Why is it so easy to recommend meds?

[Jeen]

Well that is certainly interesting,

 

Does anyone use this type of treatment for depression? Can you give some examples or stories on how this has helped you?

 

Would marijuanna fall into this catergory?

 

Jeen- that is also crazy to read, my mother has been an addict of prescription drugs for as long as I can remember, starting with xanax now onto oxycotton, listen to what she takes in a day,

 

xanax x 4 or 5

oxycotton x 2

methadone x 4

vicadin

heart meds

blood pressure meds

antibotics

blood thinners

 

her health continues to fall the more she takes these meds, and the docs tell her since she has taken them for so many years that her body will fail if she stops. I just wish there was more to just going to the doc and saying hey I wanna try some prozax or xanax.

 

My doctor is telling me the same thing.

 

Doctors today learn out of there mistakes they made in the past, but it is getting harder and not easier where I am in the world today to be put on the one's you mentioned. Even antibiotics!

[Hermes]

instead of getting to the root of the problem

 

There's the difficulty. It can take months (maybe more) of therapy to get to the root of a problem, even when the patient is coherent and able to cooperate, and articulate his/her problem as s/he sees it.

Expensive, expensive.

 

H

[Red Fox]

I am curious as to the distrust of medical professionals and at the same time a greater trust of natural remedies. It confuses me as just because something is natural it does not always follow that it is safe. Lots of things in nature are deadly including lots of plants. Also because they are not licensed as drugs there is often no scientific study to evaluate either the long term safety or effectiveness of natural remedies.

 

For example St John's Wort might be thought of as safe as it is a "natural herbal remedy", is not a licensed medicine, and there is some evidence to suggest it may help depression. However:

 

*Commonly reported side effects include: allergic reactions, dizziness, confusion, gastrointestinal symptoms, dry mouth, fatigue and photosensitivity. Patients on conventional drugs are usually very ready to report adverse reactions and often too eager to blame the medication. With "natural remedies" the opposite may be true.

*"....there are a number of drug interactions with St John's wort." Oral contraceptives (among other drugs) for example have known drug interactions with this natural remedy.

*"There is concern about safety and a call for more research on interactions."

*"It should not be used in bipolar disease as it may be associated with mania."

*"It should not be used in pregnancy or lactation, due to lack of evidence of safety." link removed

 

- Suicide is the leading cause of death in the UK for males aged 15 - 44 excluding death by accident.

 

- In the case of depression, studies have shown that, on average, the risk of suicide is about 15 times higher than the average for the general population, and this risk is underestimated due to undiagnosed depression.

 

If you are dealing with a very serious illness of which depression can be, then I would think you would want your treatments to be effective and any effects to be carefully monitored, which is what the medical profession is trained to do. When you have a natural remedy it's effects are often not proved or tested. Would you take a conventional drug or medicine if it's effects were not proven and tested? I wouldn't. Why then take a natural one when nature itself creates plants that are deadly to us?

 

When dealing with a serious illness I rely on the latest scientific evidence and I trust a medical professional who is by law and by morals required to put my best interests at heart. I don't believe that doctors push drugs as an only option. They know that there are other options such as cognitive behavioural therapy which is scientifically proven to have beneficial effects. However if you are a doctor and you do not have access to this (not enough trained professionals, no funding, no money) then what do you offer? What can you offer? Mental health is underfunded, and misunderstood. Doctors would I am sure love to offer therapies such as cognitive behavioural therapy, and you must ask why there is not as much uptake. Is it because doctors cannot get people access to these treatments? Without wishing to stray into politics I believe that their hands are tied.

 

I believe this idea that someone taking an antidepressant must be weak and not in need of it is harmful. If people with what can be a serious life threatening condition are put off from seeking professional help by ideas that doctors will push harmful drugs on them that they do not need because they are "looking for an easy option" then you will put people off seeking help and suicide rates will not go down.

[Miss Firecracker]

I believe this idea that someone taking an antidepressant must be weak and not in need of it is harmful. If people with what can be a serious life threatening condition are put off from seeking professional help by ideas that doctors will push harmful drugs on them that they do not need because they are "looking for an easy option" then you will put people off seeking help and suicide rates will not go down.

 

I think about all the people here in the suicide forum reading this thread. Surely would be a shame if someone took this to heart and decided they didn't want to be one of the weak-minded.

