First time in person with ex

[shackazu]

So, for all of you that have followed by situation, here's what happened just tonight.

 

She invited me to have dinner with her family. Not my first choice, because I think it has a "friend" ring to it, but I couldn't really refuse. So I went--stayed for five hours. Dinner was a lot of fun, great conversation, she made comments about things from our past throughout the night, and I thought I could still see a connection/sparkle in her eyes when she looked at me, but who knows about that. No talk about us or the relationship because there wasn't really a chance to be alone at all. Everything felt really natural to me, although I was really sad at the same time, because I could just as easily have been sitting there for a first dinner with the family as her boyfriend... Her mother was never cold towards me, but seemed to warm up to me a bit as the evening went on. There was also practically no awkwardness (good thing? bad thing?)

 

She asked me about my plans tomorrow, and I suggested that she give me a tour of a part of the city. She countered by saying that she was going to go to a different part of the city to meet up with a friend, and asked if I would like to come along.

 

This all feels natural and great, except that there's also no indication that she is interested in getting back together, or even talking about us at this point.

 

Would love some feedback/advice. Thanks

[jemoeder]

what happened before all of that?

[shackazu]

My threads (for background info...don't feel like retyping all of it)

 

 

 

 

[Shane Falco]

Hanging out with her and a friend sounds friendzony to me, but what do I know? I wouldn't have suggested her take you on a tour, I would have let her volunteer something like that. You don't want to overtly chase. I say go look at the part of the city you were planning on and see if she's willing to scrap plans with her friend, or if she'll bring the friend to do what you want to do.

 

But yeah, you are there for a week? Formulate a plan for that week independent of her and when she asks, tell her your plans. Maybe she'll either a) want to join you for some of them or b) suggest meeting up at night for dinner/drinks. But you need to come off like you are there to see the city and have fun, not to grovel at her feet for forgiveness.

[shackazu]

i'm not here for a week actually, i am leaving sunday morning. so i have today and tomorrow left.

[Shane Falco]

i'm not here for a week actually, i am leaving sunday morning. so i have today and tomorrow left.

 

Oh, well that changes the mindset a bit then. Maybe do your thing and then meet her out somewhere. I think you did a good job of not pressing the issue at dinner tonight, but maybe grabbing a drink or two with your ex would be a good strategy. Something light and fun.

[shackazu]

so she just contacted me that she is canceling with her friend because she needs to stay home and work, but invited me over for dinner again. i was thinking of accepting, then asking her if she wants to meet up somewhere (just the two of us) tomorrow for a bit before i leave. is that ok? i can't really decline these dinner offers i don't think. this thesis really complicates things.

 

should i ask her to meet up tomorrow after dinner tonight? or should i send her a message saying that now?

[shessofly]

relax and see how dinner goes. don't be so anxious to make plans with her. wait and see how the night goes but make other plans for your day so you can enjoy your trip with or without her. are you enjoying yourself? have you done any sight seeing?

[shackazu]

yeah i have done sightseeign on my own. and she actually just now offered for me to go with her dad and brother around the city while she works. i think this is pretty neutral/maybe even a good thing if her dad and brother (who i just met yesterday) like me and say good things about me in private.

[shackazu]

well this was an epic fail. met up with her in person, the relationship came up, she said i had a chance probably three months ago, because when she broke up she was still in love with me, but that she had gotten over me completely, doesn't love me, isn't attracted to me anymore.

 

I guess it's NC from here on out. I told her that I wished her well but couldn't be a friend. I also turned into a blubbering mess a bit, which certainly didn't help me, but i think she is beyond the point of no return anyway.

[Shane Falco]

well this was an epic fail. met up with her in person, the relationship came up, she said i had a chance probably three months ago, because when she broke up she was still in love with me, but that she had gotten over me completely, doesn't love me, isn't attracted to me anymore.

 

I guess it's NC from here on out. I told her that I wished her well but couldn't be a friend. I also turned into a blubbering mess a bit, which certainly didn't help me, but i think she is beyond the point of no return anyway.

 

Sorry bud. Was rooting for ya.

[winniethepooh]

well this was an epic fail. met up with her in person, the relationship came up, she said i had a chance probably three months ago, because when she broke up she was still in love with me, but that she had gotten over me completely, doesn't love me, isn't attracted to me anymore.

 

I guess it's NC from here on out. I told her that I wished her well but couldn't be a friend. I also turned into a blubbering mess a bit, which certainly didn't help me, but i think she is beyond the point of no return anyway.

Sorry, I just saw this topic now. Remember your other ones. Good on you for taking the plunge and going.

