Reconciliations - only if the dumpee originally respects being dumped?

[IceFireSoul]

Hi everyone;

 

Along with my original post where I give all the advice that I am sure of and am willing and wanting to share; I am also continuing my life-long quest on understanding as much as I can about human interactions.

 

So, here is the thing. I have been reading a lot of books, forums, stories and have talked to many couples. What I am finding that is likely to be true is something that's gonna be harsh for some of us who have already made a mistake:

 

Would you say that most if not all successful reconciliations happen only if the DUMPEE ORIGINALLY RESPECTS THE DUMPER'S DECISION?

 

Of course; the more you are in love; the more it hurts, especially when it's a breakup out of the blue; and the more you are going to go and try to tell her/him how much you care; how much you love; and beg, cry and plead. But it really strikes me that this is the single thing that completely changes the dynamic of the dumping; and rather than the dumpee becoming the strong one who has been dumped and respected it; s/he becomes a crying baby that needs to be slapped and punished by never being given another chance.

 

In other words; it strikes me that the less serious you seem when dumped (and accept it lightly); the more chances you have of reestablishing contact sooner; that contact being friendly and it eventually leading the dumper to realizing that they've made a mistake.

 

Also, please, if anyone knows of any success stories that actually started with text message terrorism/stalkish behavior and later reconciled; please share those. It's really interesting to see how an initial stalking/terrorizing behavior can be later corrected and excused successfully.

 

Thanks! Let's all seek the answers to the big questions!

[Snowy]

The thing behind this is one word: ego.

 

If the dumpee accepts the break up and moves on, the dumper's ego might take a hit.

 

If the dumpee cries and begs, the dumper's ego will go through the roof for sure; and nobody likes a cry baby.

[IceFireSoul]

Ego is a sure thing. It's not just that, though.

 

Because, if you are dumped and accept right away; you are seen as mature and strong. This is a turn-on on it's own.

 

Rather, if you beg, stalk, cry and plead; you are seen as crazy, and she is thinking to herself "I never knew he is like that, thank God I'm out of this". She never realizes that you are going through an enormously extreme pain and that pain is causing you to behave like this. She simply bugs off and asks you to never contact her again.

[mhowe]

While I hate the dumper/dumpee mindset, you are right. But the part that you get right is the word RESPECT.

 

When my ex "dumped" me, out of the blue, and it made no sense, I walked away --- in shock, but walked away. Ten days later, I stopped by his house to talk, as I asked him, for 10 minutes....he really didn't clarify much, but I had a better sense of why....and went NC for lack of a better word, because I hate the NC more than I hate dumper/dumpee....but he asked for "some time"....and I gave it to him. Four months worth.

 

Why? Because I respected the man, and our relationship, and if he needed time to sort things out (his life had kinda spun out of control thru no fault of his own), then I needed to respect his decision. And later, when we got back together (and yes, we still are), and he told me all of the particulars, I could not fault his decision....not one I would have made, but knowing him and the circumstances, certainly could see why he did what he did.

 

So, yes. Respect that the person you are involved with has made their best choice with the info and tools that they have. Acknowledge that they are not purposely hurting you ---- they are just acting in the only way they can see at the time. Walk away. No begging, no pleading, no texting 20x a day. Let go. Get on with your life, because whether you want it to or not, it goes on --- without them.

 

If it is truly meant to be, they will come back.

[Snowy]

Ego is a sure thing. It's not just that, though.

 

Because, if you are dumped and accept right away; you are seen as mature and strong. This is a turn-on on it's own.

 

Rather, if you beg, stalk, cry and plead; you are seen as crazy, and she is thinking to herself "I never knew he is like that, thank God I'm out of this". She never realizes that you are going through an enormously extreme pain and that pain is causing you to behave like this. She simply bugs off and asks you to never contact her again.

 

What you're saying isn't wrong, but I believe it still comes down to egos lol.

[Tired Tiger]

Would you say that most if not all successful reconciliations happen only if the DUMPEE ORIGINALLY RESPECTS THE DUMPER'S DECISION?