[lavenderdove]

I think that medication for depression is well proven through science and scientific methods. It doesn't mean that sometimes doctors don't prescribe the wrong thing, but to say that medication is NOT the answer in all cases would do a grave disservice to individuals who have brain biochemistry problems and can be hellped and live a normal life with medication.

 

Now the pain medications like Oxycontin and Vicodin should be prescribed ONLY for severe pain, and having been in severe pain myself at one point, they were a lifesaving. But i did not continue to take them when i no longer had the need for them.

 

So the real issue is understanding that in many cases we have learned so much and CAN treat many serious mental and physical problems with medication.

 

If one gets addicted to pain pills when pain isn't the issue, then the problem is ADDICTION, not that the drug itself is bad. The drug can be a wonderful solution to very bad physical pain but if one takes it for other purposes, then the problem is addiction and the person needs rehab.

 

The truth is that if a person has entered a biochemical depression where the brain chemistry is out of whack, the most effective and best treatment is medication, until the person is re-balanced and can be tapered off them.

 

But self medicating with things like weed has nothing to do with science or understanding how the brain works. Weed feeds addiction and AVOIDS dealing with the real problem and providing the correct chemistry in the brain, and in fact leads to both severe depression and psychosis in some people.

 

So there is no easy answer there. I believe in consulting medical professionals to get help when help is needed, but also educating oneself and avoiding addiction. Some people will need a short course of medication, and some people with severe biochemistry imbalances, will need medication their entire lives to prevent suicide and endless years of misery. There is no one size fits all, and 'medication is bad' is an extreme and uneducated position to take.

 

Educate yourself, AND consult a good doctor to get help. And if someone is seeing doctors to get pain meds for recreational purposes, then the answer is rehab.

[sidehop]

I for one do not discredit medical professionals. There are many things people rely on and have been proven no doubt. Nor do all natural therapies and remedies work either.

 

I don't even know where to begin to explain how and why where my belief lies and won't start as it will go into politics so we'll leave it at that. It'll take pages after pages and go into every aspect of our lives that will make me sound crazy!

 

I'll say one thing. There's too much power and money involved and we'll probably never in our lifetime see a major change in the medical industry vs. natural/homeopathic therapy.

 

her health continues to fall the more she takes these meds, and the docs tell her since she has taken them for so many years that her body will fail if she stops. I just wish there was more to just going to the doc and saying hey I wanna try some prozax or xanax.

 

That's the problem. Yes some people may need to be medicated. But most doctors would not be able to tell you how to overcome and cure depression. Nor do these medicine will ever cure depression and serious mental health problems. Therapies and counseling may help in addition but as long as those pills are in your system chances are you'll end up taking more pills.

 

You have to wonder the increased rate of autism and mental health problems compared to 20 years ago. Now I won't say it's because of the traditional medicine and pill pushers are to blame for the cause. It could be environmental, the foods we eat and the way we are going about life somehow is contributing such problem.

 

Each case will differ and some will say 'well what the heck am I supposed to do'. I agree, it's about education, always consult a doctor but get second opinions. If there are homeopathic doctors and people like herbologist that could possibly help with natural treatments. Because in a long run unless you want to be medicated for many years and have all sorts of side effects it's not going to cure the problem.

 

You still need to see the overall picture of your life. The stress level, the environment you're living in, family history, food intake, any unhealthy habits, other health problems causing mental health and much more.

 

Again I'm not entirely discrediting conventional medicine nor never said medications are always bad. But it's something I highly encourage people to do their research and educate themselves when it comes to prescription especially for mental health. It's quite scary.

[Capricorn3]

Im in healthcare and its a big topic of discussion. Especially in counseling and therapy, docs are too quick to prescribe meds, Its easier to dispense a "quic fix" instead of getting to the root of the problem. All this is doing is getting rid of the symptoms but the problem is going to still pop up. I hate how much meds are thrown around now. The side effects are ridiculous and they really dont help the person much in the long run.

^^ THIS. I totally agree with the above. It would be better if more focus was put on actually fixing the CAUSE of the symptom, instead of the other way round. It's so much easier to simply prescribe tons of (usually addictive) medication and hope that things will "magically" disappear. Sadly, the root of the problem always remains, but hey, just take some more pills ...