 

I think it was a bit mean of her to give you the line about being too late, that's kind of rubbing your face in it a bit.

 

Shame about the blubbering mess but perfectly understandable. I wouldn't say another word to her, or respond to anything from her now. I expect you've traveled back by now.

 

Well, I know it sounds harsh what she said, but at least she was clear about things. You really cannot do anything else now except do your best to move on without her. All you can do is keep going, step by step. You'll get there, you know you will, even if it doesn't feel like it sometimes Good luck.

[shackazu]

she wasn't mean at all really is the thing--she only said that when i directly asked her, and at first she didn't even want to tell me that she didn't feel anything for me anymore, she gave some fluff reasons until i pressed her on it. which sucks, because if she were actually an awful person it would be a lot easier

[shackazu]

damnit damnit damnit man, i just really, really blew it. the dinners with her family both went so well, i was charming and funny and fun to be around. and then i devolved into the "we should be together" sort of begging not even 20 minutes into our walk on the beach, which should have just been an opportunity to be the same way, just alone as the two of us that time.

 

i'm so worried that i screwed myself once and for all with this. she definitely still cares about me as a person, and has love for me...just isn't in love with me anymore. after i left, she sent me a message saying, "I know you will work through everything and will be at peace with the incredible person that you are. I was wrong bc I don't think I really saw your true soul. Youre the one who is a bright pearl. You just have to uncover it. And no matter what happens, I can promise you I will never forget what we had. I loved you dearly and I will always remember the wonderful, beautiful times we have had together. It will be our secret forever. I'm sorry for all the pain I have and am causing you. Take good care of yourself."

 

after reading boomshine's threads, i agree totally with what he says about rebuilding the ex's attraction for you, and having communication and hanging out as a way for her to see that some of the old problems wouldn't still be there. unfortunately, i tried to do all of this way too soon, before i had really gotten myself to a solid point. if i had just been fun and casual and chill, we would probably have started communicating even more and becomign closer and closer this semester, and maybe i would have ended up with another chance to visit/see her at the end of the year.

[winniethepooh]

damnit damnit damnit man, i just really, really blew it.

dammit dammit dammit man. No. You. Didn't.

 

You tried your best, and you made it clear how you felt. I don't think you could have done any more. You could have done less, and my guess is it wouldn't have changed the outcome.

 

 

she sent me a message saying, "I know you will work through everything and will be at peace with the incredible person that you are. I was wrong bc I don't think I really saw your true soul. Youre the one who is a bright pearl. You just have to uncover it. And no matter what happens, I can promise you I will never forget what we had. I loved you dearly and I will always remember the wonderful, beautiful times we have had together. It will be our secret forever. I'm sorry for all the pain I have and am causing you. Take good care of yourself."

That message makes my blood run cold. I think there's more going on than she revealed to you. I say that based on my own experiences, what I've read here, stories I've heard, and, I'm not emotionally invested in either you or her. You are still emotionally invested in her and can't see clearly.

 

I don't know what else is going on, but I think there is something. I'm fairly sure she won't tell you and you might never know, but all you can do now is leave her alone. Completely. No matter how much you are tempted to contact her or respond to anything she says.

 

after reading boomshine's threads, i agree totally with what he says about rebuilding the ex's attraction for you, and having communication and hanging out as a way for her to see that some of the old problems wouldn't still be there. unfortunately, i tried to do all of this way too soon, before i had really gotten myself to a solid point. if i had just been fun and casual and chill, we would probably have started communicating even more and becomign closer and closer this semester, and maybe i would have ended up with another chance to visit/see her at the end of the year.

I think more likely you would have ended up being her friend, and suffered even more than you are going to suffer from here.

[shackazu]

That message makes my blood run cold. I think there's more going on than she revealed to you. I say that based on my own experiences, what I've read here, stories I've heard, and, I'm not emotionally invested in either you or her. You are still emotionally invested in her and can't see clearly.

 

I don't know what else is going on, but I think there is something. I'm fairly sure she won't tell you and you might never know, but all you can do now is leave her alone. Completely. No matter how much you are tempted to contact her or respond to anything she says.

 

can you explain this more? Also, I was kind of misleading, sorry. I revealed some things to her from my childhood that help explain the uneasiness I had with my mixed heritage that this summer made her feel like she was the wrong color for me, and in response she sent that. THe first two sentences were Also, I'm sorry you have been marked by the incidents you told me about. No child should have to feel like that But, I know that you will work through everything...

 

I think more likely you would have ended up being her friend, and suffered even more than you are going to suffer from here.

