February 10, 2015 Author Share Posted February 10, 2015 I think when we are romantically in to someone, we tend to lean towards the side of giving them the benefit of the doubt, and even in some cases, persuading others to a more forgiving opinion of the prospective partner. Your position seems to be the opposite. I'm not like that. Never have been. I could be in love with someone (which I'm not with Mike) and still see all their negatives. With Pedro (who you mention in your post, too), I wasn't more forgiving...I was just giving him time because he was giving me excuses. Mike's case is different..not because I'm not attracted to him but because I can't find any benefit of the doubt to give him! I mean if someone asked 'so, is Pedro coming this weekend?' I had something to say...his back hurts..he's out of money..whatever..sure, it could be an excuse but it could also be true...and some of my friends thought he could be lying and some others that s**t happens and maybe he really was sick (or didn't have enough money or whatever). But when they ask 'so, still nothing from Mike?' I have NOTHING to say..because I, myself can't find any excuse. I hope you see the difference. Just the fact that I haven't stopped seeing him and I'm waiting for Valentine's means that I am interested in him and I'd like to continue seeing him...but, with my character, I just can't pretend I'm blind and I don't see what I see. No matter if it's Mike or if it was Pedro or whoever. This has to do with me, not with how attracted I am to a guy. I can compromise on some things...but some things I just can't compromise on. And to answer your other question (if I can see myself in an intimate relationship with him)..yes, I can or, as I've said before, I wouldn't even let him touch me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
missmarple Posted February 10, 2015 Author Share Posted February 10, 2015 And now for my news. Mike called after his boxing practice. We talked for about 10 minutes and, seeing he wasn't saying anything about meeting, I asked what he's doing tomorrow. He told me what he'll be doing in the morning but nothing about the afternoon..so, I said nothing, too. However, that put me in a bad mood. So, when some guy messaged me on the dating site, I was not very cheerful. However, he kept talking to me and even got me to smile. This guy has the same name as Pedro (apparently, that name must be common here..lol) but I'll call him John (not too original but I can't think of any other names right now). He's 48, single, no kids, lives about 30 mins away, is a computer programmer, 6'2, brown hair and eyes, seems nice looking in his pics and writes very, very well. He asked me to talk on the phone, so, we did. He's lived abroad for many years and seems and sounds very interesting to talk to. He said he'd like to meet me and suggested we go watch some play at a theater (that was a first for a first date) but I said I'd rather go somewhere we could talk...so, we're meeting tomorrow afternoon at a cafe close to my house. He doesn't have a car yet (it's been a couple of months since he's been back to the country) but he said it doesn't matter, he'll take a taxi (good..doesn't seem to be stingy..lol). Anyway, talking to him and arranging that date made me feel much better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IAmFCA Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 Re being in relationship -- Psychology Today and others regularly post articles about elements of a successful relationship. Two strike me as missing from your thread: (1) Each person tends to see the other as a little better than others would see them. We see our loved ones through rose colored glasses - and it turns out, that's a good thing. (2) Compassion - we tend to be understanding of their mistakes etc. These two traits are earmarked by researchers as necessary for a successful LTR. I can tell you, I was not like this with my H nor with any bf I can remember, until recently. I am changing in recent years and still, and I like it better, being a kinder gentler GF. I would have said I was a good GF back then, too. I am different now. It has been interesting to watch the shift. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
missmarple Posted February 10, 2015 Author Share Posted February 10, 2015 Re being in relationship -- Psychology Today and others regularly post articles about elements of a successful relationship. Two strike me as missing from your thread: (1) Each person tends to see the other as a little better than others would see them. We see our loved ones through rose colored glasses - and it turns out, that's a good thing. (2) Compassion - we tend to be understanding of their mistakes etc. The main difference is that I'm NOT in a relationship with Mike. This isn't a person I've been sleeping with, taking trips together, sharing our secrets, waking up next to each other, etc, etc. It's just a guy I've been dating (and even that started recently as I had thought we were just friends before). We see our loved ones through rose coloured glasses indeed. But I'm not in love with him..and, to be honest, even if I were, I would still see his faults...I might be more forgiving, naturally, because it would depend on how he was in other aspects of the relationship...aspects that I can't see right now and you only see once you are in a relationship. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DancingFool Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 Seems like Mike's goose is cooked. Too many crossed wires in terms of timing, communication, expectations, giftgate (I just had to say it...lol),etc., etc., etc. It really isn't this hard and complicated when it's right. Glad you have another date set up that promises to be at least interesting. Not sure why you shot down the theater date though. Surely you can meet before or grab a drink after and have some chit chat/bonding time if you like each other and if not, at least you enjoyed the theater. Don't get caught in the meet and talk talk talk rut. The interview style approach hasn't brought about much success for you so maybe be more open to a different approach? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