[RougeKali823]

It is important to note that suicide has now been determined as a possible side effect for young people in that same age group who take anti-depressants.

[OccultFigurine]

It is important to note that suicide has now been determined as a possible side effect for young people in that same age group who take anti-depressants.

 

Yep, the sad truth is ,that some anti-depressants don't work for some people, and in fact make some people worse. This is why it's important to be alert to this, and to keep a dialogue with your doctor.

 

I'm unsure where I stand on this. I'm a trained counsellor,so of course I recognise how important getting to to root of a problem is. I have also been on anti-depressants at various times. I believe that for some people, anti-depressants can be a short term fix that can keep someone together long enough to get the proper help they need. ( in much the same way methadone is *supposedly* a short term fix, but don't get me started on that rant ) Incidentally, theres is currently a 6 motnh waiting list for cog-behavioural therapy from a GP ,and so I can to an extent understand why these prescriptions are made.

 

In my experience, being on anti-depressants long term didn't help me. As soon as I started to feel better, I was better able to ignore the factors in my life that were making me depressed. I felt *okay* but I didn't really feel much at all, and I didn't feel bad enough to sort out the real issues.

 

As soon as I stopped taking them, what was really going wrong in my life became more apparent, and I took steps to change or eliminate those factors-it was tough but necessary. On the other hand I could have stayed on prozac my whole life and had a tolerable existence. But thats no way to live really.

 

Anyways, that's just my tuppence!

[Hermes]

I am with you on that RedFox:

 

 

 

 

 

 

H

[Hermes]

Yes, Sidehop. Absolutely correct

 

You still need to see the overall picture of your life. The stress level, the environment you're living in, family history, food intake, any unhealthy habits, other health problems causing mental health and much more.

 

And I would greatly underline "family history".

 

H

[doityourself]

Alot of differant views on this subject. Can I assume that the posters that agree with the doctors have had a positive affect by these types of medications and thats great.

 

I didnt mean to imply that anyone that takes prescribed medicatations is weak, I have been on medicatations for years. Does it help? Not really and I have tried multiple types. Does that say the doctor didnt do his job, No, It just says they havent found the right one for me, or there is no such medication that will help ME.

 

SORRY IF I PUT ANYONE OUT, PLEASE DO NOT TAKE THIS POST AS A WARNING TO NOT TAKE ANTIDEPRESSANTS.

 

Yes, there are people in pain, suffering that I agree needs these meds, and they should have them.

 

BUT- (there is always a but) I grew up in the world where prescription medication of all types were and still are being abused. I understand the addiction part of it, but it would have never happened if the doctors would not have prescribed them.

 

I just wanted people to be aware that there are doctors not all of them, but there are doctors that will see you for 10 minutes and prescribed just about anything you ask for. All of the docs and therapist have done this to me, all except one.

[Shortpants]

Yes, I do agree with DIY and hope my info about my CHOICE to be homeopathic doesn't come accross as condemning anyone that has had success with regular medical practices and medications. My bother in law is bipolar and is on meds, can't function without them. My ex went on antidepressants and they did seem to help him (to a degree), but he also had other underlying issues.

 

It is all a matter of what works for you, and as posters have mentioned, homeopathic treatments are NOT regulated by the FDA, so if you are thinking of pursuing homeopathy, please, PLEASE make sure to find a licenced and trained homeopathic provider in your area to consult before self-medicating by something you read on the internet. Personally, I have had great success with homeopathy, this may not be the case for all. Just as it may be the case for another person to have great success with perscription meds.

 

I guess the point is to do what works for YOU, and don't give up on finding new options for treatment, there is ALWAYS something else to try, even if it means investigating outside of the "normal avenues" of treatment.

[Hermes]

I agree, RedFox:

 

It is unfair to take this view:

 

This view assumes that doctors who spend an extremely long time studying medicine and the effects of drugs on the body are either lazy, incompetent, or greedy / unethical by being under the thumb of drug companies.

 

H

[sidehop]

BUT- (there is always a but) I grew up in the world where prescription medication of all types were and still are being abused. I understand the addiction part of it, but it would have never happened if the doctors would not have prescribed them.

 

I just wanted people to be aware that there are doctors not all of them, but there are doctors that will see you for 10 minutes and prescribed just about anything you ask for. All of the docs and therapist have done this to me, all except one.