 

Replace the word 'respects' with 'accepts' (at least as far as the decision). What's best to respect is the boundary that has been created. Another little tip - find alternatives to the words "dumper" and "dumpee". They're indicitive of a negative villain/victim mentality.

 

Of course; the more you are in love; the more it hurts, especially when it's a breakup out of the blue; and the more you are going to go and try to tell her/him how much you care; how much you love; and beg, cry and plead.

 

Those behaviors aren't driven by love, but by attachment. Understanding the distinction between the two is a giant step in the right direction. Love isn't desperate or demanding - attachment is (along with fear, insecurity, and rejection).

[DN]

I don't believe that there is a 'one rule fits all' that works in human relationships.

[Brownstone322]

Would you say that most if not all successful reconciliations happen only if the DUMPEE ORIGINALLY RESPECTS THE DUMPER'S DECISION?

Let's get a grip on reality here. Very few "dumpees" will "respect/accept/agree with" the decision of the "dumper" at the very outset, and they probably shouldn't. If they were invested in the relationship to begin with, we can't really expect them accept that the relationship is over on short notice. Eventually, sure; immediately, no. So the issues that really matter would be these:

 

1. How long does did take for you to accept the breakup?

 

2. How destructive was your behavior in the interim?

 

For most of us, I think, the "dumpee's destructive phase" consumes a matter of days or weeks. Most breakups can eventually overcome that kinda thing (because it's normal), assuming the opportunity ever arises. So I posit that the "dumpee's" post-breakup behavior has to be truly catastrophic for it to be insurmountable.

 

On the other hand, I've read some of your posts, and if I have the facts correct (that is, 2,000 text messages over three months ... which is about 20 a day ... which is more than one every waking hour), then your behavior was anything but normal. And didn't she have a new boyfriend all that time? She (and he) must have thought you were a raging psycho; she was probably wondering how she had ever been with you at all.

 

Short of outright stalking, I think your behavior was as "catastrophic" and "insurmountable" as any I've ever heard of. Think about all that, if you haven't already, and apply it to your next relationship.

[BONO]

Bingo ! Well said and good for you.

[Mellie]

I think the crying, begging, pleading, is pretty normal, and in the past, for me, that hasn't been insurmountable. You're looking for answers, he doesn't want to give them, because breaking up with someone feels crappy enough without rubbing salt in the wounds.

 

I did send a lot of texts initially, but 2,000 goes beyond a lot, and was going on for far too long. And turning up unannounced - I never did that. I've never had it done to me either but I can't imagine that's pleasant. I wouldn't have a lot of respect for someone who did that and it shows a blatant disrespect for me and my wishes.

 

So bombarding them with text messages, you can come back from that if they want to. The key I found was leaving it completely with them - no reaching out, no nothing. Terrorism and stalkerish behaviour, over a drawn out period, I think you'd be pushing it a bit there.

[IceFireSoul]

Guys.

 

Let me be honest here.

 

I love her more than anyone in this world and after getting out of the "crazy" phase, I am realizing that never seeing her ever again is going to hurt a lot. On the other hand, I CAN cope with being nothing more than a friend to her. This is so much than nothing, even if we never get back together.

 

But yes. The damage is done. In short:

 

-At first; for a few days I kept it to 5-6 messages a day and a call here and there.

-Then, realizing it's really over, the hurt kicked in tremendously. I reached for the phone more than 40 times a day, she had to turn off her cell many times; I asked friends to talk to her. It wasn't too late. We set up a meeting as friend; which she canceled, but said we can do it soon. This devastated me more. I was able to await her at her house once and gave her a card and a teddy bear. I awaited her a few more times on places i knew she will be; that was only in the first two weeks the most. Afterwards no mor stalking.

-After a month I was still texting, contacting her, sending messages on sites that we share, forums, facebook, e-mails from all of my accounts, and more messages. Eventually I met her twice, but she came with a friend of hers; to "look after us". I tried hugging her, begging, crying, telling her how much I love her.

-And i continued with messages, calls, e-mails. Also kept posting music to your shared Dropbox folder; also pictures of me; uploaded all of our memories; I was able to get a few phone calls with her; all lasted 3 hrs+...