janut1 Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 WOW, has Mike cooled off already? I wonder what is going on there. You think he would of asked you out or said something about meeting this week some time. Something is off. Glad to see you have a date with John. Sounds fun! Just to comment about guys who are stingy. I don't like that myself. Last night on my first date with a new guy, he paid for dinner and drinks even though I did offer. I like that! We were just supposed to have a drink, but talked so long he asked if I wanted dinner. The last guy I dated did the lets split it or he would pay, then I would pay the next time, which was okay, not great. It never felt like he was taking me out on a date. But on the other side, my last BF would get paid on Friday and all his money would be gone by Monday, He would take me out all the time and I never knew about his money situation until we dated for awhile. He loved to spoil me, but he didn't really have the income to do so. LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
notalady Posted February 10, 2015 Share Posted February 10, 2015 Yea I'm surprised Mike hasn't asked you out for Valentine's Day yet. Either he's cooled off or just being very cautious about making a move given its early dating, hmmm... Glad you are talking to a new guy, waiting to hear the updates on that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
missmarple Posted February 11, 2015 Author Share Posted February 11, 2015 Not sure why you shot down the theater date though. Surely you can meet before or grab a drink after and have some chit chat/bonding time if you like each other and if not, at least you enjoyed the theater. Don't get caught in the meet and talk talk talk rut. The interview style approach hasn't brought about much success for you so maybe be more open to a different approach? Well, that play lasts for 3 hours (a friend of mine has watched it). If I didn't like him when we met (I don't mean as a man but his company/style, etc) I'd be stuck with him for 3 hours in a dark room...lol..and I'd have to pay a quite expensive price for my ticket, too. I told him that if we get along today, we could watch the play some other time (it'll be on until April). WOW, has Mike cooled off already? I wonder what is going on there. You think he would of asked you out or said something about meeting this week some time. Something is off. I've wondered about the same thing although he's not the type to make plans beforehand. I mean, he could call me today and say let's meet tonight. As for something being off, well, it wouldn't surprise me after the gift thing (yes, yes, I know what everyone on here has been saying about the importance of gifts, etc, etc but my experience says that when someone doesn't do something he promised he will, there's a reason). Yea I'm surprised Mike hasn't asked you out for Valentine's Day yet. Either he's cooled off or just being very cautious about making a move given its early dating, hmmm... I doubt it has to do with making a move....he's never had a problem asking me out before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batya33 Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 He might have a problem asking you out for a romantic holiday -and I'm sure since he owns a restaurant V-day is especially in his face! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
missmarple Posted February 11, 2015 Author Share Posted February 11, 2015 He might have a problem asking you out for a romantic holiday -and I'm sure since he owns a restaurant V-day is especially in his face! That's not necessarily the case (about the restaurant). In a few words, his restaurant is in a holiday resort that's full of people during the summer months but just a small village in winter. They get very few customers in winter time and I doubt they will for Valentine's either....even more so because the weather is lousy this week and that place is about an hour away from the city. As for asking me out for a romantic holiday, well, the thing is he hasn't asked me out at all this week...last time I saw him was Sunday...and, today, he didn't even send me a good morning text. Maybe he met someone else, who knows? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silverbirch Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 I think he would get the vibe you don't have romantic feelings for him and so he has moved on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
missmarple Posted February 11, 2015 Author Share Posted February 11, 2015 I think he would get the vibe you don't have romantic feelings for him and so he has moved on. How would he get that vibe? The last time we went out, he kept touching me and I was quite receptive. As I said, he even stopped the car to kiss me...plus, I kissed him when I said goodnight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fudgie Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 Are you initiating physical touch when you go out together rather than just being receptive when he does it? Just a guess, but if you are not initiating at all or rarely, then he may pick up on that and think you are lukewarm about him. Sent from Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batya33 Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 That's not necessarily the case (about the restaurant). In a few words, his restaurant is in a holiday resort that's full of people during the summer months but just a small village in winter. They get very few customers in winter time and I doubt they will for Valentine's either....even more so because the weather is lousy this week and that place is about an hour away from the city. As for asking me out for a romantic holiday, well, the thing is he hasn't asked me out at all this week...last time I saw him was Sunday...and, today, he didn't even send me a good morning text. Maybe he met someone else, who knows? I mean in his industry V-day is huge generally so he's most likely aware of it. I agree that you should assume there will not be another date if he hasn't asked you out yet -not because of the time that has passed simply because you two are not dating exclusively. One date at a time. He may have met someone else or reflected on your uncertainty in the recent past about whether you were interested in him and decided he didn't want to take the chance of getting attached. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
missmarple Posted February 11, 2015 Author Share Posted February 11, 2015 Are you initiating physical touch when you go out together rather than just being receptive when he does it? Well, if we had been on 10 dates, I could answer that...but it's only been the last 2 dates that he initiated anything and, no, I don't tend to initiate this soon..not just with him..with anyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
