Nonchalance is Your Friend

[OrangeMoon]

I had my grandmother, 80 years old, on the phone...i told her that my ex and i had broken up..and that i had been sad...and that i just did not have much luck in love i guess..

 

She said: "dont ever say that...you just love to deeply. Stop doing that. When your love is like the full 100% or more...never give all of that..give 60%. When you love or give too much...no matter how good you are...you will always fail. Find a way to show 60% when your heart says ...100...and it will all change"

 

I love my grandmother to death....maybe there is some true wisdom there reading this thread.

[coloradio]

Crap, can you give me a few examples of how you went about nonchalance? Because I can see where you are coming from. In my relationship, there were times where I just acted like a didn't give a damn, and she instantly turned around.

 

But, what I'm afraid of, is if she brings up a topic that makes her angry or something she sees wrong with the relationship and all you do is make a comical joke about it, wouldn't she see that as you not caring about the relationship and that you never want to take things seriously?

[CrapAtNC]

I'm bumping this thread again, as nonchalance has really worked for me.

 

coloradio, them getting angry is a test; if you joke about something they want to argue about, comically dismiss it, and guide them onto a more fun topic. The result will be the opposite of what you expect: they will find that incredibly attractive--they want to be guided toward a more fun and relaxed relationship too, after all.

 

There are many reasons why nonchalance brings you what you want. Confidence is always attractive. Being lots of fun is too. But I think one of the most important reasons is that you're breaking a stale, destructive pattern, and that's something that your ex is probably very much drawn to, like a window opened on a stifling hot day or a fun new activity to add to a tired routine.

 

I am happier now than I have ever been, and it's simply because I accept the things I was fighting before and focus on bringing a smile to every interaction I have instead of staying in that rut called misery.

 

When my ex, who isn't really in contact much these days, displays her destructive old behaviours, I just laugh them off quickly and act as though she'd made a cute joke. I don't let anything get to me. We do choose how we react, after all--it's not what happens to us that makes us happy or sad; it's how we react to it, how we choose to let it effect us. She loves it. She reacts to that beautifully, and the old pattern is broken.

 

In the past, I would jump right into a new relationship, as though I was scared I had to make the best of it before the magic wore off and she would leave me or not get involved with me anyway. Bleugh! Not attractive, not healthy, and not who I want to be.

 

After it seemed completely over with the ex I was trying to get back with, I moved on. I decided enough was enough and I wasn't going to let unrequited love and desperation spoil my day any more. I relaxed. I became nonchalant.

 

And something incredible happened. I attracted the attention of someone I have long admired and lusted after, someone quite famous where I'm from. She chased me, and I acted nonchalant but flirty. She could not understand why I wasn't jumping at the chance to take her up on her invitations, and that turned her on. We hooked up, and even hit the front page of the gossip mags. I had a fantastic time--until I threw myself into the relationship; by not being the carefree person she fell in love with, I lost much of my attraction. And that's OK. I had a great few months, loved the intense affection, fun, and passion that we enjoyed, and immediately moved on, learning much from the experience that only makes my future relatinships brighter.

 

And now I find myself staving off many other advances, some coming from some very beautiful women. I'm nonchalant again. It's fun for me and exciting for them.

 

I'm happy that my codependent past is over, and I know that being more carefree, happy-go-lucky, unfazed, positive, and self-respectful, will make me and my future partner much happier and much more solid than had I remained stuck in my old ways.

 

You are still dwelling on something negative in your life. You are still fighting something that you cannot change until you let it go. You have been putting yourself through hell and that's not good for you or any hope you may have of happiness either now or in the immediate future. Let it go. Stop chasing away what you want.

 

Just stop, smell the roses, appreciate the day, and care not what happens right now nor what anyone is doing. It only hurts if you let it. Be nonchalant. Break the pattern. See the good in your life and that's what your life will be. And then see how much more attractive you are to everyone around you, including your ex. You may or may not get that person back by changing your demeanour, but you will get a happier relationship next time around.

