icarus27 Posted August 25, 2009 Author Share Posted August 25, 2009 I know plenty of women of color who find men of color only attracted to white women very frustrating and hypocritical. Ms Darcy Although this post tips my thread into talking about race (again ), I think you’re right to point out the principle is frustrating and hypocritical, but I feel you have really got a mirror-image picture from what I have. In my experiences, it is Asian women who’re applying double standards to men of colour and men who’re white. The few Asian women who make it big in high-profile professions (the law, civil service, medicine etc) – and ironically, the ones I have most in common with, as I’m a professional and worked in corporations all my life) are also typically the ones who will choose to be with a white man as it cements their status as someone who’s ‘arrived’. Of course, they may dress it up as “true love” and no doubt love plays a part .... but more than once I have had the distinct sense that the same date-ideas that I am telling an Asian woman about would be met with 10 times more enthusiasm if I was white. I kid you not, I have taken women on sporty, imaginative, out-of-the-box dates that not everyone thinks of – and then find them later saying they are happy with a white guy who loves to watch football on TV and drink beer all day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grymoire Posted August 25, 2009 Share Posted August 25, 2009 I kid you not, I have taken women on sporty, imaginative, out-of-the-box dates that not everyone thinks of – and then find them later saying they are happy with a white guy who loves to watch football on TV and drink beer all day. Unfortunately that's the reality my friend. I know exactly how you feel because I have had the same thing happen in my life too. The Asian woman that I liked so much fell in love with a white man and got married to him. Another girl that is half-asian adores me and likes me a lot but she will only date white men. We can talk about personality and confidence here in ENA but in reality they don't matter as much as looks and skin color. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icarus27 Posted August 25, 2009 Author Share Posted August 25, 2009 Sorry to hear of that, grymoire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shudder Posted August 27, 2009 Share Posted August 27, 2009 i see lots of frustration towards asian women right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ms Darcy Posted August 29, 2009 Share Posted August 29, 2009 So sorry for not replying to this sooner! All I have to say is that there is a lot of truth in what you say here ... absolutely. Some, not all, people from minority groups grow up receiving the sub-conscious and conscious messages that certain groups are better and that plays a role in their dating habits. It is a tough truth to swallow. What's the most difficult, I think, is recognizing that bias within ourselves if it exists. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
remmie111 Posted September 4, 2009 Share Posted September 4, 2009 Please read my post!!!! "Internet dating is driving me crazy". I dont think what you see is true. Yes I get mobbed but not by all quality men. Most are pervs looking to hook up. And the man I like right now is busy buffing up his profile to attract other women while he dates me. I am sick of it. I think it is just the mentality of the type of people on these sites. I have learned it is not for me and I intend to get off when my subscription expires. Most men I meet had their last long term relationships with women on these sites, so it feels weird that I might be another piece of "candy" in the store. I am beginning to really hate dating, I dont think it is for me! But what to do??? Let me know if you come up with an answer! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waveseer Posted September 4, 2009 Share Posted September 4, 2009 The real answer is to discover what you like to do, do it, and meet someone else who likes to do that thing too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ammy Posted September 4, 2009 Share Posted September 4, 2009 I have been using online dating for about 3 years on and off and as a woman I can tell you I haven't had an easy run either. I have met about 15 guys in that time. About 3 of which I wasn't interested in after the first meet. About 8 who I was ambivalent about, a few proceeded to 2nd dates but no further - usually because they didn't call me again. And then the special 4 who I liked and either dated me a few times and then screwed me around (ie. told me how much they liked me, but then suddenly withdrew with NO reason) or just weren't interested full stop. I am only now at the 5th date / possibly exclusivity mark with someone... So yes I do get a lot of interest but agree with some previous posters its not about quantity - its about quality. Most of the interest I get is from people looking for hook ups, or people who are just not at all what Im looking for (ie. different values, goals in life, extremely unattractive to me, arrogant and rude, boring etc.) So women have it just as tough I'm afraid. Online dating is a fickle world. Ammy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atlanticstar Posted September 4, 2009 Share Posted September 4, 2009 ... its not about quantity - its about quality. Couldn't agree more. Most of the interest I get is from people looking for hook ups, or people who are just not at all what Im looking for (ie. different values, goals in life, extremely unattractive to me, arrogant and rude, boring etc.) That is why I as a guy I won't use these ways to meet people. I'm sure there are some great people buried in amongst the 'timewasters and liars', I just wouldn't have the patience to wade through them all. Reassuring to see your opinions mirror my own and these problems are also visible from a female perspective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BriarRose Posted September 4, 2009 Share Posted September 4, 2009 I have done on-line dating off and on for a few years. As you can see I am still single. Now, I realize some people have met an SO using this medium, but