Still not convinced

[winniethepooh]

And hey, try not to take my blunt comments too personally. Yes, of course they are personally directed at you, but more to make you think of different perspectives and process them, than to try and bring you down.

 

You're a bit stuck in a woe is me emotional state, feeling sorry for yourself. You're a big boy, I'm not going to hold your hand and delicately carry you out of the mire, I'm trying to put a rocket under your arse when you start to sound like you want to go back and wallow for a bit, partly because you don't have the time now to mess around.

[shackazu]

.

 

The ball is in your court, you have to send it back, or let it go, but if she sees herself as the dumpee, you probably won't get another one.

 

I don't quite understand you here. Can you clarify what you are saying?

 

You mean I either reply with a message saying, I'm sorry that I wasn't clearer, but even though I will amuse myself while there, the purpose of my visit is that I want to have a real in-person conversation with you about what happened and us and where to go from here, whatever that result is is up to both of us"

 

Or I don't address that issue right now and just let the comment go... and I won't get another...ball?

 

I really doubt that she thinks my intention is to come because I just want to be friends - I very emphatically told her as much in our last face to face (well video chat) conversation, I never got in touch with her about the visit to stay at her home (which would have been "just as friends"), and I didn't ask to stay with her this time, although there is the thesis component which throws a wrench into that being an indication of anything.

[winniethepooh]

I don't quite understand you here. Can you clarify what you are saying?

Haha, my turn to be cryptic. Sorry.

 

I mean you have to do something with her message, as in decide to go or not, and how you want to approach this. If you ignore her message, or don't go but don't really say why you're not going, then I don't think you'll get another opportunity to reconnect with her in terms of getting back together. At least not for a long time - meaning I think she will continue down the path of moving on, and eventually will (if she's not there already). Usually for the dumpee, there is a point at which there is no turning back for them.

 

If she feels like the dumpee (and that's a tricky thing to figure out in your situation), then trying to put everything on hold until May might not work without her cooperation, because she will continue to move on towards that point of no return (or beyond if she's already past).

 

You mean I either reply with a message saying, I'm sorry that I wasn't clearer, but even though I will amuse myself while there, the purpose of my visit is that I want to have a real in-person conversation with you about what happened and us and where to go from here, whatever that result is is up to both of us"

 

Or I don't address that issue right now and just let the comment go... and I won't get another...ball?

Not quite, hope the above comment explains.

 

Don't say "I will amuse myself". I can't explain it, but it just sounds off in some way.

 

I really doubt that she thinks my intention is to come because I just want to be friends - I very emphatically told her as much in our last face to face (well video chat) conversation,

Ok, but wasn't that 2 months ago? She might have moved on, she might think you have moved on, or both. Your casual initial message leaves that question up in the air for her if she hasn't moved on and wonders what your position is, or it sounds like you have moved on and are just coming as friends.

 

I never got in touch with her about the visit to stay at her home (which would have been "just as friends"),

So if her last understanding is that you were coming as "just friends", what have you said since then that would indicate to her this visit is anything different?

 

and I didn't ask to stay with her this time, although there is the thesis component which throws a wrench into that being an indication of anything.

I don't see how the thesis affects her perception of your intentions. It affects her availability in terms of spending time with you, and perhaps her desire to focus on you and her.

[shackazu]

I think she feels like a dumper who nonetheless was hurt. Even in Africa, she said things like, I needed to go to France alone to figure myself out, and she had reasons to break up with me in Africa, even if she was still very hurt and also didn't want to. And the "let's be like we were in January, not together but together" was her idea - i had gone back to her just saying that I just wanted to figure out how to be together, and she replied with that idea.

 

So I think she probably feels maybe, like 55% dumper, 45% dumpee. But who knows.

 

 

Anyway, I am going. I sent her back my flight info, and said i was looking forward to seeing her. she isn't stupid, and she is one of the most "people smart" people i know...i just highly doubt that she actually thinks that i just want to come for the tourism, and that she is a side-thought.

 

 

I also talked with two friends today, and got somewhat conflicting advice. A guy friend from home, one of my best friends (and a bit of a cynic) told me I was crazy, that I should forget her and completely move on, that there's no point in trying to ever get back with an ex. He counseled me to just act like a friend, have a fun time, but not to bring anything up first.

 

The second, a girl, who herself met a guy in europe while studying abroad, pushed him away because she thought he was too serious and it scared her, and ended up getting back together with him slowly like 4 - 7 months later (she went back to th US for a while, then studied abroad again in a different country, but made the move to get back by visiting him). She is now here havign moved to be with him. She suggested that I be myself and be honest, and said the if it were her she would want me to fight for her, that she has kept guys in her life before after breakign up because she still felt somethign for them, and that if they had been more confident they would have had a chance.