 

Know you'll be tested and picture how you will breeze that test, because you will, and they will notice. Have fun with it.

 

Envisioning your happiness and success,

 

 

 

Crap

[mikeca]

I see alot of myself in this thread, Ive thought to love someone I must show it and make it special all the time. I've done everything, from small day-to-day notes, up to the big surprise picnics and trips. It was only until the last ex that I started to wonder if I am giving too much of myself at-least to soon, now I'm starting to wonder if I could only give some of my love, it just doesn't seem right that I would have to change how I express my love to be with someone; shouldn't my partner except me for all that I am? I may use some of this information down the road but right now I have a hard time seeing myself restricting how I express my feelings. I find myself to be an emotional guy and have learned to trust what those emotions tell me most of the time.

 

Its almost sad as a people where we cannot truly give 100% love to our partners, and that is what confuses me the most. I'm not for the idea of holding back how we feel even if it creates a vacuum that they feel the need to fill. I don't like most of the game playing that goes on, and the mini power struggles of the 1up/1down theories, in my opinion it creates a lot of unnecessary confusion within a relationship.

 

I do agree about being nonchalant regarding an ex, I did this to a tee a few years ago and it created a situation for us to give it another chance. There is no need beyond the initial breakup to express how you feel, they know where you stand and the constant reminders and tidbits of communication wont do much to change their mind or else you would've done it before the breakup.

[CrapAtNC]

Consider this: the people who have the most fearful, badly behaved, aggressive, or just downright pain-in-the-ass dogs are the ones who insist on giving 100 percent love. But dogs need more than just love to feel happy, secure, and balanced. They need exercise and discipline too. People who give their dogs nothing but kindness, love and affection are giving their companion animal far less than someone who knows how to give the right kind and right amount of love.

 

I see me in your post--or, rather, the old me. I, too, wanted my relationships to be nothing more than love, fun, and affection, and that's what I put in. But that was selfish. That wasn't attractive to my ex, and such weak, needy behaviour certainly didn't make her feel secure.

 

If you truly love someone, give them the kind of relationship they need, not the one you feel is ideal to give nor the one they might say they want (so many women would describe the old me as their 'ideal' but instead would go for the guy who felt good about himself, which in turn made her feel more valuable and desirable, which is really what we all want).

 

Give everything too easily, and it won't be appreciated, devalues you, and chases people away; give little by little, add more excitement to the relationship and value to who you are, and you create a more dynamic, more attractive, more long-lasting and fulfilling partnership.

 

Giving less actually makes them feel they're getting much more. Do it for both of you.

[Crazyaboutdogs]

I disagree with this. People should give all their love and not withold in a relationship. This really comes down to the argument of the so-called "nice guy" who really isn't a nice guy, often just passive aggressive under the surface...they are nice not because they are actually nice but because they think it is their ticket to getting the girl. So their niceness comes off as being a patsy on the surface but yet they are resentful under the surface and it comes out in passive aggressive ways. Also, many so-called nice guys act like doormats, do not stand up for themselves, do not give opinions and just follow the woman around like a puppydog. That's where it becomes unattractive. However, what you describe is the bad boy the one who plays games...sure, dysfunctional women are attracted to that but emotionally healthy women who have self-esteem want a man who has a healthy balance..who knows when to take charge, knows when it is best for the woman to take charge, knows how to be kind, caring and thoughtful without acting like a puppydog and without playing push-pull, witholding games. You went out with a famous person...do you really think it was neediness that ended it..I doubt it..famous people go through partners like underwear..they get bored easily and are no to the next conquest...she would have dumped you anyway in short order because that's just the nature of celebrity.

[CrapAtNC]

Indeed, it would be nice if that was how relationship dynamics worked.

 

If you stick to that belief, you will be disappointed - and I suspect that is what you get out of relationships: disappointment. Giving, giving, giving is selfish manipulation, and it only brings displeasure to the giver when the needy giving isn't returned in kind. You need to change.

 

And, I have to say this, CAD, you haven't changed at all in the year I've been away. Your generalized assumptions about my ex are incredibly off-target.

