I know this sounds stupid...

[1guygirl]

my only point is that while you might not like what is in fashion, you're giong to be going to PTA meetings, and places with the child that people ARE going to judge you being that you're the mother of an infant.

 

Fitting in there isn't you "not being you" - it's simply you doing right by the child.

 

 

im sure shes not gunna turn up in a pvc fetish get up - ive been goth before and have looked remarkably classy compared to alot of people. infact when i go to court over my daughter, people thimk IM the solicitor. please dont judge all goths, and its important in this world we are allowed to be who we are through our clothes without predjudice - wether a mother or not. i understand if its a case of a lorra lorra flesh on show, but i dont think thats what you meant, i take it you meant just being a goth ??

[IphigeniaSaysHi]

This is entirely an age-gap relationship problem. You are still experimenting, having fun with your appearance, and not really wanting to fit any certain mold. It's hard to say if you'll dress a certain way when you're older. People change.

 

He, however, feels the pressure to fit into the nuclear family scenario. For him to say he has no respect for women who show cleavage kiiind of means he has no respect for you. You showed cleavage when you met him, so did he feel that way then??

 

You just need to get on the same page, but the age factor might ruin it.

 

I am a chesty girl and it's nearly impossible to not show any cleavage: they're there, you're going to see them. Deal with it. haha!

[TheSmilingTurnip]

link removed ...this is the most gorgeous dress EVER in my opinion... but I don't think I'll

 

ever get to wear it.

 

Hi - so to what occasion or when would you wear that dress...that is a lot of cleavage.

[Excalibur]

Using the first line in your original post - I think you have the problem on display. He's 39, you're 21, and you made a child very early into your dating relationship. Maybe an oopsie - maybe not.

 

But you made the child together before you knew one another as individuals. You wouldn't have had a way to know that he'd view his association with you difference post-birth, if you didn't spend alot of time in unrehearsed interaction with one another, having conversations.

 

So you're getting to know one another's standards, values, beliefs, priorities and goals - as you go - while having the obligation of parenthood.

 

Parenthood often splits up couples more established as a couple than people who create a child early on. what you want as a life "for your child' is often vastly different than what you wnted for yourself while in couplehood or in singlehood.

 

I believe you are experiencing an age gap issue, in that he's now had a baby with a 21 year old...which doesn't mke him look very mature or responsible. And your appearance might or mightnot be exacerbating the negative reflection on him - at least as he views it.

 

You're also experiencing something very common in relationships where the people don't know one another well, and make babies. A changed set of priorities and expectations, as a result of parenthood - that was never discussed or expected on either side - since there was not alot of time to know one another before becoming joint parents.

[thejigsup]

Men view you one way before you become the mother of their children and another way after that happens. Compromise is the key here. My bf love me to wear a certain perfume. I'm not crazy about it at all! He hates my absolute favorite perfume. Rather than have this lead to bigger problems, I wear the perfume he loves some of the time and the perfumes I love the rest of the time. We each get what we want, some of the time.

[TheSmilingTurnip]

I think that, like many things, this is an area where there has to be some compromise. This part of your identity is obviously important to you and one person cannot have executive veto power in a relationship all the time. Otherwise, you have the situation in which you now find yourself - with a growing resentment.

 

He doesn't like clothes that show a lot of cleavage. You do. I'm sure you dress differently for different occasions, right? Why not tell him that while you are fine with showing a little less cleavage, you are not fine with completely covering yourself? Then choose clothes that are a good compromise between the two positions. Is that something that you could see working for you two?

 

If you all have not been together that long, this is a skill you should start honing now. I'm sure you don't really want to raise your child alone, if he is a good father and you two otherwise get on well together.

 

Is there some way that you could resolve this where each person gets some of what they want?

 

I don't think he should control what you wear...but I think that if you love him, try to find some common ground. Do not just give in, but don't be foolish either. He doesn't just get to have his way just because that's what he wants. Know what I mean?

 

Clothing is not really a good reason to start a potentially relationship-ending conflict, especially when you have a child together. As a responsible adult, you've got to pick your battles and fight them with that in mind.