 

I don't know. I mean, we stayed pretty close up until this--when I got there, we still felt pretty close, and talked very normally. I think we would have stayed incredibly emotionally close, which at the least would have interfered with us getting involved seriously with other people--ie, we would have ended up back together at some point.

[winniethepooh]

can you explain this more?

She sounds patronizing and guilty to me. And is trying to paint over it with encouraging platitudes.

 

Also it sounds like she's moved on (whether with someone else or not I don't know).

 

You will have a much better idea than I do once you've got over it, as long as you do focus on getting over her and moving on. Not an easy thing to do I know.

 

It might be too much of my own personal experience coming through here, and I'm willing to accept that my point of view is badly distorted as a result. I received a letter with a similar kind of sentiment from my ex shortly after break-up. At the time it struck me as her feeling guilty and patronising, and it didn't make sense. But I was still in love, and so that meant I thought it was sweet and kind and generous of her to write everything she did. A long time after, and as the result of receiving some information, I realised that it was all nonsense, and my initial vague feeling that it was patronizing and guilt-ridden was correct.

 

I don't know. I mean, we stayed pretty close up until this--when I got there, we still felt pretty close, and talked very normally. I think we would have stayed incredibly emotionally close, which at the least would have interfered with us getting involved seriously with other people--ie, we would have ended up back together at some point.

I don't know either, but I seriously don't put the odds on you and her getting back together as any higher had you tried this road. If anything, I would say less likely (or you would get back together but it wouldn't last).

[shackazu]

i don't know, i mean, when i asked her what she wanted and was looking for, she said that she wanted someone more emotionally developed than her, not less. that she wanted someone "solid." all i did was show her how not solid i am. i showed her an emotional wuss.

 

i think maybe what i should have done when she told me that was hit back a little. told her that she didn't really know me, that she couldn't see through all of me. that yes, i wear my emotions visibly, but i'm not afraid of them, and i'm not afraid to let her see them, that standing there in front of her in her city, having made myself vulnerable to her was pretty "solid" in its own way. that yes, i probably dumped on her for support several times, but that i could read her too--that she never had to impress me to get me to love her, and that whether it applied now -to me- or not, that she probably used this "no regrets" "meant to be" "destiny" schtick as a way to avoid confronting something that she really, really regrets, as a way to run away from taking responsibility for her own choices.

 

that might have made herrespect me more.

[Shane Falco]

I don't think it would have made a difference at all to be quite honest. Either she was going to embrace it or she wasn't. You weren't going to debate her into seeing your point of view.

[shackazu]

I'm so confused now. Clearly the best thing for me to have done would have been to play it completely cool, told her that I wanted to get back together and still had feelings for her (but calmly), then after her explanation/whatever said that I respected her decision, and that while she knew what I want, I understood that being a friend was all she could offer at the moment, and then just stayed close and done my best to become ever emotionally closer with her (while at the same time moving on and dating others myself--made easier by our distance).

 

So how do I right the situation that I sort of screwed up? if I contact her now and say that I probably look even more emotionally undeveloped because I am being flaky and shifting from one extreme to the other. If i let a few months go by, she might assume that I am now sayign that I can be just friends, and out of sight out of mind--she moves on even more, and our relationship decays even more and we are even less close than we are now.

 

Gahh. I should have just stayed as close as possible and not done the month and a half of NC in nov./dec

[winniethepooh]

I'm so confused now.

Figure out why. It won't be obvious now because you still have feelings for her. But it is quite clear that you are confused, and you're still in love. When you're not in love, then you might know why you're confused about her. That's why you need to let go, to get that clarity, because you don't have it at the moment.

 

Clearly the best thing for me to have done would have been to play it completely cool,

Not clear to me in the slightest. I think you might be the lucky one here.

 

So how do I right the situation that I sort of screwed up?

You don't. It might be possible to manipulate her back to you but do you really want to be that sort of person? Anyway, I think she's too far gone, and you're not far enough gone, for that to be a realistic possibility.

 

Besides, in time, If. You. Leave. Her. Alone. And. Move. On. ... you might realise that you didn't screw up.

 

Gahh. I should have just stayed as close as possible and not done the month and a half of NC in nov./dec

Gah. No. Maybe you shouldn't have, but her behavior now says to me you probably did the right thing.

 

You said she said she'd always be there if you needed someone? I'd suggest you run a mile from her and keep running. She wasn't there for you when you needed her, so stop needing her. Learn not to need anyone who spouts two-faced BS like that.