 

How many exciting relationships have you had recently, with your approach to the dating game? How happy do you think you will be when you find a guy to take all that you give? Why are you trying to buy affection? Men are attracted to self-confidence much more than manipulative neediness disguised as giving.

 

How old do you want to be before you try enjoying a different kind of relationship--one that doesn't have to cater to your lofty, unrealistic ideals?

 

The right kind of giving is what bonds; the wrong kind will break a relationship every time.

 

But I wish you luck!

[Crazyaboutdogs]

I do not buy affection..my nature is indeed giving..that is just who I am..no pretenses, just my nature...I am of the Myers Briggs personality type INFJ and that is a characteristic trait. I resent when people abuse my kindness and that is when I back off. You are right, I haven't had much success in relationships because of that..but would I change myself to be a game playing jerk...nope...I would rather be alone than to lower myself to that level and be something I am not. So I will leave it to the game players to flit in and out of relationships..get married, divorced, remarried, re-divorced, have multiple live-ins, bang tons of people...many of whom are not that happy anyway...but I chose to live single rather than be a selfish game player.

[CrapAtNC]

Ah, and there lies the rub: "I refuse to be selfish and instead demand to give the kind of affection that others don't want."

 

What if they want you to show a little less neediness, CAD? What if they want you to show a little more confidence in your self worth and hold a little back for them to tease out? Is it selfishness then?

[Crazyaboutdogs]

Ah, and there lies the rub: "I refuse to be selfish and instead demand to give the kind of affection that others don't want."

 

What if they want you to show a little less neediness, CAD? What if they want you to show a little more confidence in your self worth and hold a little back for them to tease out? Is it selfishness then?

 

There is a HUGE difference between showing caring/compassion/interest and being needy. Sadly what I have noticed in my experience is that game players are very insecure so their perception of the world is that showing caring/compassion/interest is the same as being needy. My ex was like that...one time my microwave oven was on the fritz and he started talking about it being unsafe and started saying something like "I am concerned..." but he quickly changed the word "concerned" to the word "wondering"..as if being "concerned" was such a huge deal that would make him look needy. I wouldn't have thought twice about the word, as being concerned about people comes naturally to me, not out of neediness but out of general concern for the well-being of others. My ex didn't want my affection so I withdrew it...he embarked on a marriage of convenience to portray the "married" man to his community which was fitting for his high profile position. He married a woman who was also lacking in compassion. Am I sorry, no...being with someone who is insecure and lacks compassion and sees marriage as strictly an image-building exercise is not the kind of man for me. I am not interested in having to "tease" something out of man or having them "tease" it out of me...people who do that kind of crap just turn me off..I find nothing attractive in people who play games.

[CrapAtNC]

So, anybody who learns what behaviours harm their relationships and make an effort to change accordingly is a game player? Anyone who is confident is unfeeling?

 

CAD, you dismiss much. Your posts are all about condemning the man. Are you sure the problem isn't a little closer to home?

 

If we simply blame everyone else for what's wrong in our life, we will always be a victim. Take responsibility for that which irks you, then you can control it, and finally overcome it.

[SadAndDepresse]

Being a needy guy myself and thus the reason for the "break" as she is confused and unsure of what she wants would my best option to keep LC with her and act nonchalant or should I go NC like everyone else is suggesting to me? *this being if my goal is to reconcile with her*

[Crazyaboutdogs]

So, anybody who learns what behaviours harm their relationships and make an effort to change accordingly is a game player? Anyone who is confident is unfeeling?

 

CAD, you dismiss much. Your posts are all about condemning the man. Are you sure the problem isn't a little closer to home?

 

If we simply blame everyone else for what's wrong in our life, we will always be a victim. Take responsibility for that which irks you, then you can control it, and finally overcome it.

 

I guess you and I just have different views about what is good and what is bad for a relationship.