 

The wonderful thing about the internet and the access to it is the wealth of information that's available.

 

And you're right, I was prescribed with Adderall in less than few minutes. It was that easy. I could've practically faked my symptoms and got the most powerful ADD/ADHD medication on the spot. People could easily abuse the system at least in this country. The side effects for me weren't worth it.

 

The more you do research on the effects of prescription drugs a lot of information emerges. Why you don't hear about the serious side effects, it's a simple math. Aside from conventional medicine there are many alternative medicine that has worked for thousands of years. It goes the same way, just because he/she isn't a recognized doctor doesn't mean they can't help you either.

 

All I can say is, keep your ears and eyes open and listen to your body. You are the only person that ultimately know what works and doesn't.

[lavenderdove]

^^

Ah, but that example in itself is a cautionary tale. My ex had psychological problems and went to a psychiatrist. He resisted medical treatment of any kind and spent 8 months talking about doing something rather than doing it.

 

He told the psychiatrist he thought he might have ADD, but the only way to actually see if it was ADD was to precribe Ritalin and see how he responded. If it's ADD, it has a calming effect on the person. If it's not ADD, the person is climbing the wall, but the only way to know is to try the medication. My ex spent 8 months wandering around self diagnosing himself as having ADD and trying to convince the psychiatrist he had it, but he spent ONE DAY on Ritalin and was climbing the walls, so they all knew the problem wasn't ADD immediately. So he went against doctor's advise to try meds for 8 months, and in ONE DAY on Ritalin both he and the doctor immediately knew to rule out ADD.

 

So a prescription from the doctor is sometimes a trial 'challenge' to see how you respond, to help diagnose the problem. If the medication doesn't work, then they can rule certain things out. The psychiatrist was very careful to point out that mental disorders (and solutions to them) are NOT an easy thing, and it is frequently trial and error and challenges that that that determine what the exact biochemical issue is. So a doctor giving you Ritalin 'quickly' may not be a case of him not knowing what he was doing and treating it like candy, but instead of him giving your body a challenge to see if it is indeed ADD or not.

 

The doctor of course expects you to follow up, and your problem if you don't. The patient is remiss if they take the drug and don't return to the doctor and report the results, as all doctors want and why they ask you to check back with them after giving you medication. So if Ritalin was not right for you, the doctor would ask in a follow up, how did you feel? Where you more focused or less focused? Calm or agitated? Then based on what you said, they'd remove you from the drug or not.

 

So just because a doctor prescribes quickly doesn't mean they are prescribing WRONG, if they insist on follow ups etc.

 

Many people will go for one visit with a doctor and if they are not immediately fixed say, the doctor doesn't know what they are talking about or that didn't work and then they just give up and don't go back, which is the absolute WRONG thing to do. You need to work with doctors as a partnership for your health, not decide unilaterally against them if something instantly doesn't work that the doctor is stupid or wrong. Most people err by not following up with the doctor when they are told to do so, such the the doctor can determine whether the treatment is working or right or not. And for many problems there is no quick fix or quick diagnosis, so many different things must be tried before a solution is found.

[sidehop]

The Adderall was by one doctor, the Ritalin/Concerta by was between two doctors and a psychologist. I wouldn't say I'd trust a first doctor who can prescribe such medication so easily, after all he didn't know too much about ADD is how he exactly put it

 

Drugs are drugs no matter how you look at it, it's not a long term solution for many. Right now I take various natural supplements while keeping healthy food intake and regular exercise. It's not just about the medication, a lot of times it's about life change that has to take place everyday. I accepted the fact that the ADD/ADHD tendencies is not something that will ever go away but I can be more aware.

 

But I also don't believe people should just jump to go see a doctor and believe everything he/she has to say. I feel the same way about every information given by my acupuncturist, herbologist and my own doctors. No one knows your own body better than themselves.

[karvala]

I didnt mean to imply that anyone that takes prescribed medicatations is weak, I have been on medicatations for years. Does it help? Not really and I have tried multiple types. Does that say the doctor didnt do his job, No, It just says they havent found the right one for me, or there is no such medication that will help ME.

 

There are two different points here, and I suspect you want to make a different one to the one that you originally described.

 

The first: medications are necessary in some extreme cases or where things are clearly diagnosed as a clinical problem, but other than that, people should tough it out when life throws them a curveball.