missmarple Posted February 11, 2015 Author Share Posted February 11, 2015 I woke up from my nap to find a missed call by Mike..he had called at 14.35...he knows my cell is always off in the afternoon and he could have left a text message but he didn't..so, I'm not going to do anything. John called to make sure he had the right name of the cafe...I told him it's still early but he said he wants to be there before me and I'll find him sitting inside..and he'll be wearing a cap. I'm about to leave in an hour. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WithLove Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 Wahoo! Good luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IAmFCA Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 I think he would get the vibe you don't have romantic feelings for him and so he has moved on. I agree. And that'd okay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DancingFool Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 Well, that play lasts for 3 hours (a friend of mine has watched it). If I didn't like him when we met (I don't mean as a man but his company/style, etc) I'd be stuck with him for 3 hours in a dark room...lol..and I'd have to pay a quite expensive price for my ticket, too. I told him that if we get along today, we could watch the play some other time (it'll be on until April). I'm a little confused. Is it a live theater play or movie theater? Also, unless dingy movie theater where he can try to grope you, then no, you are not stuck with him as such, you are watching the play not him. You don't even get to talk to each other really for the duration. Your risk, if you don't click, is really zero. Also, why would you be paying for the ticket if he invited you. He invites, he pays? This I find particularly confusing about you. You seem to want that traditional guy who will take charge, pick up the check, etc., but then you seem to be aggressively paying for yourself and picking up the tab for things even when maybe you shouldn't be. Then you say that you want a guy to be generous, but then you seem forceful about taking charge...so....so...so.... If you want a certain type of a man and you want him to act a certain way towards you, I think you need to check in with what your demeanor and actions say about you and whether you are inviting that man to pursue you or whether you are pushing him away. If your demeanor is too dominant, you will keep attracting passive men who will happily accept your lead and yield. Anyway, this is just food for thought for you. I don't really know how you actually come accross in real life. Just a growing impression based on your posts and dating experiences. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
missmarple Posted February 11, 2015 Author Share Posted February 11, 2015 It's a live theater play and, yes, I'd be watching the play but he'd be sitting next to me and I've never met the guy before. What if he smelled badly or tried to hug me or do something else or just talked throughout the play? Would I change seats or leave the theater? I didn't want to risk it before I've met him at least once and, also, I believe that a first meeting should be about getting to know each other, not watching a play. Regarding the second part..so, what if he invited me? Do you suggest I shouldn't take money with me? Sure, he might have paid for the ticket but what if he didn't? I can't go on a date just 'assuming' the guy will pay...and that ticket costs 25 euros. I'm not sure what you mean by 'aggressively paying for myself'. When did I say something like that??? Most of the guys I've dated offered to pay for the date and I accepted and said thank you. I don't know how you got that idea that I am forceful about taking charge, etc...OR that I want a guy to be generous. I want a guy who isn't stingy..I don't care if he's generous as long as he can pay for himself. Sure, it's nice when someone offers to pay for me but it's not something I'm looking for. I'm fine if we go 50/50. Also, I want a confident guy, not a dominant one..big difference there. I don't want a man to pursue me...but I don't want to pursue him, either. I want a happy medium. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
janut1 Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 Also, I want a confident guy, not a dominant one..big difference there. I don't want a man to pursue me...but I don't want to pursue him, either. I want a happy medium. Really? How does that work? It's normal for the man to pursue a women in the beginning, then it becomes more of a happy medium. If no one is pursuing how do you even date? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fudgie Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 You don't want him to pursue you, but you don't want to pursue either. So... nothing happens? You're at an impasse. Also, going back to Mike and showing interest, it can be as simple as reaching for his hand. Perhaps he does not know that you are developing feelings for him. How will he know if you do not show him or tell him? "receiving" affection is not an act of showing your feeling. It's passive. Sent from Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Batya33 Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 Really? How does that work? It's normal for the man to pursue a women in the beginning, then it becomes more of a happy medium. If no one is pursuing how do you even date? It is typical but in her case how things have happened is more atypical - she treated him like a platonic friend at first and talked about another man to him so the typical dating phase is not happening as much here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
janut1 Posted February 11, 2015 Share Posted February 11, 2015 It is typical but in her case how things have happened is more atypical - she treated him like a platonic friend at first and talked about another man to him so the typical dating phase is not happening as much here. Yes, I suppose that is correct Batya! There is so much to learn here for sure. Fudgie - on my first date recently, he reached out and touched my hand quite a bit. That was pretty cool and made me know that he liked me. Seems to be a good sign when men/women do that, so I totally agree with you too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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