-Lately I had some bursts with more than 60 texts per day. Eventually that was after last saturday I managed to call her from another phone number, she picked up; I asked that we talk from my phone, she said ok... added me on skype and we were "one speaking terms"... But I got too excited. Didn't ask her to be with me, acknowledged her new man; even accepted that they are going to the mountains next weekend; or stuff she told me about them (spicy)... I accepted it all. But my mistake appeared to be that I still acted nice, romantic and cute towards her; reminded her of some of our sexual fetishes in a gentle way, simply asking whether she still remembers; tried to tell her a few of our memories together. She was talking calmly and nicely with me, and then, out of the blue... she burst out; started raging, asked "What is FRIENDS to me?". I tried to explain myself, but she was beyond the point of no return; started yelling that i don't understand the border between friends and more; and that she can't trust me for anything that I say; I tried to explain more; but she kept yelling that "See, I am explaining again, STOP IT"; she was super angry and told me that if i don't shut up in 10 seconds, she'll block me for good... I said "ok" "have a good night" - but even that didn't stop the damage - in 20 minutes she told me that she has thought about it all and we can't be friends ever, before, now and in the future and that she asks me to not seek any form of contact ever again and that if I don't stop, she'll seek the help of her friends, family and the police and will cut off all contact forcefully.

 

So that's how the biggest love of my live ended.

 

Once again; there we go:

 

April 30th - she comes over and sleeps with me; romantically and amazingly in love

May 1st - she wakes up next to me and looks me in the eyes with love

May 6th - She goes out on a date with a friend she knew from an year ago

May 7th - They go again and the guy asks her out

May 12th - I come from a trip and call her; she tells me it's over

Recently - After I tried EVERYTHING she blocks me, including my phone numbers, forever.

 

What to do?

 

Yes, I do believe that there is something to be done.

 

I am thinking of:

 

-Wait 3 months in NC; in which I'll make sure she sees me doing fine through mutual friends/facebook

-Send a friend to meet her "by chance" after this; have a coffee with her and tell her I'm OVER her; have REALIZED my crazy behavior (she's been with me for 1.5 years and knows I'm not normally like that AT ALL)

-Later on I meet her after they talk and simply prove it - by being cold/nonchalant, friendly and not demanding at all.

 

I do want to get her back in my life; she, nor I deserved to be separated for good after sharing so much.

 

Please, advise.

[Brownstone322]

I am thinking of:

 

-Wait 3 months in NC; in which I'll make sure she sees me doing fine through mutual friends/facebook

-Send a friend to meet her "by chance" after this; have a coffee with her and tell her I'm OVER her; have REALIZED my crazy behavior (she's been with me for 1.5 years and knows I'm not normally like that AT ALL)

-Later on I meet her after they talk and simply prove it - by being cold/nonchalant, friendly and not demanding at all.

This is all premeditated manipulation. You're still acting like a psycho. How 'bout this instead? ...

 

- You let go

- You get on with your life

- You get a grasp on your emotions

- You let events happen on their own

[Edmund Exley]

You are very, very, VERY lucky she hasnt had the police involved. I can't stress this enough.....LEAVE HER ALONE

[Brownstone322]

You are very, very, VERY lucky she hasnt had the police involved. I can't stress this enough.....LEAVE HER ALONE

I know. His may be the best case for harassment I've ever seen here.

[lucasky]

I don't think respecting the breakup initially makes a big difference. I've been the begger/pleader/negotiator, and in all cases my ex's have came back. I guess there's just something about me (hahaha... I shouldn't brag... I'll lose my luck).

 

The key for me was I never did "crazy" things.

-No text message/email/phone call bombardments.

-Never stalked the guys etc etc.

-Kept my begging/pleading within acceptable levels - I would mention it when I saw the person (or talked to them on FB chat/aim whatever), but then drop it when they became uncomfortable.

-Did not convince myself that my exs needed me or were wrong.

-Did not diagnose an ex with "gigs", depression, co-dependency, narcissism etc (things I can't diagnose... I'm no doctor)!