I never did, and probably will not go on-line to meet people in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icarus27 Posted September 5, 2009 Author Share Posted September 5, 2009 So sorry for not replying to this sooner! All I have to say is that there is a lot of truth in what you say here ... absolutely. Some, not all, people from minority groups grow up receiving the sub-conscious and conscious messages that certain groups are better and that plays a role in their dating habits. It is a tough truth to swallow. What's the most difficult, I think, is recognizing that bias within ourselves if it exists. As Grymoire commented, we don't start out on the dating scene with a bag full of cynicism. But the experiences I have had with Asian women are just something else in terms of nonsense. It's not so easy to explain to a non-Asian, but I'll put my finger on just three of the themes that recur: (i) massive over-expectations and pre-conditions. The man has to be the right height, the right job, the right family, the right location, before the woman even considers a date. And when on the date, she expects a just-add-water-voila-instant-relationship, or even worse, instant-loving-feeling or instant-marriage. (ii) absolutely no ability to understand the term 'equal partners'. 'Princess' mentality, "if-he-cares,-he'll-do-anything-for-me" (iii) very often, a past littered with either no relationship experience or half-baked flings. The ones with no experience think they have been saving themselves for the One. The ones with flings have a habit of involving themselves with men for all the wrong reasons e.g. they work together / he's white and has a cute butt. Is it any wonder that I get turned off them? Please read my post!!!! "Internet dating is driving me crazy". I dont think what you see is true. Yes I get mobbed but not by all quality men. Most are pervs looking to hook up. And the man I like right now is busy buffing up his profile to attract other women while he dates me. I am sick of it. I think it is just the mentality of the type of people on these sites. I have learned it is not for me and I intend to get off when my subscription expires. Most men I meet had their last long term relationships with women on these sites, so it feels weird that I might be another piece of "candy" in the store. I am beginning to really hate dating, I dont think it is for me! But what to do??? Let me know if you come up with an answer! I have done on-line dating off and on for a few years. As you can see I am still single. Now, I realize some people have met an SO using this medium, but I never did, and probably will not go on-line to meet people in the future. My thoughts, up there in bold. This is an unwinnable game. Yet time again over the last couple of years, I've taken time out and got back on the horse because I kept thinking I should give it another shot. I have got to a stage where common human self-respect tells me that these are people I have to get away from. Couldn't agree more. That is why I as a guy I won't use these ways to meet people. I'm sure there are some great people buried in amongst the 'timewasters and liars', I just wouldn't have the patience to wade through them all. Reassuring to see your opinions mirror my own and these problems are also visible from a female perspective. The real answer is to discover what you like to do, do it, and meet someone else who likes to do that thing too. Waveseer, a useful catch-all answer, but like many men I have been there. Seriously, its not that simple. I try to live a balance between having a lifestyle where I enjoy and get out and about, and have opportunities to meet others .... on some level it is soul-destroying to watch women stumble out of break-ups, slap some make-up on and instantly pick up some geezer at a bar -- but that's another rant .. I have been using online dating for about 3 years on and off and as a woman I can tell you I haven't had an easy run either. I have met about 15 guys in that time. About 3 of which I wasn't interested in after the first meet. About 8 who I was ambivalent about, a few proceeded to 2nd dates but no further - usually because they didn't call me again. And then the special 4 who I liked and either dated me a few times and then screwed me around (ie. told me how much they liked me, but then suddenly withdrew with NO reason) or just weren't interested full stop. I am only now at the 5th date / possibly exclusivity mark with someone... So yes I do get a lot of interest but agree with some previous posters its not about quantity - its about quality. Most of the interest I get is from people looking for hook ups, or people who are just not at all what Im looking for (ie. different values, goals in life, extremely unattractive to me, arrogant and rude, boring etc.) So women have it just as tough I'm afraid. Online dating is a fickle world. Ammy Back to talking about online dating ... which is worse, having hopes raised with one person after another ... or to never even have your first contact returned? To many men, it would be a goddamn luxury to be able to turn down women they deem unsuitable. It happens so rarely to me (one happened last week) I actually take extra care to try not to hurt their feelings. Then later on, I laugh at what a silly boy scout I am - Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BriarRose Posted September 5, 2009 Share Posted September 5, 2009 My thoughts, up there in bold. This is an unwinnable game. Yet time again over the last couple of years, I've taken time out and got back on the horse because I kept thinking I should give it another shot. I have got to a stage where common human self-respect tells me that these are people I have to get away from... I agree. I sometimes "get back on the horse", too, and sign up again because I don't meet singles my age anywhere (I am in my 40's), and I can say I have met only a handful of "quality" men out of dozens I have corresponded with. I ended up seriously dating two of them, and both ended badly, with one leaving me for another woman and the other just dropping off the face of the earth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icarus27 Posted