 

The second: medications are overprescribed, to the extent that a lot of medications actually are not having any beneficial effect on their recipients beyond placebo.

 

You originally focused on the former, but I wonder if you don't really mean the latter? To my mind, I don't see any merit in unnecessary suffering. Toughing it out when you could feel better with medical help, regardless of the cause of your pain, doesn't make you a better person in my view, it just makes you stubborn or sanctimonious.

 

To give an extreme perspective, I once floated to a pharmaceutical rep the spoof idea of a "breakup pill" designed to numb the pain of breakup. He of course thought it would be a winner (it would certainly be cash cow!), though there's no real way to achieve it on present understanding (hence it was a spoof). If such a pill was available, should people in extreme breakup pain take it? In my view yes, why not? Of course, many people will be horrified by the idea of such a thing, and that's fine, but for me, when I'm in pain, I take a painkiller. I don't feel any the less of a man for it.

[doityourself]

Im just want people to be aware of and interested in the affects and concerns of taking some of these medications. Not only anti depressants but all prescription medication.

 

I think we all have gotten use to going to the doctors and relying on them to "fix" us but in reality the things they do causes more issues than what you had before you came in there.

 

I do believe that doctors overprescribe and under evaluate. Out of the lets say 50 doctors Ive seen 48 of them have prescribe me medication on the first visit after only minutes of talking to me. Now how can you determine whats going to "fix" a person when you have only talk to me for 15 minutes. Not only do they give out meds like its candy but they dont take the time to tell you what the side affects are, what your going to feel. What if I was having a really bad day that day or was really hyper from having coffee.

 

Whatever happened to handling things on your own. I agree with sideshop no medication is going to be a fix all. I also agree that taking them should be on a temporary basis.

 

Most of these medications also have HIGH addiction possiblities, so you fix the current problem but create a HUGE problem in the long run.

[sidehop]

I think people are more aware and with wide variety of resources available people are really weighing their options from medication & their health. That's the way I feel about things we were taught as a child to believe. I just think our body is far more capable and smarter than just relying on medication alone.

[Taikero]

I think it's important to learn about matters of health on your own.

 

We put all this time into learning for our careers, but when it comes to the body most people are clueless, and they wonder why they get sick all the time (and still learn nothing about becoming well on their own). Doctors are expensive and entirely unnecessary except under serious circumstances if you know how to listen to your body and give it what it needs.

 

I personally only get mildly sick once per year, usually around Christmas, and other than that I'm completely fine year round. I haven't seen a doctor in a decade, and haven't had a shot since I was around 9 or 10 (penicillin for strep throat). I've been considering going in to have some blood work done and get checked out just to be safe, but really I feel happy and healthy and don't think it's imperative I go at all.

 

I stay away from all medications, even pain relievers for the most part. I supplement vitamins and minerals I think my body needs based on how I feel and the knowledge I've gained over the years and adjust as my health changes.

 

It may not work for everyone, but for me, I feel it's worked rather well to pursue preventive natural methods for my health.

[karvala]

Im just want people to be aware of and interested in the affects and concerns of taking some of these medications. Not only anti depressants but all prescription medication.

 

Okay, nothing wrong with that.

 

I think we all have gotten use to going to the doctors and relying on them to "fix" us but in reality the things they do causes more issues than what you had before you came in there.

 

They cause more issues than you had before? Really? All of them?

 

I do believe that doctors overprescribe and under evaluate. Out of the lets say 50 doctors Ive seen 48 of them have prescribe me medication on the first visit after only minutes of talking to me. Now how can you determine whats going to "fix" a person when you have only talk to me for 15 minutes. Not only do they give out meds like its candy but they dont take the time to tell you what the side affects are, what your going to feel. What if I was having a really bad day that day or was really hyper from having coffee.

 

So what you want is protection from yourself? That's not what doctors are there for, and as you've correctly identified, they don't have time to do it. If you go to a doctor and present symptoms of a condition, the doctor will treat you for that condition. There is necessarily mutual trust there; you trust that the doctor will do her best, and she trusts that you will provide a full and accurate account of your condition. That's particularly true for conditions for which more hard evidence is difficult to come by, as is the case for many psychiatric conditions including depression.

 

Whatever happened to handling things on your own. I agree with sideshop no medication is going to be a fix all. I also agree that taking them should be on a temporary basis.