[winniethepooh]

I am naturally cynical and skeptical, even more so after my last relationship ended, and especially after processing what happened. Nevertheless, I still would like to have a glimmer of hope about people. I found that the girl's comments resonated with me more than the guy (except for that asinine comment about wanting him to fight for her), even though in principle I would be firmly on the guy's side of the fence.

 

Anyway, you're going. Good on you for taking the risk. Now make the best of it you can - be clear but don't push for conversations if it seems inappropriate (yes, ideally, she'd bring things up first but don't count on it either), keep your balance, keep busy with other things (this is absolutely vital - force yourself to get out there and do stuff away from her), don't suffocate her, don't be a doormat.

[Shane Falco]

Yeah, the whole "girls want a guy to fight for them" sounds great to a lot of women in theory because it makes for a great story in romantic comedies and chick flicks, but in practice it tends to freak them out and drive them away. Never have actually seen that work in real life.

[shackazu]

The thing is... I still feel like some kind of big grand gesture would work. Not that I could pull one off in a day and a half. But you don't think I should do anything really cute for her to greet her with?

 

If only it were more clear--as in me as the dumper, instead of being all muddled. Then it would be more justifiable to do something like that.

 

 

Clearly she was unhappy with me - as she said, I was both so happy and so sad, and i don't want to feel that way again. So shouldn't I maybe do something like a grand gesture to show how I would really not take her for granted again?

[winniethepooh]

The thing is... I still feel like some kind of big grand gesture would work.

What movie are you watching for relationship guidance?

 

Don't do that.

 

But you don't think I should do anything really cute for her to greet her with?

No. I don't know under what circumstances you are going to meet her.

 

If only it were more clear--as in me as the dumper, instead of being all muddled. Then it would be more justifiable to do something like that.

Exactly. But it's not. So don't.

 

You can buy something sweet and nice while you're there if things go well.

 

Clearly she was unhappy with me - as she said, I was both so happy and so sad, and i don't want to feel that way again. So shouldn't I maybe do something like a grand gesture to show how I would really not take her for granted again?

No. You're flying there. That's a grand gesture for a start.

 

 

 

 

Bring a fridge magnet.

[Shane Falco]

The thing is... I still feel like some kind of big grand gesture would work.

 

Not only would this not work, but it would almost certainly kill whatever chance you have left.

[shackazu]

Got it. ixnayed. I think that I will however, bring along with me an edible specialty from the region I am living in--in case she invites me to her house for some reason, for dinner, to meet her dogs, whatever, then I can give it to her Mom when I meet her. Since that's what I would have done the first time visiting her home wer we still together.

[winniethepooh]

Since that's what I would have done the first time visiting her home wer we still together.

But you're not together.

 

Don't go to her home. Don't meet her mum until or unless it's clear what the nature of your relationship is with your ex.

 

Anyway, you can't go to dinner, you already have every night booked up with other activities while you're there - concerts, art gallery openings, comedy show, whatever.

[shackazu]

Why do you say this? Why not go to her house with her if she were to invite me? Originally I was going to stay there for a week anyway... and something might have (probably) would have happened between us then

[shackazu]

So, the above question is now relevant. She texted me (first) saying she hoped I had gotten in to the city ok, suggested a place for me to visit, asked where I was staying, told me that she wa super behind on her thesis (because se hasn't been able to focus) and was busy today and tomorrow, but invited me to her house for dinner tomorrow (ie, with her family). I've met her sister before, but never her parents or brother in person.

 

Part of me thinks she is trying to avoid seeing me with just the two of us alone--to avoid a conversation about us? But in the other hand, isn't dinner with the family kind of intimate? If my (old) ex (who im totaly uniterested jn anymore) came to town wanting to meet up for coffee, I wouldn't invite her to dinner at my house...

[winniethepooh]

Dinner with the family sounds to me like her wanting support from them, for whatever reason. Maybe she's afraid things might get intimate between you otherwise. Or maybe she wants to make it clear she only wants to be friends. Or maybe she's unsure of your motives. It's difficult to read people's minds.

 

Whatever, it is what it is. If you go, go with the frame of mind that you will be as positive as possible about things - remember you will be judged on your actions by everyone there. Try not to get into heavy conversations with anyone. Try and listen far more than talk - so you can absorb as much information as possible about what is going on. Not easy to do, I know. But you do have a day or two to go and do other things around the city so you have something to talk about with them.

 

Given you haven't met them, except her sister, I'd be very uncomfortable about the idea, assuming they're all there.

 

Alternatively you could say you'd rather just meet her for a coffee somewhere first and have a chat, especially since you haven't seen her for a while, and especially because you haven't met the rest of her family.