[Edmund Exley]

I don't think respecting the breakup initially makes a big difference. I've been the begger/pleader/negotiator, and in all cases my ex's have came back. I guess there's just something about me (hahaha... I shouldn't brag... I'll lose my luck).

 

The key for me was I never did "crazy" things.

-No text message/email/phone call bombardments.

-Never stalked the guys etc etc.

-Kept my begging/pleading within acceptable levels - I would mention it when I saw the person (or talked to them on FB chat/aim whatever), but then drop it when they became uncomfortable.

-Did not convince myself that my exs needed me or were wrong.

-Did not diagnose an ex with "gigs", depression, co-dependency, narcissism etc (things I can't diagnose... I'm no doctor)!

 

Sounds to me like you respected the breakup.

[lucasky]

Sounds to me like you respected the breakup.

 

Hmm I guess so. I suppose I respected my ex's right to feel the way they feel, but my heart and mind rejected the breakup and wanted a reconciliation so badly. Maybe I just didn't act out on it. ;p

[CMS]

Hmm I guess so. I suppose I respected my ex's right to feel the way they feel, but my heart and mind rejected the breakup and wanted a reconciliation so badly. Maybe I just didn't act out on it. ;p

 

I can subscribe to that line of thinking, means you respect their decision even if you disagree with it wholeheartedly

[Mellie]

You lost me at 40 messages a day. The reason she met up with you immediately after this wasn't with any view to reconcilliation. It was to tell you to stop.

 

And looking back on my reconciliation, I didn't think I did much work on myself during the break up. I was bascially waiting BUT I did learn something. I was far too needy and smothering the first time around. I don't doubt for a second that's why the relationship failed. So some kind of shift in my way of thinking definitely took place because when we got back together, I was pretty laid back whereas the first time, I must have been a complete pain in the ass. I guess banging my head against that brick wall for long enough knocked some sense into me. I wasn't entirely happy living without him, but I had started to make the transition to seeing that I COULD live without him. I'm sure given more time and, ahem, effort I would have gotten over it completely.

[browneyedgirl36]

I don't know if reconciliations ONLY happen when the "dumpee" respects/accepts getting dumped. I think it's pretty normal to cry initially, and to try, at least a few times, to sort things out. With my last breakup, texted once, a couple days after, and said something like "I really think we're missing on the opportunity to have something really special here" or something along that line, to which he didn't respond. A couple days later, I saw him at work, and it was awkward, and it stressed me out, so I called him and left him a message asking him to call me. He did, and we talked, and I asked if he was certain this is what he wanted, and he said "no," and we decided to keep trying. Shortly afterward, he broke things off again, and this time, while I teared up a bit, I told him I understood, and that he had to do what was best for him (I actually meant that, even though my heart was broken). We talked in my car for like two hours, and then didn't see each other for several weeks until we worked together again. During that three weeks, I never contacted him, nor he me. We eventually "got back together" (sort of), but we're not together anymore, and once again, I didn't bombard him with contact, didn't try to talk him out of it - just left him alone. I doubt we'll ever be together again -- and that's probably for the best -- but I think if we WERE ever to get back together, the fact that I handled myself well MIGHT at least somewhat factor into it because I was able to respect boundaries and proved that through my behavior.

[browneyedgirl36]

This is all premeditated manipulation. You're still acting like a psycho. How 'bout this instead? ...

 

- You let go

- You get on with your life

- You get a grasp on your emotions

- You let events happen on their own

 

Agreed -- IceFireSoul, this is probably one of the most concerning posts I've read in a LONG time here; you have got to get a hold on your emotions, or you could find yourself in a lot of trouble. I have to admit, I'm stunned that this girl responded to some of your contact, though I'm sure she did it because she's kind and did not want to hurt you. And, maybe she thought she could be friends with you -- I don't know. 60 texts in one day? If I received that many texts in one day from a guy I was no longer seeing, I would be SCARED. I would also change my phone number -- but that's just me. And showing up at her house? Again, I would be very nervous about that, even if I knew the guy wasn't *dangerous* or violent in anyway.

