DunwichChild Posted September 24, 2009 Share Posted September 24, 2009 oh, why do you encourage me not to? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doyathink Posted September 24, 2009 Share Posted September 24, 2009 The point is....there is a difference in showing a humorous side in an awkward situation....and saying something that boarders vulgarity, and tasteless. Jets 'line' only implied he can take rejection with a silly twist....and not take it personal. I think it all depends on what side of the world you're on too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DunwichChild Posted September 24, 2009 Share Posted September 24, 2009 meh, I don't give a damn anymore, some days I do, but if I cared most days I'd have gashed myself into a river a long time ago....Rise River Rise it's a nice song, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IphigeniaSaysHi Posted September 24, 2009 Share Posted September 24, 2009 Way to disprove my point, dun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke Skywalker Posted September 24, 2009 Share Posted September 24, 2009 It is funny how there is no concrete plan or advice given about this so far. Like there is just no magic bullet. Today, I have been thread hopping to see all the INCEL threads out there (involuntary celibacy), and, boy, I'm really not alone here. What gets me is there is so much of a difference of realities between guys who are successful, who are able to pick up women the same day and go to bed with them seeminly effortlessly, and other guys who can't get a date to save their life, and sometimes I wonder, what is accounting for this huge gulf between the very rich and the very poor. There is a proliferation of threads on here of guys who are complaining that they are past a certain age and haven't had any luck with women that you can see all along here. Then I see other guys say that they have no room in their life for a girlfriend (which is one I identify with as well), and guys who have women show no interest to them (which is one I also identify with as well). It's like, what is wrong with this world? -- should be the question rather than how to achieve the impossible. tomorrow, I'm going to be taking out my fleshlight and allow myself to look at 'clean' porn and thus have an imaginary girlfriend because when reality just sucks, all you have left is your imagination. If a 'real' girl comes along, next time, I hope I'll be attracted to her. The last girl I was not attracted to, but went along anyway just to see a girl interested in me -- a rare luxury in my life. Good luck to the OP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IphigeniaSaysHi Posted September 24, 2009 Share Posted September 24, 2009 The question is always "what is wrong with me". We are responsible for what happens to us socially. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DunwichChild Posted September 24, 2009 Share Posted September 24, 2009 Way to disprove my point, dun. I speak the truth, I don't think I'll ever go out and try to woo ladies again, so that makes me lame. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke Skywalker Posted September 24, 2009 Share Posted September 24, 2009 The question is always "what is wrong with me". We are responsible for what happens to us socially. Here is a thread written in the shy dating section, I would encourage you to read the threads by Gern Bernstein. His posts, and many others on here, can demonstrate that some guys just get all the luck. Like this song says. This owning up or taking responsibility is merely a smokescreen to hide the injustices that are out there as demonstrated in the above thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IphigeniaSaysHi Posted September 24, 2009 Share Posted September 24, 2009 Sure there are injustices in life. For everyone. People have it a lot worse in this life than sparse lays... You can either buck up or wallow and wine. Either way, you have the choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LightbulbSun Posted September 24, 2009 Share Posted September 24, 2009 Sure there are injustices in life. For everyone. People have it a lot worse in this life than sparse lays... You can either buck up or wallow and wine. Either way, you have the choice. Saying you can just 'buck up' and things will change is ridiculous. If you haven't learned the skills necessary to get a girl interested in you, bucking up and saying, "Hey, it's not so bad" will not change your situation. You'll still be the dateless virgin who doesn't have the skills necessary to make a girl interested in you. I don't believe it's about looks anymore. Sure, you can have a better chance with good looks, but if you misread all the signs, looking like Johnny Depp isn't going to change your situation. If you're average looking, though, and actually know what you're doing, you can get someone interested, and get dates. That's why I think us dateless virgins have to figure out what we're doing wrong. Okay, we're shy...strike one. We probably have bad social skills...strike two. There's some reason that's universal for all of us who are incel, that keeps us from getting a girl interested (whereas the confident guy who has lots of experience can have multiple girlfriends, and jump from relationship to relationship, while we struggle to even get a date.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IphigeniaSaysHi Posted September 24, 2009 Share Posted September 24, 2009 I realize it's a very sensitive issue that causes defensive responses. I know. But if you read again, I didn't say it would solve the problem. My point is this: Does crying and kvetching and moaning about it help you get the girl? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LightbulbSun Posted September 24, 2009 Share Posted September 24, 2009 I realize it's a very sensitive issue that causes defensive responses. I know. But if you read again, I didn't say it would solve the problem. My point is this: Does crying and kvetching and moaning about it help you get the girl? No it doesn't. That's why I'm focusing on other things right now: I just got an apartment, I'm making new friends, I've got lots of studies to worry about, and I've been writing new songs for a new demo album. I'm still the lonely, dateless virgin, but I've got more important things to worry about than girls at the moment. I was just making a point that being positive doesn't always lead to a positive change. You'd have to go through a lot of rejection before you got to that goal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IphigeniaSaysHi Posted September 24, 2009 Share Posted September 24, 2009 No it doesn't. That's why I'm focusing on other things right now: I just got an apartment, I'm making new friends, I've got lots of studies to worry about, and I've been writing new songs for a new demo album. I'm still the lonely, dateless virgin, but I've got more important things to worry about than girls at the moment. And because of that, it's more likely you'll find what you're looking for. I know about being negative and complaining about everything; I do it far too often but at the end of the day my life is up to me and positive has to be better than negative. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sweetdslollipop Posted September 24, 2009 Share Posted September 24, 2009 Saying you can just 'buck up' and things will change is ridiculous. If you haven't learned the skills necessary to get a girl interested in you, bucking up and saying, "Hey, it's not so bad" will not change your situation. You'll still be the dateless virgin who doesn't have the skills necessary to make a girl interested in you. I don't believe it's about looks anymore. Sure, you can have a better chance with good looks, but if you misread all the signs, looking like Johnny Depp isn't going to change your situation. If you're average looking, though, and actually know what you're doing, you can get someone interested, and get dates. Why not learn the skills then? Apply this problem to every other problem you encounter in life. Well atleast you got one thing right ...some people don't care about looks. Good job. You're on your way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LightbulbSun Posted September 24, 2009 Share Posted September 24, 2009 Why not learn the skills then? Apply this problem to every other problem you encounter in life. Well atleast you got one thing right ...some people don't care about looks. Good job. You're on your way. The only way I'd do that is either by observing guys who are good with girls, and figuring out what I'm doing wrong, or out and out asking the guys how they're good with girls and to teach me those skills. I think I'd be too embarrassed to admit that I'm a 27 year old virgin who has never been on a date in RL, so option 2 is out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sweetdslollipop Posted September 24, 2009 Share Posted September 24, 2009 You don't have to tell them that. Just tell them you need help with girls. Stop making things difficult. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke Skywalker Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 You can either buck up or wallow and wine. Either way, you have the choice. I wallowed and wined a few years ago and got a few women interested in giving me a pity-lay just to shut me up a few years ago, but I refused it because I think they sleep with lots of guys and might have an STD so I decided from that day I'm not a true incel. But today I still think I'm incel because, I don't have multiple gfs or can jump from relationship to relationship, etc... There is no real choice which is the "involuntary" in "involuntary celibacy". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke Skywalker Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 The only way I'd do that is either by observing guys who are good with girls, and figuring out what I'm doing wrong, or out and out asking the guys how they're good with girls and to teach me those skills. The problem, that I have noticed is it's not just skills, it's also a different reality experience that these other guys have. To illustrate what I'm saying. You can do and say the exact same things these other guys do, but may get dramatically different results. For example, last Sunday at church, I wanted to shake someone's hands, but the way it was done was like I was literally begging her to be nice with me and recirpocate and a simple interaction like that was a disaster. (i.e I held out my hand at the end of service, after a few seconds it appeared to click I was there and she reluctantly or hestiantly shook my hand). You would think, with the 'confidence' or negative-looped reality issues that comes from the idea that women are doing me a favour to even be civil with me, that even if you learned some skill, that this would change who you are when you actually start interacting with some woman? Another guy may see nothing, in another environment like a club or something, and pick up a woman to date her and have sex the same day. Different realities. I think there is a 'reality' experience problem that causes the problem with confidence than a skills experience. If ladies out there appeared to be receptive or interested, then you would easily learn skills and be less shy, whatever. These other guys probably don't think they are mosquitoe pests when they approach or deal with women -- but you'd probably think that way even if you applied the techniques as it's programmed into your mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr_styles Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 I've got a good workmate who is pretty social. From what I've seen he's not a player (doesn't always approach girls, and he does have a girlfriend) but he does seem to be that guy everyone has no issues talking to, no issues saying Hi to. So you know how in a general sense women have the upper hand by just waiting for chances, he's seems to have that sort of advantage too where people will start everything whether it be a guy or girl wanting to make a new mate, or an interested girl. And this is before he even opens his mouth to any real extent. A lot of the improvements to my shyness has been through observing him. And I get a pretty similar effect Luke Skywalker described above. He can say "Hi how are you?" most of the time it's a nice cheery response sometimes another standard question from her. I do it, it's like they don't want to say anything. I suppose like everything else I've been saying in all the various threads "I don't get it". And yeah it really annoys