[Shane Falco]

I absolutely 100 percent disagree with your assessment. If anything, you should have stayed NC and gotten your mind right before doing anything with her. In my opinion, you didn't go NC long enough. You weren't ready to put your best foot forward with this woman and you didn't. And there's no way for you to "fix" this. You have to let it be. I think that's been your problem from day one -- you keep trying to manipulate the situation instead of stepping back and getting your head clear. You've been trying to plot the entire time and where has it gotten you? NC wasn't the problem -- the problem was that you never allowed your emotions to settle and you never allowed yourself to relax, reset and put your best foot forward. She was initially attracted to the strong, decisive, attractive you -- not the fidgety, emotional mess that you've become.

 

NC isn't a ploy to get your ex back, but it's a ploy for you to a) get over her or b) step back and settle your emotions so you don't come off as an unattractive, emotional mess when you see your ex. That's the point of it. Please stop trying to manipulate and fix everything and step back and work on you. For you, not for her. You haven't worked on you at all and unfortunately, the results of that came out when you were with her. It sucks and I really wish it had worked out for you, but you have to realize that a) there's nothing you can do to turn her switch back on and b) that there's a very good possibility that this girl wasn't the one.

[Boomshine]

Shack, I'm inclined to agree with Winnie and Shane here.

 

I appreciate that you've been reading my threads and gaining some knowledge from them, but you have to realize also that I've been doing intensive studying in my free time. I've been learning about all the problems that my relationship faced by reading as much material on the subject as possible. I've learned a lot about male and female relationship psychology, finding happiness from within yourself as opposed to having your SO be your entire source of happiness, how to get over someone, and plenty of other topics. I spent my time in NC learning, so when NC was over, I could be much stronger and logic.

 

I let myself get overwhelmed by emotion in the end of the relationship. I acted on emotion (mostly fear and insecurity), which chased her off. Now that I've gone through NC, and given myself time to hit the reset button on myself, I'm acting out of logic instead of emotion, and it's getting me much better results. My ex and I had a little text back-and-forth earlier today, and in every single one of the messages, she said "LOL" or "Haha," actually TRYING to show me that she's enjoying our conversations. I don't think she's put an LOL in a text with me for MONTHS. Not since before she broke up with me last April, anyhow.

 

See, the other thing is, I'm making baby steps. I'm not trying to rush for the finish line. In your scenario though, you acted out of emotion, causing you to ask her to be with you in a less-than-attractive manner. You didn't give yourself the time to hit your reset switch.

 

The funny thing is, it still doesn't necessarily HAVE to be over between you two. Go NC for a GOOD amount of time (and NO cheating - No Skype, no texts, no emails, no Facebook, NOTHING). If she messages you in some manner, respond appropriately and friendly, but don't deviate from her conversation topic. Once it's over, end the conversation politely. Say you have something to do, and it was nice talking to her.

 

Spend this time in NC finding yourself. If you need help, don't be afraid to ask, but you cannot call it early. You HAVE to let the healing happen. And you can't force healing. Time is what you're looking for. Let time do its work until you feel the healing.

 

We can talk about what happens then later down the road when it's time to actually cross that bridge. Please, do me one favor in the meantime. Go No Contact for 2 months minimum. Again, if she gets a hold of you, that's fine, but once the conversation is over or ten minutes have passed (whichever comes first), end the conversation, and keep moving on.

 

You've tried every other method. You've done everything your heart has told you to do. Stop listening to that fool now. Tell your heart you'll get back to him when he's gotten his issues sorted out, and that you're going to listen to only your mind for the next two months. Please. We want to see you succeed.

[shackazu]

you're right, ok. two months as of saturday. so it's day 4 right now. and i have to say, shane falco, i agree. i thought i was strong enough to handle seeing her in person, and i was when other people were around, but then when it was just us,and we talked about us, i wasn't. and i should have told myself that as people-perceptive as she is, there was no way i could have faked anything around her. i just thought that there was no way she could have lost her feelings for me in just a couple months, because i know that they were real, and real love doesn't just fade that quickly.

[winniethepooh]

i just thought that there was no way she could have lost her feelings for me in just a couple months, because i know that they were real, and real love doesn't just fade that quickly.

You see that's exactly the sort of thing you might have a different perspective about in a few months.

 

And one of the most difficult things to figure out is, if you really want to try and contact your ex again, when you are strong enough to. I would say when you think you are strong enough, wait another year or so. And if you think it's insane to wait another year, then I think it means you're not strong enough. Of course I say that from the perspective that you are the dumpee - and as of now, it seems as though you are, no matter what events led up to this point. She effectively dumped you in that last meeting, even if it wasn't clear who dumped who before that.