September 5, 2009 Author Share Posted September 5, 2009 Misskitty, Several times by now on eNA, I've found the experiences I've had mirror those of women a little more mature than me. Just as some women have the terrible experience of being left for a younger model, or being played by men who constantly think there is someone "better" out there, I have the misfortune of meeting women who constantly think they can do better ... and to be honest, probably live in a perpetual state of disappointment their whole lives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BriarRose Posted September 5, 2009 Share Posted September 5, 2009 Misskitty, Several times by now on eNA, I've found the experiences I've had mirror those of women a little more mature than me. Just as some women have the terrible experience of being left for a younger model, or being played by men who constantly think there is someone "better" out there, I have the misfortune of meeting women who constantly think they can do better ... and to be honest, probably live in a perpetual state of disappointment their whole lives. .. I understand and agree. And you are probably thinking I am one of those women. But I'm not. I am not perfect, nor am I looking for perfect. But we still have certain things we are not willing to deal with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icarus27 Posted September 6, 2009 Author Share Posted September 6, 2009 Oh no, I didn't think you're 'one of those women' in a negative way! I haven't followed all the threads you started so don't know the backstory .. was only saying that when it comes to online dating the kind of churlish behaviour I get from women is the same as what 30-50 yr old women get from men. It is a shame when I consider that at 30-50, women are actually truly coming into their own and becoming real people - as opposed to the insecure self-obsessed p***ks many seem to be between 20-30. There is a general comment that can be made about age groups I think here .. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BriarRose Posted September 6, 2009 Share Posted September 6, 2009 Oh no, I didn't think you're 'one of those women' in a negative way! I haven't followed all the threads you started so don't know the backstory .. was only saying that when it comes to online dating the kind of churlish behaviour I get from women is the same as what 30-50 yr old women get from men. It is a shame when I consider that at 30-50, women are actually truly coming into their own and becoming real people - as opposed to the insecure self-obsessed p***ks many seem to be between 20-30. There is a general comment that can be made about age groups I think here .. .. No, I do understand...I agree. Don't you also find a bit of geographical difference, too, in what people are looking for? I find here in South Florida, men are looking for more hookups and aren't interested in me, whereas for example, midwest guys seem to find more appeal in me. I think if I didn't live here I would be in a relationship, lol! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icarus27 Posted September 6, 2009 Author Share Posted September 6, 2009 In a country as big as the US, I can well imagine there can be regional differences. And if you live in a party sunshine state, .. I've moved not so long ago from one part of the UK to another. And one of the primary reasons was I got sick of the attitudes in the region I lived in ... then again, in my case, the racial / 'foreign' dimension comes into the mix. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plastic_Monkey Posted September 6, 2009 Share Posted September 6, 2009 Going back to the original post: I recently tried link removed and okcupid for the first time. Since I tend to analyze things really carefully before acting (it's part of being an introvert,) I did a lot of reading on what people's experiences were before jumping in. When I did finally try it out, I had low expectations and pretty much thought of it as a learning experience. Okcupid was kind of a bust. It seemed like people on there wanted to pretend they weren't looking, and there was a definite "I'm just here to take these quizzes, so do NOT bother me" vibe going on, so I canceled that membership. I think much of that has to do with the fact that it's a free site. link removed was a better experience. I was active over about six weeks on that site. I went out on two dates (if you want to call them dates,) with two really great women, but I'm pretty sure that nothing will develop with either of them, although I've become sort of a pen pal with one. My guess is that they're busy sorting through all the responses they're still getting and all the guys they've met, and that's fine. Overall, the whole thing was something to do, a cure for boredom (it worked,) and a learning experience, and on that level, it worked pretty well. I've figured out, though, that online dating simply doesn't work for me. It probably works for many others, maybe even most people, but I think the structure and process is all wrong for my personality type. Like others have said, it's a numbers game. It is up to the men to pursue the women and the women to sort through the men contacting them. I think if you know that going in and are prepared for rejection (and sometimes insults with those rejections!) you're less likely to be disappointed. Advice I read beforehand said that men should "cast the net wide," and I'm really not much of a wide-net-kinda-casting person, which is one of the reasons I think online dating doesn't work for me. Another thing that didn't work for me was the fact that I wanted to exchange a lot of email before meeting, and most online daters want to meet immediately after one or two sentences. I guess I really like to get to know people slowly, and I really enjoy email exchanges, though I was definitely in the minority. I thought it was ironic that people were using a text-based form of meeting people (the internet,) but were unwilling to use a text-based form of communication. It seems like women on dating sites want to meet immediately, size you up as a potential husband, then dismiss you and never see you again if you're not one. There is nothing in between those two extremes, such as friendship. So yeah, interesting experience overall, but just not for me, I guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