 

I agree with Brownstone that your plan is manipulative, and I think it will backfire on you. What he has suggested to you -- to REALLY, genuinely move on -- is your best bet. A common thing you'll read here, and it's very true, is that you can't do ANYTHING to make someone want to be with you, but you certainly CAN do a lot to make them NOT want to be with you. At this point, you've pushed it SO far that the absolute BEST thing you can do is to leave her alone, indefintely. Maybe, at some point down the road, when you truly have a hold of your emotions and aren't in this panic mode that you're in now, you will be able to call her up and talk to her as a friend. You are nowhere NEAR that point now, and I doubt you will be in three months, particularly as you seem to be in the mindset that this is just a waiting game and that if you give it a few months, everything will magically right itself.

[bungalo]

I agree with this 100%. I get tired of all the hindsight advice on how to act when your lover breaks up with you, such as you need to agree with the breakup, act cool, walk away with dignity. I've tried this folks, and if you're invested in the relationship, it just is hard to pull off. I suppose it is possible to act as if you're not affected. But that isn't being real is it? I was fairly cool the last time she left me (third time), but a day later I was bugging her for answers and doing a little bit of begging along the way. Even though I knew it was hopeless. It's human nature to fight for your love. 2000 texts though..not to make you feel worse..but that's just staggering brother.

[WeightOffChest]

I want to answer the thread topic question, as opposed to the OP's problems:

 

I broke up with my girlfriend in the middle of the night as she walked over to surprise me before I left for a weekend. I told her cold things like, "I don't think we should be together anymore", "I think it would be best if you got your stuff out of my apartment", and "I don't want your kindness". I know it was cold-hearted, and the next morning I woke up I actively didn't kiss her goodbye. She thought the whole world of me, and this was the breaking point for her. I left for the weekend, and she texted me once about my trip and not about the breakup. I didn't respond (which would later bite me in the ass). I am checking facebook, and I see that she's uploaded pictures of herself at like 5AM having a great time with her friends. She even talked about how "It's time to move on." At this time knowing her, I knew she was hurting, but her actions showed otherwise. I called and asked to talk with her when I got back. When I came back to my apartment, she took everything of hers. EVERYTHING, including her make-up, underwear, lingerie, toothbrush, etc. She brought ALL of my things back including clothes, phone chargers, etc. I met up with her like I said I would, and she even gave me back a frying pan that I forgot about. She left me a concise, typed letter saying how she wishes things could have worked out, but it sucks that it's over.

 

She was a little spiteful, but for the most part, she was completely respecting the breakup and even though she told me she was hurting and a mess, she remained really composed. If she had pleaded and begged, reminisced about the good times, or tried to guilt me, I probably wouldn't have had the reaction that I did, which was to go after her. I tried to respect her space, but with enough time, I got the dumper's remorse wondering how I could put her and myself through this pain by dumping her. And THAT'S how a dumpee respects the breakup and shows some strength and raises the chance of reconciliation.

 

Because with that, the tables turned and I felt like I was the dumpee. The power had shifted because she demonstrated that she could move on, even though it was painful for her. It made me wonder why I did the cold-hearted thing of breaking up, and it seemed that it was only me who was miserable, whereas she remained composed despite the pain.

 

Now, we're in the stages of moving towards reconciliation, and I'd have to say that if she begged and pleaded, I would have taken her back - but not with the same amount of growth and healing that we've had because of this breakup.

[Mellie]

Obviously with hindsight, it would have been extremely helpful to you to post those 2000 messages here first - to gauge reaction. I think if you hit pause after typing them and stewed for a few days, you'd see how futile it was.

 

Now you have found ENA, it is still ultimately up to you what you do, but it's a great tool to talk you out of something that's undoable. I know everyone's telling you exactly what you don't want to hear, but, in situations like this, the truth is a bitter pill to swallow.

 

I normally add the caveat "I think" to any advice I profer, but in your case I know you need to stop contacting her. Period.

[Brownstone322]

Now, we're in the stages of moving towards reconciliation, and I'd have to say that if she begged and pleaded, I would have taken her back - but not with the same amount of growth and healing that we've had because of this breakup.

Good story, Weight, and, especially, good for her.

 

(And I think she's actually taking you back.