 

Taking them should be for as long as, and no longer than, they're needed. You can't decide whether or not something should be temporary without knowing the details of the case. Would you say betaseron for MS sufferers should always be temporary, for example? It's all down to individual circumstances.

 

Most of these medications also have HIGH addiction possiblities, so you fix the current problem but create a HUGE problem in the long run.

 

Most of these medications have HIGH addiction possibilities? Really?! The vast majority of prescribed medications are not chemically addictive. There are some exceptions (e.g. benzodiazepines), and those are generally only prescribed short-term and when no alternative is available. To my knowledge, no currently-prescribed anti-depressant has been demonstrated to be chemically addictive.

[Jake Sully]

Im just wondering what ever happen to the work it out yourself attitude, why is it so easy to recommend medications that have serious side affects to people?

 

Getting a divorce, try meds.

Feeling low, try meds.

 

Not saying that some people dont need meds, but I feel that some could try and resolve these issues without putting themselves into further harm with the possible side affects to some of these meds. Which can be extreme at times. Any thoughts on this?

 

You have not updated your knowledge and your attitude to accept that a revolution has occurred in psychopharmacology which started circa 1990. It seems you are carrying old prejudices about psychiatry when psychiatrists main two alternatives were amphetamines and barbiturates. Both blanket effect the central nervous system and only medicate symptoms.

 

The SSRI revolution with includes drugs like Prozac, Paxil, Luvox, Effexor etc, attempt to fine-tune your neurotransmitter systems to level the playing field between imperfect humans to give them a chance to efftively put a pair of eyeglasses on their minds and emotions and reason for themselves what is positively changing. This is a micro versus macro approach which does not effect the central nervous system directly, does not seek to medicate symptoms but instead find the potential flaw in the neurotransmitter system that casues one to escalate little things into crisises. Meds are not how you male them sound--they are not all the same and the SSRI revolution has help millions of people land on their feet and develop a normal neurotransmitter system which gives them chances to lead normal competitive life styles.

 

There are lots of other meds for differing conditions many of which have nothing to do with emotionality. It is a legal requirement for them to mention all possible side effects and all are presumed to be given in trial dose that may show that the person exhibits signs of those side effects in which case the drug should be discontinued and another approach or formulation started. It is almost unheard of that anyone will suffer the worst case scenarios and suffer damage before they can discontinue the medication.

[Jeen]

drugs provoke neuroethical questions.

 

A Pandora's box full of smart drugs.

These challenges aren't theoretical but real. Cognitive-enhancing drugs, also known as "smart" drugs are already being used to help people with Alzheimer's disease, schizophrenia, attention deficit hyperactivity disorder (ADHD) and brain injury. But is there burgeoning use among university students and others wishing to boost their brain power? It is this that's posing the ethical dilemmas.

 

link removed

[3boys]

Sorry, but I disagree with the notion that most doctors are too quick to prescribe medication. I've seen numerous doctors that are wary of prescribing medication and would be seriously suspicious of one who spoke to me for 10 minutes before prescribing strong medication....other than going for an illness like an infection where the doctor prescribed antibiotics. Maybe I've just been fortunate to see "good" doctors, but all of them have gone over possible side effects when prescribing a "new" (to me) medication and have stressed that I should stop taking it if I didn't feel better or if I experienced any of the side effects. Yes, there are some that are quick to prescribe without educating the patient, but I think those are the ones that are giving the ENTIRE medical profession a bad reputation. Many times, it's not the doctor who's at fault, but the patient.

 

Most recently I went to my PCP for a physical since it's been awhile and I've been having some health issues. He ran a bunch of tests to find the "root" (at least part of it) and prescribed Omega-3 fish oil, niacin, milk thistle, dandelion, and a "change" in diet (not really to stop eating certain foods, but to start eating others). The only prescription I got was for my migraine medicine.

 

I think blaming doctors for someone's addiction to prescription meds is completely ridiculous. I was in group therapy with some addicts and not one of them got ALL of their meds from 1 doctor....most of them either got them illegally or "doctor shopped" for the meds. A couple of them got off the prescriptions and started using illegal drugs or alcohol for the same "high." The fact is that, unless the addict accepts the fact that they are to blame for their addiction, and not the doctors or drug dealers or whomever, they aren't going to be able to overcome their addiction.