notsogood Posted September 6, 2009 Share Posted September 6, 2009 Online dating is catered towards photogenic crowd. It's true. Sure maybe the person in real life looks worse than in his profile pic but he would still get the date because of that pic. You should use dating sites as a supplement to real life finding women/men because that's all it is. Who cares what happens it's just another way. Like if you go to a tennis club with people do you get crushed if you don't meet single ladies there? Nope. Same thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BriarRose Posted September 6, 2009 Share Posted September 6, 2009 I think men are under the impression that women are just bombarded with emails from dozens of men an hour on these sites and it just isn't true. I mean, maybe if she is super-hot, but for us who are more average types, it's just not true. I don't think a man should be intimidated by a site for fear that he will be lost in a sea of men grasping for a handful of women. It's just not true. Many women are on-line and have a hard time, too. I agree with Notsogood, that on-line dating should only be a "supplement" to other venues for meeting people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mario_Basler Posted September 7, 2009 Share Posted September 7, 2009 I was watching TV the other day and an advert came on 'ATTENTION MEN, THERE ARE TOO MANY WOMEN ON link removed!'. Oh really, what is now then only 1800 men from every women? Sign up you saps. I would sooner put a razor blade to my ball sack and eliminate myself from this elaborate and ultimately superficial face to replicate the genetic virus than to participate in this virtual dating rouse. I can't believe some men waste their time and money on this egoist carnivalle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icarus27 Posted September 7, 2009 Author Share Posted September 7, 2009 Another thing that didn't work for me was the fact that I wanted to exchange a lot of email before meeting, and most online daters want to meet immediately after one or two sentences. I guess I really like to get to know people slowly, and I really enjoy email exchanges, though I was definitely in the minority. I thought it was ironic that people were using a text-based form of meeting people (the internet,) but were unwilling to use a text-based form of communication. It seems like women on dating sites want to meet immediately, size you up as a potential husband, then dismiss you and never see you again if you're not one. There is nothing in between those two extremes, such as friendship. Oh yeah, one of my pet peeves too. Women who have an overflowing inbox quickly develop a mentality where it is more important to reduce the size of the shortlist, than to understand the human being she is having coffee with. So, the most flippant of reasons (he wore the wrong socks, he called too often, he didn't call as often as is expected) become cited as the reason for running with some other guy. I don't for the life of me know if women have to put up with such nonsense from men. I think men are under the impression that women are just bombarded with emails from dozens of men an hour on these sites and it just isn't true. I mean, maybe if she is super-hot, but for us who are more average types, it's just not true. I don't think a man should be intimidated by a site for fear that he will be lost in a sea of men grasping for a handful of women. It's just not true. Many women are on-line and have a hard time, too. This is exactly what I fear, Misskitty. Last night, I checked in on match after some time. The first thing that surprised me was that some of the conventionally hot women I had seen a month ago were still on, and active within 1 day - 3 days i.e. still looking. So OK, maybe things do not always go fantastic for them. Then, I (ashamed to admit this ) - took a look at some of the men's profiles in my area. And maybe I shouldn't admit it, but I nearly threw my hands up in the air in despair. The first 5 profiles at random I looked at were all guys 6 feet tall, and the 6th was not only 6 feet tall, he was a triathlete in his spare time. Why the f*** do I bother, huh? I cannot explain just how dispiriting that was. I was watching TV the other day and an advert came on 'ATTENTION MEN, THERE ARE TOO MANY WOMEN ON link removed!'. Oh really, what is now then only 1800 men from every women? Sign up you saps. I've seen the same ad. It makes me want to throw something at the TV each time. This is an aside, but with my business hat on for a minute, I wonder how an operation like the big name dating sites take this much money from individuals, with no published success rates, no statistics, no transparency. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plastic_Monkey Posted September 7, 2009 Share Posted September 7, 2009 This is an aside, but with my business hat on for a minute, I wonder how an operation like the big name dating sites take this much money from individuals, with no published success rates, no statistics, no transparency. There are a few statistics: link removed is 60% male and 40% female, so there's already a 3:2 male/female imbalance. Eharmony supposedly reverses that ratio. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BriarRose Posted September 7, 2009 Share Posted September 7, 2009 There are a few statistics: link removed is 60% male and 40% female, so there's already a 3:2 male/female imbalance. Eharmony supposedly reverses that ratio.. and STILL I strike out, lol! I should move to Alaska...I hear the rate of men to women is like 6:1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plastic_Monkey Posted September 8, 2009 Share Posted September 8, 2009 .. and STILL I strike out, lol! I should move to Alaska...I hear the rate of men to women is like 6:1. From what I've heard, "when the odds are good, the goods are odd!" so don't move to Alaska just yet! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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