[CrapAtNC]

Being a needy guy myself and thus the reason for the "break" as she is confused and unsure of what she wants would my best option to keep LC with her and act nonchalant or should I go NC like everyone else is suggesting to me? *this being if my goal is to reconcile with her*

 

Do what you can do. If you can't go NC, then don't even try. LC is great if you only respond to her attempts at contact rather than keeping making little attempts yourself.

 

Nonchalance works whether you're LC, NC, or AC/DC, because you're no longer letting a situation or events affect you in a bad way, and that makes you accept the situation, which makes you stop trying and showing desperation . . . which makes you far more attractive.

 

If you were needy, as you say you were, then being more nonchalant (and meaning it) will be a huge pleasant surprise to her. And you need to initiate no contact at all if you want to back that up. Leave her be. Take a break from it. Read this:

[CrapAtNC]

I guess you and I just have different views about what is good and what is bad for a relationship.

 

Amen! Indeed we do.

[SighSob]

Hey CrapAtNC, nice to see you back. Loved your thread ("Reasons to remain NC") back then...

[CrapAtNC]

Hey, thanks, SighSob. Hope it helped you. It certainly helped me.

 

You need a sunnier username!

[DaveTrump]

I definitely feel this OP is about protecting yourself from getting hurt and keeping a level head to avoid any arguments and so on. Not giving too much of yourself away and being one-up in the relationship dynamic...However, although it's a positive step it is so blatantly contrived that it is almost like going backward in someones development as a grown up imho.

 

I mean, if we have a relationship where we were too codependent, then we recognise that fact after, and become stronger people with slightly new outlook on future relationships. This and all other aspects of experience make us who we are. So simply learning a mind technique from a book falls short of what wisdom we deserve on our true lives journey, but then again, there is a lesson to be learnt from reading self help books too!

[SighSob]

Hey, thanks, SighSob. Hope it helped you. It certainly helped me.

 

You need a sunnier username!

 

You bet I do! But it kind of gives an idea of how crushed I was back when I joined these boards...

[eleniebby]

I love this thread. It makes me think and you're right about alot of things Crap, and your advice is amazing. One question, is it ever to late to be nonchalent? Perhaps you've made constant mistakes pushing your ex away showing them how much you care. Is there still a possibility nonchalance can work wonders in a situation like this?

[CrapAtNC]

eleneiebby, it's never too late. You wouldn't believe the number and depths of the mistakes I made with my ex and just how badly she wanted nothing to do with me before I changed my attitude.

 

DaveTrump, I'm not sure that maintaining a healthy, upbeat attitude and avoiding destructive patterns should be labeled a contrived mind technique. But then, what do I care?

[DaveTrump]

eleneiebby, it's never too late. You wouldn't believe the number and depths of the mistakes I made with my ex and just how badly she wanted nothing to do with me before I changed my attitude.

 

DaveTrump, I'm not sure that maintaining a healthy, upbeat attitude and avoiding destructive patterns should be labeled a contrived mind technique. But then, what do I care?

 

Well, to not care or as you say ACT like you don't care is just weird. If acting like that makes you happier albeit artificially, then good for you.

 

I would say just get real, be yourself and live and learn the real way.

[CrapAtNC]

Well, the first step to becoming what you want to be is behaving that way. Want to be more confident? Then hold your head high and put your shoulders back. Want to be happier? Then smile. Want to have more relaxed, easier relationships? Then let the annoying stuff slide.

[DaveTrump]

Well, the first step to becoming what you want to be is behaving that way. Want to be more confident? Then hold your head high and put your shoulders back. Want to be happier? Then smile. Want to have more relaxed, easier relationships? Then let the annoying stuff slide.

 

fair comment

[bikerboi]

eleneiebby, it's never too late. You wouldn't believe the number and depths of the mistakes I made with my ex and just how badly she wanted nothing to do with me before I changed my attitude.

 

DaveTrump, I'm not sure that maintaining a healthy, upbeat attitude and avoiding destructive patterns should be labeled a contrived mind technique. But then, what do I care?

 

Hi All, you said its never too late, why do you say that and what sort of things did you do and how did you change?