 

This bit about him not respecting women who show off their assets or whatever...well you are not them. You are an individual and I recommend that you remind him that other people are not involved in this conversation. Let's just keep it about you and him, who are the only people involved in this.

[Lana0120]

Next time he tells me he's not comfortable with something I'm wearing, then I might just try to make another comprimise.

I don't think it'll be easy because I was out with him for a meal, he had a winge about the top I was wearing so I had my lunch with my coat on... when I thought he would have had the decency to say, look, this is rediculous.. just take your coat off. Never happened.

 

No, don't make another compromise. He knew how he dressed when he met you - it's a part of your identity. If the way you dress is more about his worries about someone else stealing you away from him, be firm: you like how you dress and you love him, you're committed and not going anywhere. He should accept you for who and what you are.

[disowned_angel]

Thankyou people.

You know I don't normally wear really revealing clothes when I'm out during the day. Just occasionally. And the last one resulted in me never wearing that top again. Sometimes it can't be helped, I naturally have a big bust, I've been a 32DD since I was 15. Now that I've had a baby I'm an E. But he says that's part of the reason he wants me to stay covered.

 

He had another dig about it last night as well. Made a comment on how I'm parading my boobs around in public for other men to see, and that it must be what I'm doing or why else would I wear low cut tops?

 

This and one other argument is probably the only difficulty with this relationship, the fact that I have a low sex drive, but I won't go into that. It came up because he said that how can I not have a sex drive when I dress for sex appeal?

Please ladies, back me up here, it's for self confidance!

 

Just wanna point out so you have a clearer picture, we were best friends for about a year and a half before getting into a relationship.

[BeStrongBeHappy]

He obviously is fascinated with your chest, and is afraid someone else will be.

 

He is probably looking at it like he doesn't understand why you want to shop yourself around sexually (even if that is not your intention), and resents your wanting to show you sexual side off to others while not wanting to show off for HIM. he's not seeing it as a quest for attention, he is seeing it as an attempt to attract a new sex partner.

 

I would first address your low sex drive problems with him. See if you can spice it up a bit and return to a normal sex life so he is less worried about you wanting to go find someone else. He's afraid if you're not giving him any, then perhaps you want to go out and look for another man and will leave him when you attract one.

[Darkness_Falls]

This is definitely his insecurity problem and should not be made to be your problem as well. YOU are having to compromise your identity for HIS insecurity. That is not fair at all. I am a goth as well and I wear corsets and tops which make my chest stand out for the world to see. I do not wear them to intentionally do this, I love the style and I love the way a corset makes my waist look, takes away all my lumpy bits! I have a big chest and it isn't exactly easy to hide. My man has no problem with what I wear. I could never be with anyone who did have a problem with it and I certainly wouldn't listen to them.

 

When I am a mother I shall dress the same as I already do. If I am going to PTA meetings and other parents are negatively judging me then so be it. It is their narrowminded problem if they want to be that way. I have tattoos and plan to get them all down my arms. I proudly have them on display when I am not at work. Will I get judged when I become a parent? More than likely! But that's up to other people, whether they judge me badly on my body and clothes. They probably don't have enough to keep them amused in their own life if all they can do is complain about what another person is wearing.

 

Now for my advice to you, SHOW YOUR MAN THIS THREAD. It will show him what other people's advice has been. And sure, he can turn around and say that he won't listen to other people's views on the matter but it is better than doing nothing or just doing what you have done before. All I can say is never let another person control what you do or what you wear. It is YOUR identity and if they can't accept it then that is THEIR problem.

 

I really feel for you. It sounds like your man is acting more like your dad, like he can control his "daughter". But you are his girl, not his daughter, and he needs to respect that.

[disowned_angel]

Thank you, it's great to see somebody feels the same way!

I've got so sick of the sex problem as well so I'm going to see a therapist to talk about it, I'm sure it's a post-natal thing and if he winges about it once more I will scream!

 

It's good to know that someone on here is also a goth and understands that the corsets and dresses are an identity, confidence and beauty thing, not a "come and get it boys" thing.