me, I'm guessing it annoys Corv as much too, probably all you other guys like silent, Gern, etc. Everyone's flawed with things that reduces/changes your dating chances. For me it's being asian (changes the demographics and numbers odds), and that I'm not as outgoing as other people. I'm not into sorta social clubs, nor the Gen-Y nightlife sort either. But pretty much contradicting all those "no confidence" posts, at the back of my mind I know I've got enough, out of the house enough, etc. to get a date. Maybe not a ladies man but certainly not the dateless guy I am today. So you talk about skills - it's like the only skill I need to learn is to be a player (kinda). Or maybe that's just that little bit of foolish pride screaming again Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IphigeniaSaysHi Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 I will admit I try hard not to read threads like these because honestly the dateless male situation is a huge mess. I have sypmathies but mostly frustrations. You cannot say anything helpful to the members experiencing this because they're always defensive, angry, bitter and have a solid x,y,z plus a graph reason for why every point you make is wrong. People give up. I don't blame them. I've tried and I wish all of you the best but logically, if you stay frustrated and put up a shield, or go even as far as expressing hatred outwardly how do you expect someone to lay you? You're smart people, I'd say. When I hear things like "I need to learn to be a player" I just facepalm. Good luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke Skywalker Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 People give up. I don't blame them. I've tried and I wish all of you the best but logically, if you stay frustrated and put up a shield, or go even as far as expressing hatred outwardly how do you expect someone to lay you? As I have said, and will maintain before, I had a profile up on AFF in November 2006 for one month and had a major pity-party on a profile and I could of meet with up to four people on that site out of that. In fact I cancelled on one of them. Getting an eventual pity-lay on an adult site would have worked if I wanted to hook-up with a random chick bad enough to risk getting STDs. However, people on here don't want just pity-lays, they want relationships. One of the most gratifying experiences about that potential pity-lay hook-up was a girl was prepared to meet me didn't care how I actually looked at and wasn't superficial that way. Other people just like the way I expressed myself. So, your challenge was answered point-blanc. I brought up statement from another thread from another person and that was not addressed. People just like to pigeonhole people who have a problem they don't understand and say this or that and don't have a concept of what is really going on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IphigeniaSaysHi Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 There is just so much blame, generally. Women are blamed, parents are blamed, society is blamed... at what point do you guys shift the power to yourself? We are all given certain tools, individually unique and it's our job to use those to fill in the gaps where we are shorthanded. I get the sense that some of you really believe the world owes you the success you want in life. Whether it's women, money, power, sex, etc... the world doesn't owe any of us these things. Nowhere does it say we're all going to get what we want just because most people have it. There are a lot of things I want, trust me I have felt desperation but it does me no good to be angry and start to hate the thing I want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr_styles Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 Nowhere does it say we're all going to get what we want just because most people have it. There are a lot of things I want, trust me I have felt desperation but it does me no good to be angry and start to hate the thing I want. Just taking all the "dateless men" on eNA (since these are the people/numbers you can see), only some, definitely not many are angry at women. Frustrated for sure. This is equivalent to the guy who works hard at his job over and over again, but never gets recognised or rewarded for it. Anyone would be annoyed at that even though they aren't "owed" anything. Someone who has the rest of their life going pretty well may not be owed a relationship, but there's almost no reason why they're having none at all. "I just don't know what to do any more. What else is there left to try?" doesn't sound angry at all, just completely disillusioned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LightbulbSun Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 You don't have to tell them that. Just tell them you need help with girls. Stop making things difficult. Fair enough. Right now, I haven't made any friends with other guys yet. I have a few new female friends, but I'm not attracted to them so there's no chance of me developing a crush. The only male friend I currently have that I keep in contact with (best friend in high school) is also just as clueless with women as I am, and is a year younger and has never had a girlfriend. So I'm not in the best situation for that right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LightbulbSun Posted September 25, 2009 Share Posted September 25, 2009 Just taking all the "dateless men" on eNA (since these are the people/numbers you can see), only some, definitely not many are angry at women. Frustrated for sure. This is equivalent to the guy who works hard at his job over and over again, but never gets recognised or rewarded for it. Anyone would be annoyed at that even though they aren't "owed" anything. Someone who has the rest of their life going pretty well may not be owed a relationship, but there's almost no reason why they're having none at all. "I just don't know what to do any more. What else is there left to try?" doesn't sound angry at all, just completely disillusioned. Yeah, I'm definitely not angry at women. I think they're beautiful, and I love women. I just don't seem to have any luck with them in the love department for some reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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