 

I finally feel understood, to get here I had to have someone labeling me as a freak and a bad mother for being a goth, which I found very offensive by the way. You don't know me and you've never even seen me or what I normally wear. For your information I have already been places with mothers and children and they're very friendly towards me and Jade, the other children loved being around her, so stop assuming I go to nurserys with her dressed like alice cooper!

[Excalibur]

Everything that everybody wears is their version of their "definition" in that regard.

 

Being goth is no different than the girls that wear the daisy dukes and low cut t-shirts, and it's no different than those that wear conservative clothes.

 

It's a statement to the world of our "inner" self. It's rarely that we dress to get people to like us - it's more that we dress to who we are, so that we can determine if people might be our type by how they respond to us as we present ourselves.

[TheSmilingTurnip]

I do not like how he is talking to you about this. It's not acceptable. I think that needs to change first. You don't need to be shamed into changing your apparel. That is not appropriate; you are a grown-up.

 

It is one thing to be adultlike and respectful when you have an objection about something your mate is doing, but it is quite another when you talk to her with an accusation in your voice and as though she is a low-life just because you don't like what she is wearing.

[Enigmatika]

Remind him you dont live in Iran.

^^^ That cracked me up...LOL

 

Those dresses are HOT...but...no where to wear them around here.

 

You are sporting an E chest? sounds painful to me...I have no such luck..*sigh*

 

Made a comment on how I'm parading my boobs around in public for other men to see, and that it must be what I'm doing or why else would I wear low cut tops?

 

This and one other argument is probably the only difficulty with this relationship, the fact that I have a low sex drive, but I won't go into that. It came up because he said that how can I not have a sex drive when I dress for sex appeal?

You sort of have to see his point though....

 

When you are *shining the light* on your hooters, men are going to drool. It's natural. I'll be straight with you....a girl with a HUGE rack...and then deliberately exposing the already Clearly Obvious....makes you want to go ...Hmmmmmm

 

What is the Purpose of it? Beauty? No. We KNOW you have a Rack. Impossible to hide that.

Not ALL Goth clothing is designed to barely cover the nipples...

link removed

[disowned_angel]

The clothes I wear don't "just" cover my nipples, they just show a bit of bust. The reason I dress like that is because I like the clothes, to me it has nothing to do with men or sex appeal.

[Lana0120]

I think you just have to stick to your guns and dress how you want to.

[Enigmatika]

they just show a bit of bust

Ok....but He doesn't see it that way.

*shrug*

 

You might want to choose a different battle then...?

Made a comment on how I'm parading my boobs around in public for other men to see, and that it must be what I'm doing or why else would I wear low cut tops?

*sigh*

...because you like the clothes....and he won't buy it.

And the battle continues...18 year age gap there as well...

 

Are low cut shirts worth more than the father in the relationship?

[disowned_angel]

Rarther than just giving into him, it makes more sense to me to come up with a solution that will make us both satisfied, other than one happy and one not.

Relationships are about compramise, not giving in completely and making yourself unhappy, or there's no point.

[Darkness_Falls]

I feel for you so much over this, I really do! I just want to go up to your man and shake some sense into him and tell him that he needs to get some help for his insecurities. He has a beautiful girl on his arm who is obviously a wonderful caring and generous person as well. He should be feeling proud and wanting to show you off to the world!

 

I understand that it isn't exactly easy to cover a big chest either, I wear some tops to work and some of my cleavage is visible. I don't think it's really meant to be but because my chest is quite big, it just happens! It's too warm to wear polonecks to cover myself up so I just say to hell with it. I wear what I want to because I feel comfortable.

 

I went through years of trying to "fit in" with others, trying to look like all my friends. I completely lost my identity. Then I left home and went to university and finally I had control. And I found myself, found who I was. The goth in me had been hiding away for so long because I let others dictate what I should wear and what I should do. Even today, it's still a challenge. Friends don't get my style and question why I have big tattoos and say I will regret them etc. I ignore what they say, because I have heard it time and time again and I just don't care nowadays!

 

About your sex drive, I think I know what may be wrong with it. You don't quite feel for your man like you used to. His petty comments and remarks have made you dislike him. Maybe you still love him but I think you are starting to dislike him for the things he says to you. And this will make you desire him less. I understand this because I have a couple of exes who I started to dislike as I got to know more about them, found out they were compulsive liars or emotionally abusive, thereforeeee my desire for them went right down. I am with a great guy now who is so supportive through all my issues, and I desire him so much!

 

I think you guys could benefit from counselling, either individual or together. Do you think you could do that?

[Excalibur]

But you only know if you're in a relatinship where comproise is possible - if in dating compromise was required and it was negotiated and upheld by both parties by personal requirement.

 

Nobody with common sense would have ever thought they'd have been able to get Hitler to compromise - they woudln't have gotten into affiliation with him get negotation and compromise - but to do things on his term to secure the affiliation.

[Lana0120]

There's a fine line between compromise and bending over backwards to please someone else at the expense of your own personality. I think it's fair enough to effect some kind of compromise, e.g. every so often when you go out wear something you know that he likes. On a day-to-day basis, however, you should be dressing in a way that makes you feel happy and comfortable. If you keep letting him dictate to you how to dress it will only make you feel miserable and eventually, perhaps even resentful. I think you should sit him down, tell him that he had no problems with the way that you dressed when you met, and that how you dress is part and parcel of who you are. You don't dress the way you do to gain male attention, you do it because it makes you feel happy. Try and make him understand how you feel and don't back down.

[Excalibur]

The distance between compromise and concession is the distance between California and New York. Compromise is CA to Colorado.....concession is CA to NY.

 

There's no fine lien - there's a huge distance but if you keep going the distance you don't see it as anything at all.

[Enigmatika]

Relationships are about compramise, not giving in completely and making yourself unhappy, or there's no point.

True.

About your sex drive, I think I know what may be wrong with it. You don't quite feel for your man like you used to. His petty comments and remarks have made you dislike him. Maybe you still love him but I think you are starting to dislike him for the things he says to you. And this will make you desire him less.

Eats away in the back ground.

 

With the age gap there, I am sure he feels that he "knows" sooo much more than you about life in general...and it can be quite the irritation. yeah...he knows a bit...but only from his own point of view

I think you guys could benefit from counselling, either individual or together.

A good idea.

 

Some things you can compromise on, and others NOT. I can see his point re: less revealing clothing. AS you have already compromised on this point...he should perhaps take a step back and recognize that. If NOT, then wear the sexiest tops that show off your assets and when he makes stupid comments, SMILE and agree with him.

 

That WAS after all, how you met him wasn't it? he was doing some peeking out the side of the eye

 

This whole charade is based on HIS insecurities and self image. or perhaps on his own proclivity for staring at women's chests...?

 

lol...next time he makes a dumb comment, tell him he sounds eerily reminiscent of Josef Fritzl and his justifications for what he did to his daughter....watch his reaction.

[disowned_angel]

I have tried telling him that this is how I've always dressed and he didin't have a problem with it when we were friends. It just frustrates me when he keeps coming back with ...you weren't my girlfriend then, and I thought you gained some self respect when you got with me.

I HAVE self respect which is exactly why I would like to make my own decisions.

 

If it comes up again, which it probably will soon because he's always having digs about it, I'll tell him that I want couple therapy because I've said everthing I possibally can to him and it's got me nowhere.

[Excalibur]

when people are friends "who you are doesn't reflect on me" - the decision to be friends reflects, but there is less of an implication that you are that much alike, and quite often, it is the differences in friendship that solidfy the friendship, not the similarities.

 

In cohabitational and intertwined relationships, it's more important that you share standards, values, perceptions of life and how it works, life goals, and self-requirement - your decision to align this completely does reflect on your partner as being similar in the fundamental ways.

 

Parents that are very controlling into the adult lives of thier children, are using this same perception. Who you are, what you do, how you dress, what you accomplish, how you conduct your life - reflects on me because you are my child and I do or do not want people to think I taught you that thinking/acting/believing/feeilng the way that you do is acceptable.